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Clutch preference...

Grady Cain

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I am in need of a new clutch set-up for my A12. The engine is mildly built - nothing crazy. It will be a driver but I will want something that can take a beating every once in a while. Any recommendations/suggestions? What do you use or have had good luck with? Thank you...
 
Never go with a rebuilt unit. Borg and Beck is the style of pressure plate Mopar used. Pedal pressure can get stiff if you get carried away with plate load. Diaphragm units can be had through the aftermarket supplies i.e. McCleod, Hays, Ram, Zoom and some others. Diaphragm units have softer pedal pressure for the same plate load and can be retro fitted to our cars BUT you need to get the proper throw out bearing to match as its a different height than the one for the Borg and Beck. ALWAYS get the flywheel surfaced when you do a fresh clutch and replace the pilot bushing in the end of the crank too. You might be best to talk to one of the manufactures tech lines to come up with the best combo for what your requirements are. Another thing too. If you get happy with a higher plate load on the pressure plate, you will need to reinforce the clutch linkage parts, cross shaft etc as they can bend and deflect under heavier loads.
 
Diaphragm units have softer pedal pressure for the same plate load and can be retro fitted to our cars BUT you need to get the proper throw out bearing to match as its a different height than the one for the Borg and Beck.
Not to hijack this thread, but I have never heard that the throw out bearings were different between B&B and the diaphragm style. I am about to order a Center Force dual friction to replace a Borg & Beck that has about 1000 miles on it. Was planning on using the existing throw out bearing. Are you saying it will not work?
 
I hate diaphragm clutches! They don't feel the same during the clutch pedal travel and you may have the throw-out bearing issue mentioned above. Plus only the higher end diaphragm clutch plates have the proper counterweights to avoid having the clutch pedal freeze to the floor during high rpm shifts. Hey, it's a Chevy clutch.

I'm also a fan of using organic material clutch discs in near stock configuration regardless of the pressure plate you chose IF the car is going to be driven mainly on the street. The engagement is much smoother than some of the exotic disc materials out there and the softer material is less prone to chatter, IMO.

In your "mild" combination, I believe you'd be fine with the stock A12 clutch.
 
Yes the bearing height is different between the two units. And if you add the Long style pressure plate, 3 finger unit that was primarily on Fords, you can have 3 different heights. Reason being that the pp units are different heights at the fingers, especially when installed. And on the diaphragm units, you had flat diaphragm and raised diaphragm which added two more bearing units. The aftermarket clutches may eliminate some of the t/o bearing possibilities which is why you will want to get information from the clutch companies if you decide to go with other than Borg and Beck style on the pp to make sure the disc, pp & t/o bearing match up so you don't end up chasing your tail with clutch issues. You don't want to piece it together with a bearing from the parts store, a disc from the dealer and a pp from yet someone else. For a given plate pressure, the diaphragm is the softest at the pedal, then the borg being 2nd and the long being the stiffest.
 
I have two bent-finger McLeod diaphragm clutches, one in a Ford and another in a Chevy and they have both provided very good service, decent leg pressure and smooth.
 
I you go diaphragm, don't forget to take a picture of the pedal over center spring so you know how it goes back in.
 
I have a McLeod Borg & Beck in both my RR and Charger. The one in the RR has been great. The one in my Charger was a problem from day one. Initially when installed, it would make noise and actually start moving the car when the pedal was pushed to the floor. I called McLeod and they told me that the fingers were not adjusted correctly. I had to pay shipping, but they fixed that. Also resurfaced the flywheel again at this time. Babied the car for 500 miles at the end of that driving season and seemed to be ok. The next summer (last year) I got on it a lot more. Now what happens is after about 10 miles it will shudder, for lack of a better word, when taking off normal. The rear end bounces up and down when this is happening. It gets worse the longer the car is driven. No oil is leaking from my rear main either. So I am getting to the point of wanting to do something about it. I put a Center Force dual friction in my Duster last fall, and that is the reason I was thinking of converting to a CF in the Charger as long as everything will be apart. Maybe it is not the best idea though? I was going to keep my throwout bearing because it only has about 2000 miles on it and I don't think there is any problem with that. I was under the impression that all 18 spline to bearings were the same because all vendors only sell one and not different part #'s for B&B or a diaphragm style.
 
Thank you all for responding. I put a Center Force Stage 3 dual friction clutch in my plow truck and loved what it did for me as far as sheer grabbing power - no slip no matter what and very easy to drive on the street. I was thinking the same for my A12 - just wondering if anyone else out there uses this style. I am well versed in the technical aspects of replacing clutches, release bearings, pilot bearings/bushings and resurfacing flywheels. I have not yet driven my A12 (or my Challenger which is also needing a new clutch once the engine is done) so getting it right the first time is important. I appreciate everyone's input - thank you!
 
I you go diaphragm, don't forget to take a picture of the pedal over center spring so you know how it goes back in.
Use a Centerforce dual friction , which is a diaphram style , and eliminate the over center spring as per their recommendation. Only critisism I have ever heard is that the clutch pedal pushes down to easy ! ( this from a former Borg and Beck user) I have never heard of the CForce sticking the pedal to the floor. I have experienced that with other diaphram clutches. They also claim to increase holding power with a increase in RPM. I have one and absolutely think it is the best................................MO
 
Not to hijack this thread, but I have never heard that the throw out bearings were different between B&B and the diaphragm style. I am about to order a Center Force dual friction to replace a Borg & Beck that has about 1000 miles on it. Was planning on using the existing throw out bearing. Are you saying it will not work?
First time I have heard of that. Maybe that is why there is still plenty of free play when the clutch is properly adjusted. I put mine together with a Centerforce dual friction. Can't remember what throw out bearing I used. ............................MO
 
Diaphragm units have softer pedal pressure for the same plate load and can be retro fitted to our cars BUT you need to get the proper throw out bearing to match as its a different height than the one for the Borg and Beck.
Called Center Force today because I was curious about this statement about throw out bearings. They told me it would not be a problem using my not so old McLeod throw out bearing with a Center Force dual friction diaphragm pp. Absolutely no difference in them, they are all the same.
 
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