• When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.

Interesting read.

diesel_lv

Well-Known Member
Local time
9:14 AM
Joined
Dec 17, 2018
Messages
1,930
Reaction score
2,401
Location
Arizona
https://flowkoolerwaterpumps.com/bl...oolant-need-more-time-in-the-radiator-to-cool
I bought a triple pass radiator to cool my 496 engine. Well at idle I'm good. But at highway speeds it gets 220+. It's closed loop, reservoir can, no air pockets, great airflow, flowkool water pump, robert shaw 180 and 160 thermostat, with and without shroud. Only thing I can think is the water stays in radiator longer due to triple pass radiator which caused it to stay in engine longer, gaining more heat. Does anyone here use a radiator that is no more than 2-1/2" thick core, 26" wide, either brass or aluminum, that cools off engine making a touch over 600hp in 115+ outside air temps?
 
I thought of a triple pass for my Belvedere, my situation is a little different. but here is what i have. the radiator is a 22" 3 row Champion (these are cheap but they seem to work, at least for me), i have a stock shroud and a deep flex fan. then i put a Spal pusher fan in front (didn't think that would work, but it does). in 100° weather with the A/C running is doesn't even get to 200°. I am running a 512, around 625hp. I don't worry about cooling...
 
I thought of a triple pass for my Belvedere, my situation is a little different. but here is what i have. the radiator is a 22" 3 row Champion (these are cheap but they seem to work, at least for me), i have a stock shroud and a deep flex fan. then i put a Spal pusher fan in front (didn't think that would work, but it does). in 100° weather with the A/C running is doesn't even get to 200°. I am running a 512, around 625hp. I don't worry about cooling...
Thank you. I'm thinking I need a single pass radiator to get fluid cooled and back to engine and fluid out of engine to radiator quickly. How are your temps around 60-70 mph? That's where I heat up.
 
With a lower temp thermostat, doesn t that open the t stat quicker, thus allowing a faster flow out of the radiator when the coolant needs MORE time in the rad to cool down. Now if your rad capacity was way oversized this would not be logical...where is my thinking incorrect on this...
 
With a lower temp thermostat, doesn t that open the t stat quicker, thus allowing a faster flow out of the radiator when the coolant needs MORE time in the rad to cool down. Now if your rad capacity was way oversized this would not be logical...where is my thinking incorrect on this...
Unless radiator "volume" is increased, more time in radiator means engine coolant stays longer in engine getting hotter. Per the article. Regardless of thermostat temp, it is airflow, air temp, coolant flow, radiator surface area determine engine temp at highway speed. So if you slow radiator flow, you slow coolant in engine flow. Now, if you increase the radiator core size to 30" wide and keep the flow the same, the coolant actually stays in radiator longer because it has more volume. But the flow out of the engine is normal because there's no restriction.
 
I read somewhere once that 4 core radiators are so thick they restrict airflow and therefore they do not cool as good/or better than a 3 core.
You may have restriction in that triple pass thing - I do not mess around with anything like that. The older style iron engines like water flow.
Can you borrow another known good radiator?
I like the look of the Cold Case and they are well priced.
 
I read somewhere once that 4 core radiators are so thick they restrict airflow and therefore they do not cool as good/or better than a 3 core.
You may have restriction in that triple pass thing - I do not mess around with anything like that. The older style iron engines like water flow.
Can you borrow another known good radiator?
I like the look of the Cold Case and they are well priced.
Borrow a radiator no dice, I'll have to buy one to see if it works. My garage is collecting lots of $500-600 wall art!!!
 
Thank you. I'm thinking I need a single pass radiator to get fluid cooled and back to engine and fluid out of engine to radiator quickly. How are your temps around 60-70 mph? That's where I heat up.
At highway speeds the temp stays around 185 ish or a bit less, that’s where my t-stat is. One thing I did have issue with, I had the A/C condenser and trans cooler in front of the radiator. I moved the trans cooler and went to the stack plate style, but the condenser was too far from the radiator. Anything in front of the radiator needs to be very close (1/8”), this allows the air to flow through properly. Otherwise the air will get turbulent and not flow through the radiator well.
 
At highway speeds the temp stays around 185 ish or a bit less, that’s where my t-stat is. One thing I did have issue with, I had the A/C condenser and trans cooler in front of the radiator. I moved the trans cooler and went to the stack plate style, but the condenser was too far from the radiator. Anything in front of the radiator needs to be very close (1/8”), this allows the air to flow through properly. Otherwise the air will get turbulent and not flow through the radiator well.
I've got stacked plate trans cooler and my condenser is a modern parallel condenser from vintage air. But it is sbout 1-1/2" away from radiator. However, I put a sheetmetal cowl across top of core support, and sheetmetal on both sides of grill opening funneling air to the radiator. Everything is metal duct taped around edges. No air can escape from that area. It has to go through the radiator.
 
Do you have electric fans? I am assuming you do.. if you do, when do they come on? if you are having issue at highway speeds it would seem that the air is being slowed down through the radiator. which style of fan do you have pullers or pushers? and what brand? stupid question are they wired for the correct direction? i would think at highway speeds, the water should flow through the radiator fine since the pump is pumping faster and it cools at idle. and i am assuming that you are not at 4000rpm on the highway. so, i am going towards air flow, can you post a couple pix of your setup?
 
https://flowkoolerwaterpumps.com/bl...oolant-need-more-time-in-the-radiator-to-cool
I bought a triple pass radiator to cool my 496 engine. Well at idle I'm good. But at highway speeds it gets 220+. It's closed loop, reservoir can, no air pockets, great airflow, flowkool water pump, robert shaw 180 and 160 thermostat, with and without shroud. Only thing I can think is the water stays in radiator longer due to triple pass radiator which caused it to stay in engine longer, gaining more heat. Does anyone here use a radiator that is no more than 2-1/2" thick core, 26" wide, either brass or aluminum, that cools off engine making a touch over 600hp in 115+ outside air temps?
Please explain the "triple pass" design. Does the coolant actually make 3 separate independent passes in the air stream or is the coolant flow thru three (3) tube configuration, top to bottom arrangement . Typically, a 3 pass heat exchanger the coolant would enter and exit on opposite ends.....I'm confused as to the configuration. Perhaps a link to the supplier...
BOB RENTON
 
Please explain the "triple pass" design. Does the coolant actually make 3 separate independent passes in the air stream or is the coolant flow thru three (3) tube configuration, top to bottom arrangement . Typically, a 3 pass heat exchanger the coolant would enter and exit on opposite ends.....I'm confused as to the configuration. Perhaps a link to the supplier...
BOB RENTON
There are baffles at top and bottom, dividing radiator into 3rd basically. Enters top passenger, goes down, then up the middle, then down driver's side and out. It's from US Radiator.
 
There are baffles at top and bottom, dividing radiator into 3rd basically. Enters top passenger, goes down, then up the middle, then down driver's side and out. It's from US Radiator.

Interesting concept....sounds like countercurrent flow not parallel flow. The only disadvantage would be higher liquid side pressure losses. I'll look up U.S. Radiator to see their offerings...
BOB RENTON
 
Are three row aluminum radiators better than two?

Posted on May 26, 2015 by Tom DeWitt

In the old days of copper and brass radiators this was true. More rows meant more surface area in contact with the fin and consequently a higher heat rejection. So a 3 row was better than a two row and so on.

When aluminum radiators came around the rules changed. Cooling engineers concluded that by lowering the fin height you could stack more layers of tubes. In addition, using wider tubes would increase the tube-to-fin contact area. The end result was a very high performance radiator with a huge savings in weight.

3row_large_2x_4ba97d70-e0e9-4f34-9c39-ecd15bb06ea6_large@2x.jpg



The U.S. standard for performance aluminum radiator tubes is a 1.0" wide tube and imported radiators have smaller 16mm (.62") tubes. In this case a 3-Row aluminum radiator would only have a total of 1.86" of tube-to-fin contact surface which is less than the two row core with 1" tubes. The online ads for these 3-Row aluminum radiators will indicate several features of the radiator design but they avoid the issue of the tube width. DeWitts radiator goes another step and offers a two row core with 1.25" tubes or (2.5") tube-to-fin contact and this would again exceed the performance of a 4-row imported core design. So, if you are researching your next purchase ask about the tube width. That will tell you a lot about the heat rejection and the origin of the product.








 
Something I've found on our cars is blocking off the the open space in front of the bottom of the radiator (gravel shield) makes a big difference when your moving.
 
Are three row aluminum radiators better than two?

Posted on May 26, 2015 by Tom DeWitt

In the old days of copper and brass radiators this was true. More rows meant more surface area in contact with the fin and consequently a higher heat rejection. So a 3 row was better than a two row and so on.

When aluminum radiators came around the rules changed. Cooling engineers concluded that by lowering the fin height you could stack more layers of tubes. In addition, using wider tubes would increase the tube-to-fin contact area. The end result was a very high performance radiator with a huge savings in weight.

View attachment 978968


The U.S. standard for performance aluminum radiator tubes is a 1.0" wide tube and imported radiators have smaller 16mm (.62") tubes. In this case a 3-Row aluminum radiator would only have a total of 1.86" of tube-to-fin contact surface which is less than the two row core with 1" tubes. The online ads for these 3-Row aluminum radiators will indicate several features of the radiator design but they avoid the issue of the tube width. DeWitts radiator goes another step and offers a two row core with 1.25" tubes or (2.5") tube-to-fin contact and this would again exceed the performance of a 4-row imported core design. So, if you are researching your next purchase ask about the tube width. That will tell you a lot about the heat rejection and the origin of the product.









Exactly. More rows do not equal more cooling. Two one inch tubes will cool better than three smaller tubes.

I've never heard of a triple bypass radiator though. Sounds interesting...
 
Something I've found on our cars is blocking off the the open space in front of the bottom of the radiator (gravel shield) makes a big difference when your moving.
I built a sheetmetal shroud that covers the entire top from core support to where the grill attaches. Put side shrouds from the edges of the grill opening to the radiator core opening and covered the the bottom opening You mentioned. The air cannot go anywhere but through the radiator.
 
Exactly. More rows do not equal more cooling. Two one inch tubes will cool better than three smaller tubes.

I've never heard of a triple bypass radiator though. Sounds interesting...
If you're willing to pay and can find a shop that does it, there are 3/4" flat/round brass tube brazed radiator cores. Tubes are flat so they touch each other doing away with the "tube gap" which reduces air pressure drop. A 3 row will have 2-1/4" surface area in a 2-1/4" core. A 2 row 1" aluminum will have 2" of surface area in a 2-1/4 core due to the 1/4" "tube gap" and have a higher air pressure drop the brass will weigh more, but has a much higher heat transfer rate that aluminum. And keeping air velocity also increases cooling. So in the same space, the brass will cool much better. The "round" in the flat/round is where the tube is brazed to the header.
 
Do you have electric fans? I am assuming you do.. if you do, when do they come on? if you are having issue at highway speeds it would seem that the air is being slowed down through the radiator. which style of fan do you have pullers or pushers? and what brand? stupid question are they wired for the correct direction? i would think at highway speeds, the water should flow through the radiator fine since the pump is pumping faster and it cools at idle. and i am assuming that you are not at 4000rpm on the highway. so, i am going towards air flow, can you post a couple pix of your setup?
Here's my set up. Hard to see due to space.
20200727_171732.jpg
20200727_171800.jpg
20200727_171823.jpg
20200727_171829.jpg
20200727_171811.jpg
 
I posted about having a Champion 4 core radiator which is really thick. They list the core at 2.75", which is the 3-core thickness. The 4-core "tank" width of 3.2" is closer to the core width. Anyhow, it cooled Ok until I put the A/C condenser in front of it. I think that blocked air flow at highway speeds, and the 10" FORD Contour fans could not pull the volume of air through to get the required cooling when the A/C was running.
I changed the radiator to a Griffin dual 1.25" core radiator (2.68" thick) and better cooling fans.
Since life is getting in the way of me getting the car back together, I haven't driven the car with the new setup, but it should work better?
 
Auto Transport Service
Back
Top