Starter engages, not spinning the engine!

[wantahemi]

Hello,

Ok brain is officially numb!

69 Roadrunner 440-6 Barrel, auto.

So I started my car a few weeks ago. The starter sounded like it stuck to the flywheel and made some noise. Pulled car on lift and found that starter did indeed get stuck in the engage position. Popped it loose with a small pry bar, tried to start it again. Just a loud thunk at starter relay.

So I pulled the Mopar performance starter and promptly dropped and busted an ear off it. (Awesome, it was a year old). Anyway, no one had one so I ordered a factory 200 lb unit from Napa. Hooked it up and same thing. Just a thunk. I looked in flywheel inspection area and can see the gears trying to engage, but no spin. Tried it on a bench, spins and loads fine.

Anyway, finally got my 440 Source mini starter tonight, installed it and it does the same thing.
So I think we can rule out a starter. I had a NOS starter relay and installed that. No change.

Last week I charged the Mopar Re Pop Battery and load tested it. Barely went down at all. It was at 12.6 volts static, dropped to 12.4 under load. Battery held headlights for quite some time no issues and without charging.

Motor spins with a breaker bar, both directions. Typical compression from what I can tell, you have to pull on it for sure. Motor is a 440 stroked to 512 with all 440 Source lower end (pistons, crank, flywheel, balancer, rods etc). Motor has 3000 miles since rebuild

I also checked the bulkhead connector and no issues there. Pulled apart the ignition switch and all looks good with regards to connections.

Anyway, turn key, starter engages and flywheel doesn't spin. Battery cables are new and I have a headache. I even hooked a set of jumper cables from the frame to the bell housing To make sure I had grounding.

Last year I did the MAD electronics upgrades to solve a dying in flight issue but since then absolutely no other electrical issues until now.

Any help appreciated. I think I have looked at this way too long and I want my lift back!

 

[Fran Blacker]

Check pos and neg cables, In other threads guys chasing their tail only to find a cable problem. If starter engages should run .

 

[wantahemi]

I'm pulling them off tomorrow. They are literally a year or less old but re pop stuff is aggravating. Starter pushes out and just sticks in flywheel. Doesn't turn the engine. Frustrating

 

[Glenwood]

control circuit sounds ok, but seems like the starter is not getting enough voltage to turn.
got to do thorough checks of the battery, cables and connections to the block and starter motor. New cables can be faulty. Check if there's a large voltage drop at the motor when you try to start.

 

[PP1RT]

Check ground cable to the block.

 

[dieseldazzle]

Use jumper cables to jump the ground over. Bet you have a shitty ground or bad hot connection somewheres

 

[Yatzee]

Hello,

Ok brain is officially numb!

69 Roadrunner 440-6 Barrel, auto.

So I started my car a few weeks ago. The starter sounded like it stuck to the flywheel and made some noise. Pulled car on lift and found that starter did indeed get stuck in the engage position. Popped it loose with a small pry bar, tried to start it again. Just a loud thunk at starter relay.

So I pulled the Mopar performance starter and promptly dropped and busted an ear off it. (Awesome, it was a year old). Anyway, no one had one so I ordered a factory 200 lb unit from Napa. Hooked it up and same thing. Just a thunk. I looked in flywheel inspection area and can see the gears trying to engage, but no spin. Tried it on a bench, spins and loads fine.

Anyway, finally got my 440 Source mini starter tonight, installed it and it does the same thing.
So I think we can rule out a starter. I had a NOS starter relay and installed that. No change.

Last week I charged the Mopar Re Pop Battery and load tested it. Barely went down at all. It was at 12.6 volts static, dropped to 12.4 under load. Battery held headlights for quite some time no issues and without charging.

Motor spins with a breaker bar, both directions. Typical compression from what I can tell, you have to pull on it for sure. Motor is a 440 stroked to 512 with all 440 Source lower end (pistons, crank, flywheel, balancer, rods etc). Motor has 3000 miles since rebuild

I also checked the bulkhead connector and no issues there. Pulled apart the ignition switch and all looks good with regards to connections.

Anyway, turn key, starter engages and flywheel doesn't spin. Battery cables are new and I have a headache. I even hooked a set of jumper cables from the frame to the bell housing To make sure I had grounding.

Last year I did the MAD electronics upgrades to solve a dying in flight issue but since then absolutely no other electrical issues until now.

Any help appreciated. I think I have looked at this way too long and I want my lift back!

Well damn! You can change cables,battery, install extra grounds but I bet the issue is under the cover of the square solenoid switch on the top of the mini starter. You probably turned the small bolt that the starter solenoid wire ( on top the starter ) goes to and broke it internally. Happened to me twice. Take the cover off and have a "look see". If it's broken you can solder an overlap piece of wire to join the break.

 

[RT K_line]

Can you turn the engine with a socket on the crank bolt. I hate to be a pessimist but if the battery is charged and in good shape then it points to a mechanical problem. Changing the starters didn't change anything.

 

[PP1RT]

He said he turned the motor over with a breaker bar and same result with 3 different starters. Battery sounds like it tested good but that doesnt rule it out completely.
Use a jumper cables from the block over to the neg. battery terminal.

 

[wantahemi]

As usual, the replies on here are all great advice. I've got to drop my son off at college today but once I get done with that evolution, I will investigate the cables and ground. This is surely on electrical gremlin getting evicted today.

Thanks to everyone, I'll update what I find later.

Al

 

[PlainfieldCharger]

I have seen this before. I would have to guess the engine ground wire is either bad or there is a poor connection, paint, rust preventing a solid ground. The other devices don't need the amps....

 

[wantahemi]

Yeah I think after tonight I'll be an expert in grounding. I'm all funned out.

 

[Glenwood]

the thing with dc motors is they're pretty simple. A good power and ground connection makes them work if there's no mechanical binding, as long as the motor brushes are good as well as the battery. A battery with a bad cell can seem good until the a significant load is applied like the starter, then the voltage drops too low for the starter to turn. Your load test should have caught that though.

 

[wantahemi]

Yeah load test on battery is good. Got to be a bad re pop cable or a ground. Time will tell tonight

 

[440+6]

Sounds like you are getting power to the solenoid on the starter, but no power from the main positive cable.

 

[Shorthorse]

Does the starter gear retract easily when the key is released or does the gear appear to jam on the flywheel?

 

[wantahemi]

Jams to flywheel

 

[Fran Blacker]

What ever you do fix that first.
Had ignition switch stick in start position and as it started and tapped the gas and blew the starter to hell.

 

[Shorthorse]

Jams to flywheel

Different starters, same issue - starter gear jams into the flywheel and won't release as you stated, "Pulled car on lift and found that starter did indeed get stuck in the engage position. Popped it loose with a small pry bar". I don't think this is an electrical issue. Somewhere there is an alignment issue between the starter, the flywheel and/or the bellhousing.
I've never had that issue so I can't be much help but I'm sure others can weigh in.

 

[oldbee]

Going w/shorthorse- old chevys had shims between starter& block, noisy when wrong& could jam teeth too deep in flywheel&stick.