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Time slip2+sec [email protected]*EDIT ordered wideband O2 system!

biomedtechguy

Accelerati Rapidus Maximus
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Obviously I need to do better in the first 60 feet.
This time slip was 2 years ago with a 3.54 ring and pinion gearset in my Dana 60.
I had just got my 315/35/17 Toyo Proxes TQ drag radials, and they worked WAY better than the T/A Radials I had.
I definitely need more track time! Other than being very busy with work, I had a problem with the top of the line Mancini pinion snubber I added, it bent on the first run I made, and on the 2nd run I had to remove it because it bent so badly it was rubbing on the pinion yoke.
I have a line lock that I need to install so I can clean the drag radials and impart some heat into them. I'm also considering getting one of these "clutch tamers" because it sounds like a great idea!
So far my best, most consistent launch technique is to ease out at about 1,500 RPMs and within a few feet stand on the throttle and go. That usually prevents wheel spin, even with the 4.10 ring and pinion gearset I have now, and with the 4.10 the RPMs climb faster. Still I know if I could hit the start at higher RPMs I could get a better 60 ft time.
I think my car should be running mid 12s, and you can see if I could cut my 60ft times from 2.2 to 1.8 that would get me into the 12s.
3 way adjustable Competition Engineering CEE-2730 rear shocks are new, and set to 50/50. I also just installed Viking 18 way double adjustable front shocks, but I haven't had any real time to play with them on the track.
I'm concerned that the factory leaf springs may be weak, because of the pinion snubber bending, I'm thinking the springs are really wrapping up. It's a real V-code Roadrunner, so it has the extra 1&1/2 leaf spring (or is it 1/2 of a leaf spring?) on the passenger side.
Eventually I'm installing a RMS StreetLynx or GERST triangulated rear suspension, and I am dead set on that. I know a lot of you are doing well with CalTracks and other leaf spring solutions, but I'm jumping in with both feet and going with one of those 2 setups.
In the meantime, what advice can y'all offer, and I appreciate all of your replies.
Here's the clutch tamer:
clutchslipper2.jpg

website: http://www.clutchtamer.com/
My timeslip:
Screenshot_20181111-131124_Cloud.jpg

EDIT: LOTS of great suggestions, I just ordered the Innovative Dual wideband O2 system! :bananadance:
https://www.forbbodiesonly.com/mopa...deband-o2-system.162123/page-4#post-911106260
 
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Go with the complete RR Cal Trac setup...Mono-Leaf Springs and Cal Trac Bars. If you have the money get Viking double Adjustable, if not just buy the Cal Trac 9 Way Adjustable RR Shocks. You have your front shocks covered just fine.
Get you line lock hooked up.
You will like the results.
The rear setups are considering look nice but, in my opinion, are NOT for real drag racing efforts.
 
The rear setups are considering look nice but, in my opinion, are NOT for real drag racing efforts.
Mike, I've read a lot of your posts and have :lowdown: great respect for your experience.
There are a couple of forum members running the RMS and really quick times (10s) and they swear by them.
I like the "more modern" design.
Would you elaborate some on the statement you made that I quoted please? I'm trying to understand.
Thanks
 
Well, at a glance, the 60' time is telling me that you have no traction at all. I get the idea of "easing out at 1500 rpm", but that is KILLING your quarter mile times. My gut instinct is to put in some hardened axles + slicks and add a CalTrac (or other) rear suspension setup on the car & leave the line at 3000-4000 rpm???

I've had a similar problem with pinion snubbers except mine is trying to pound a hole in my floorboard. fyi-there are some "Hemi" pinion snubber contact area reinforcements available (Scott Harms on moparts.com).
 
Thanks PB.
Yes, I wasn't happy about the pinion snubber beating the crap out of the sheetmetal, but since I bent the snubber on my first run, and on the 2nd run it had to be removed, well that was that.
A friend of mine ran the other (cheaper) Mancini pinion snubber back in the early 80s on his 383 4 speed 70 Roadrunner and never had any problems with it, but I don't think his tires hooked as well as my drag radials, and I go back to the possibility that the springs are weak?? and that is allowing them to flex too much?
@Mike Gaines I sure would like more details on what you wrote:
The rear setups are considering look nice but, in my opinion, are NOT for real drag racing efforts.
Or anyone else who can chime in.
Thanks guys. I need all the forum help I can get. I asked my friend to video my last trip to the track, and he couldn't even work the video camera on my phone.
Some people just don't care unless it's about them...
 
Have you been to the track with the car more than that one time?
If not, I wouldn’t make too many decisions based off one track outing.

If you have been more than once, is that 105mph about the norm for the car?
What’s the motor combo?
 
I regret stating it the way I did....that the StreetLynx and Gerst are not for real drag racing as I do not know enuf about them.
I would, though, think that regular ladder bars or regular 4 Link setup might work better than those two approaches....not sure.
 
A couple of guys who run the RMS have spoken highly of it, not only at the track (10 second 4,100 lb "behemoth" 71 Charger, Wookie? IIRC) and for cruising they say they are far superior to leaf springs. Thanks a lot Mike for getting back to me on that.
105mph about the norm for the car?
What’s the motor combo?
I would say 13.3-13.5 at 105-106 is the norm. Traction off the line and in 1st gear is a struggle, and that is where I need the most help. My 60 ft times suck.
Check my signature for details on my engine and car.
 
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without seeing your car at the track
or good video & sound
especially good quality hi-def &/or slow motion stuff
it's all speculation

sorry to say it, not trying to rain on your parade
(no offense intended)
just spit-balling here, what if's
BUT;
your manual trans, or ability to work it
(don't feel bad most people can't do a good time/ET with a man. trans)
your clutch or lack of adjustability, to make the car work correctly
(an auto with a decent tire & converter, is far easier to hook)
the ability to get it to hook properly, not shock the tires but still hook hard
use of the proper launch RPM's
&/or
your tires 'lack of traction' (to stiff -or short/no wrap- of sidewalls)
(wrong compound or too stiff, not enough sidewall, absorbing the shock of a man. trans etc.)
(just because you have drag radials,that doesn't mean they are any good)
or your cars 'lack of',
'cars ability for transferring the weight, properly to get said traction'
is harboring your ET's
but your speed indicates/shows 105-106mph
that's about the right/correct level for an ET in the low-mid 13's
a car with that HP should range

(even a better S/S spring intended for a manual trans would help)

a better tire & rear suspension, better adj. shocks,
should pick up quite a bit of wasted ET
after a bit of trial & error
go to a test & tune not a race day
get back to back to back time for comparisons, changes

Maybe as much a probably 0.4-0.5 (tenths) improvements, at current HP levels
your top speed doesn't indicate much more HP or much more gains
you need another appr. 200 - 300hp to get 120-130mph thru the traps
but the ET can be improved by the 60'-300' ft range for damn sure
a little improvement there makes for a better ET
1.60's @ 60' aren't out of the range at current levels, if it works correctly

1.20 -1.30's 60' times are way bigger HP levels
& the cars suspension all working much better
you can't get there with what you have now,
unless poss. the car was working perfectly
with no wasted motion & traction, good track & RAD (good air) etc.

MPH = HP
ET = is a total function of the car working properly & using it's HP efficiently
 
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I think the ClutchTamer is a great idea, and once dialed in should help by taking a major variable out of the equation, that being clutch slippage becoming consistent, allowing me to focus on traction, and if I get to the point of dead hooking (no tire spin) that is the ticket.
It's just getting to the point of no tire spin being the challenge, without having to ease off the line.
 
Thanks Budnicks. Given that my car is not stock, and seeing what stock B-body 440+6 cars ran "new" on 70 series polyglass tires, I should be in the high 12s, and would be if I had 1.8 sec or less 60 ft times.
My power shifting (no throttle lifting) is pretty good, so I think the 60 ft is where I can make the most improvements.
 
I think the ClutchTamer is a great idea, and once dialed in should help by taking a major variable out of the equation, that being clutch slippage becoming consistent, allowing me to focus on traction, and if I get to the point of dead hooking (no tire spin) that is the ticket.
It's just getting to the point of no tire spin being the challenge, without having to ease off the line.
dbl post
 
I think the ClutchTamer is a great idea, and once dialed in should help by taking a major variable out of the equation, that being clutch slippage becoming consistent, allowing me to focus on traction, and if I get to the point of dead hooking (no tire spin) that is the ticket.
It's just getting to the point of no tire spin being the challenge, without having to ease off the line.
you need to be able to leave at 3500rpm or more
with minimal tire spin/controllable or manageable wheel-speed

Dead hook isn't the answer either
it makes the car lurch & then bog or unload the tires afterwards
especially with a manual trans/clutch, without some sort of adj. clutch

it's managing tire spin/wheel-speed to a good or acceptable levels
so your engine doesn't pull down to hard
or spin the tires too much, to lose ET/traction wasted motion

if that makes any sense
 
you need to be able to leave at 3500rpm or more
with minimal tire spin/controllable or manageable wheel-speed

Dead hook isn't the answer either
it makes the car lurch & then bog or unload the tires afterwards
especially with a manual trans/clutch, without some sort of adj. clutch

it's managing tire spin/wheel-speed to a good or acceptable levels
so your engine doesn't pull down to hard
or spin the tires too much, to lose ET/traction wasted motion

if that makes any sense
It does make sense, and I've experienced it in a "much worse" case scenario. What I mean by that is when I was leaving the line by easing out just the first few feet in my Roadrunner with the 3.54 ring and pinion, and 6 bbl, it would still get up and go pretty well when I stood on the gas and that is WAY BETTER now since I installed the 4.10 ring and pinion gears. What I mean by "much worse" case scenario was my 89 Conquest TSi with the 2.4 L inline turbo 4 cylinder. Once I put the Nitto drag radials on it, they would stick-big time so the only thing left to keep the motor on boost was slipping the clutch, and that is really hard to do consistently! So I would either not launch as hard as I could because of excessive clutch slip, or what happened most often was letting the clutch all the way out too soon, which would cut the boost and the car fell on its face. At least the 440+6 has lots of torque, made better with the 4.10, but like I referenced twice, I think the Clutch Tamer may be the ideal solution! I am concerned about how badly it is going to wear my clutch, but at least it should be fairly consistent once I get it dialed in, and what the heck-if I have to upgrade my clutch disc setup or maybe just replace it more often, that is the cost of racing!
Right now I have a "street strip" McLeod disc (not puck) and a 3,*** pound diaphragm style pressure plate. I am definitely going to get a clutch tamer hydraulic pedal release speed controller and set it up to where it only slows the release in 1st gear, off the line. You can do that according to their website by using a drop out spacer, otherwise it would slow the full release every time I pushed the clutch in, and I want full engagement when I bang 2nd, 3rd, and 4th gears.
I think it's a great idea and hopefully won't smoke or glaze the clutch disc too much or too quickly.
 
I’d say with your set up you’re right where about where it should be. My 67, 440 .030 mopar .484 headers and iron heads ran mid 13’s all day.
 
Dead hook isn't the answer either
it makes the car lurch & then bog or unload the tires afterwards
especially with a manual trans/clutch, without some sort of adj. clutch

it's managing tire spin/wheel-speed to a good or acceptable levels
so your engine doesn't pull down to hard
or spin the tires too much, to lose ET/traction wasted motion

Generally, with a combo like is being discussed here...... leaving at the kind of rpm it would take to get the best 60’ possible...... and having it dead hook..... results in broken parts(unless you’re using a high dollar clutch that slips so the tires don’t have to).

As far as the clutch taming do-dad....... my prediction is, if you slow down the clutch application enough while leaving at a sufficiently high rpm to get a decent 60’ time, and not break parts....... using a clutch that isn’t really made to be slipped like that...... will result in a used up clutch in a pretty short amount of passes.

On the other hand, if you added another 100hp to the equation, and practiced launching reasonably consistently in the 1.90-2.0 range....... you could be in the bottom on the 12’s easily.

A few years ago I got to make some passes in a friends FAST car with a 493/6bbl/4 speed/4.10’s/bias ply re-pops.
My first time ever driving the car.
I’d walk it out easy, then roll into it smoothly......60’ times right around 2.0.
The best I got out of it was like 12.1@120.
The owner had been 11.50’s@122 on a different day.

I didn’t see if it was mentioned......is there an ET target you’re chasing?
 
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@PRHeads
What kind or better yet model # clutch (pressure plate too? I hope I could keep the one I have) would I need to hold up to once or twice a month making about 6 runs per trip (12/month) down the 1320?
My flywheel is a new billet steel flywheel from Brewers. 130 tooth, 10.5"
..is there an ET target you’re chasing?
High 12s, like 12.8
If I get my 60 ft times down to 1.8 or less, all other things staying the same, that would do it, although the rest of the trip may be a little quicker with a better start.
 
if you added another 100hp to the equation, and practiced launching reasonably consistently in the 1.90-2.0 range....... you could be in the bottom on the 12’s easily.
I am getting TrickFlow 240s for my next motor, and already got the parts list required to put them on my current motor, which would be a big improvement over the stock 452 heads on it now. My cam is a Purple Stripe and I and others suspect it is the 292°/.509 cam, so it would work nicely with the TF 240s. I am using CompCams hydraulic flat tappet lifters, 10° locks and CompCams springs and retainers which made a BIG improvement in the 5,000 to 6,200 RPM range. I shift out at about 5,800 and that usually means a 6,100 RPM point. My 440+6 pulls really hard to 6,200 according to the butt dyno, which I have to attribute to the cam, headers, and 6bbl, but once I think I have my Promax modded Holley carbs dialed in (they are running worse now than before I sent them to Promax, but I think it is debris in the carbs/metering block) I am taking my car to a local chassis dyno so I can find out what is REALLY going on power band wise.
Anyway the heads should give me a good bit of GO, and if the carbs work out better than before I had Promax mod them, I should be running faster.
 
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