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PS Pump Fail

Larrry B.

Well-Known Member
Local time
3:17 PM
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Feb 20, 2011
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Location
California
On my way to work this morning and decided to drive the RR, halfway there and this happens.

1dT85uF.jpg


VI3hWVv.jpg

This is the second pump that's crapped out on me in less than 10 months.
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/brg-800311

I guess I can try to see if it can be rebuilt, but after the second one I think I want try something else.

Anybody have a recommendation for something that's a little more bulletproof?
 
is it the same problem occurring again or different. i would take it apart to see what failed.
and try local auto parts , they might have a local rebuilder that can see what went wrong , that sucks .
good luck
 
First time the fluid foamed through the cap. No leaks with the box, hoses or connections. This time it was the shaft / pulley clearly leaking.

Maybe it's belt size or to much tension?

I'll at least try to get it rebuilt or buy something new if necessary. At the same time I might get a new belt(s).
 
This is probably not your problem, but mine looked the same way. Fluid everywhere.
My cause was a hairline split on the return line. The split was right at the reservoir. A $4 expenditure at orielly solved the problem.
 
I see the pulley is far away from pump for belt clearance . Could that put stress on the pump shaft.
What's wrong is it leaking or no pressure ? Any way to mount pump further forward.
 
On my way to work this morning and decided to drive the RR, halfway there and this happens.

View attachment 609868

View attachment 609869
This is the second pump that's crapped out on me in less than 10 months.
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/brg-800311

I guess I can try to see if it can be rebuilt, but after the second one I think I want try something else.

Anybody have a recommendation for something that's a little more bulletproof?

So I'm looking at your pic and wondering if the pulley drifted outwards, the shaft drifted out or the shaft broke off internally. Was the pulley press fitted or is there a retaining nut on the end of the shaft? So if only the pulley drifted, it was a poor fit to the shaft provided it is a press fit. If the shaft broke, you have an alignment issue or the serpentine belt is too tight, side loading the shaft and causing fatigue. Serpentines are best run with a spring loaded tensioner and a bit more than 100 degrees wrap on the pulley. Less wrap requires more tension to prevent slippage. You can buy just the pump and keep the can. Like stated earlier, I'm not really sure what I am looking at but the pulley is way too far forward.
 
So I'm looking at your pic and wondering if the pulley drifted outwards, the shaft drifted out or the shaft broke off internally. Was the pulley press fitted or is there a retaining nut on the end of the shaft? So if only the pulley drifted, it was a poor fit to the shaft provided it is a press fit. If the shaft broke, you have an alignment issue or the serpentine belt is too tight, side loading the shaft and causing fatigue. Serpentines are best run with a spring loaded tensioner and a bit more than 100 degrees wrap on the pulley. Less wrap requires more tension to prevent slippage. You can buy just the pump and keep the can. Like stated earlier, I'm not really sure what I am looking at but the pulley is way too far forward.
It's so far out because of clearance issue with water pump belt. see in picture 2.
 
No, the pulley moved out from the pump further than installed. It's way to close to the fans. It's a keyway and not a press fit.

After two pumps I'm thinking it's to much tension, possibly.
 
Seems to be a small driven pulley. Do you think the pump may be spinning up too fast. Some but not all pumps used a large diameter pulley. Reducing the operating speed. If you have them measure the diameter of the old V belt
Pulleys then compare to
The serpentine pulleys.
 
Must be the camera angle because it looks close. Did the pump lock up?
Edit: Key way, how is it held on shaft if not pressed . I'm not up on the serpentine belts and pulleys.
 
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Seems to be a small driven pulley. Do you think the pump may be spinning up too fast. Some but not all pumps used a large diameter pulley. Reducing the operating speed. If you have them measure the diameter of the old V belt
Pulleys then compare to
The serpentine pulleys.

Thank you, that is something to consider. I switched from v-belts to serpentine (both March aluminum sets), had no issues with pulleys until now.


Must be the camera angle because it looks close. Did the pump lock up?

Yes, camera angle. I took this when I got home, didn't even know it came out that far until the day was over. Steering just got a lot harder and that's when I knew... Little bit of smoke but it was so far forward it it just leaked over everything but the headers. Thankfully it didn't pop out while I was driving, yeesh...
 
The nut came loose on your Saginaw pump. Key is probably missing. So get a key, new nut and use some blue locktite. Also have the belt tension just so the belt deflects about 1/2 inch and you should be good to go.
 
Thanks all for the info, will post once I get it sorted out.
 
Too much belt tension, standard multi-vee belts do not work correctly without a spring tensioner. Two ways to solve this problem: Add a spring tensioner (probably very difficult with the room you have available, or buy a special version of multi-vee belt. https://ww2.gates.com/europe/brochure.cfm?brochure=7737&location_id=11381 . I used this belt type to add A/C to forklift when I worked for Cat in Houston... they really do stretch and prevent damage like what your photo shows. Lots of people try to use fixed tensioners but it is not the right way.
 
Too much belt tension, standard multi-vee belts do not work correctly without a spring tensioner. Two ways to solve this problem: Add a spring tensioner (probably very difficult with the room you have available, or buy a special version of multi-vee belt. https://ww2.gates.com/europe/brochure.cfm?brochure=7737&location_id=11381 . I used this belt type to add A/C to forklift when I worked for Cat in Houston... they really do stretch and prevent damage like what your photo shows. Lots of people try to use fixed tensioners but it is not the right way.

Thanks for the info I'll check it out. Do you know where to buy the Micro V Stretch Fit?

Nut and key were still in place, the shaft came out of the pump and the seal is broken. After removing the pump I don't think it was to much tension (I could be wrong...).
I need to find another one, reading reviews on Summit's site it seems like this is a regular thing that enough people go through... PS pump fails.

Any recommendations would be welcome, thanks in advance.
 
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I sent photos directly to Borgeson after this happened. After removing the pump and pulley confirming the shaft came out and sending a copy of my receipt from Summit they're going to send out a replacement under warranty.

Always save those receipts...fingers crossed.
 
Finally had time today to replace the pump, very hot last two weeks and will get hotter this week so today was the day.

mfqi7eT.jpg


Jh1PQew.jpg


All seems ok and steering better than ever, let's see what happens when I take out and get up to freeway speeds(+)...
 
agreed

get some parking lot miles n highway miles on setup.

i ordered a rockauto pump with nut style pulley n v-belt for my setup. so far so good. will look for pics.


watermelon
 
30 - 45 mph drive around town was ok with some hard quick turns, freeway test will be the deciding factor. Last pump failed at 75(ish) mph, this week hopefully. Going into week 4 of 95°-100°(+) heat... I love my car but not when I'm sweating bullets with a potential failure.
 
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