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No dash lights - how do I pull the cluster? 70 Charger...

Triplegreen500

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70 Charger 500, factory a/c car. I've got no gauge lights. Headlights work, all exterior lights work, all gauges work, just no gauge lights.

I've removed the screws from the cluster, I've lowered the column, and I can get the cluster about 2" out on the left (door) side, but the bottom right corner gets caught on the surround for the center a/c vents (under the radio). What's the trick? Do I have to reach behind and unplug before removal? I don't want to just start yanking on stuff...the gauges work (except the clock, surprise), just no lights at night. I want to get the cluster out so I can test the dimmer and the bulbs.
 
Have you rolled the dimmer switch back and forth and watched for instrument lights??

Do you have tail lights??? Dash and tail lights are on the same fuse.
 
You have to reach up and unhook the speedo cables clip... or undo it from the transmission so you can pull it in place.
 
Thank you, that was what I needed! (that, and for my back spasms to stop...)

There should be enough electrical wiring slack to get it out enough to access plugs?
 
Probably going to have to unplug the circuit board plug to get the dash cluster out. And it might just be all of your light bulbs are burnd out. #194 bulbs
 
I'll check all that once the cluster is out - have testers, can troubleshoot (once it's out in the open)! Just needed to figure out how to get the darned thing out in my hands, without breaking anything (else)!!
 
Factory Service Manual will have removal instructions. This was posted on another post already.
 
One of the pins on the flat connector that goes into the circuit board is for the dash lights.

Sometimes you can just reseat that connector without pulling the cluster.

Something to check.
 
I have manuals on order, which I also mentioned before. I've owned the car for 2.5 weeks, still stockpiling the lit.
 
Like Dadsbee said, the speedo cable is stopping you from pulling the cluster out more than 2 inches. Once you have that unhooked you should be able to pull the left side of the cluster out enough to get the right side to clear the A/C duct. I'm betting that the panel dimmer switch is the issue along with the 194 bulbs. You could check for power at the Ips fuse with a volt meter when the light switch is on and panel dimmer wheel turned all the way up. No volts....Panel dimmer is the culprit. How about the dome light? Does that light up with the panel dimmer wheel all the way up? Doors closed of course. By the way, the dash panel lights are on their own fuse. Not on with the tail lights fuse.
 
Dome light works with the doors, but I didn't think to try with the dash dimmer wheel. I'll give that a shot when I can bend again, thanks!
 
Well the dash is out (that speedo cable will be fun to reconnect!), and the dimmer switch is toast. I'm going to build some test cables today and figure out what works and what's dead, but the dimmer switch is definitely toast. Contacts have crap growing on them, and the case is loose giving too much play between the rheostat and the tab. For now, I think I'm going to bypass it. Looking at the diagrams, it looks like if I jump between the bottom contact and the center contact, that will give me dash lights (at full brightness) any time the headlights are on? Diagrams make it look like the top contact is for dome lights, when you roll the rheostat all the way up - I don't want that, I'll just crack a door if I need dome light.

Now to figure out where to get dash light bulbs. Some test good with a multimeter; most test dead; I'm going to replace them all. Anyone done LED's? I don't want to take it apart again if I don't have to! A post above says 194s, but the manual has other names for them - three 57s, and three 158s? (page 8-93).

Also, is there a typical failure for the clocks? I know they all die (like mine)..is it something I can fix here, like a power feed issue, or do I need to send it somewhere?
 
You could send your panel dimmer to Devinism. (Devin Duke in California) He will rebuild it better than NOS. I sent him two for rebuild and have an extra if you need it. As for the bulbs, you can get led's that will out last those conventional bulbs by many years and are much brighter. I bought some blue ones on Ebay that work well. They are fussy as to continuity though. If they won't light up, you need to turn them 180 and reinstall them. A good time to do that is on the bench where yours is now.
As for the clock, all of those clocks have a set of points akin to an old distributor. Yours has failed like all of them. If you want an accurate clock, you need to send it out to have it updated to a quartz movement. There are a few places out there that can do that for you.
Like you said, you don't want to take it apart again so you need to do it right now that you have it out. It would be a good time to calibrate your gauges too. If you have a good fuel sender or a 0-100 ohm rheostat you can test and adjust your oil, fuel and temp gauges. (10 ohms=full and 75 ohms=empty) Those ohm readings are the same for temp and oil pressure gauge also. Also a good time to ditch the amp gauge and replace it with a volt meter. 50 year old ammeters are good for creating meltdowns. I sent my gauge panel to Redline Gauges for rebuild and had them replace the ammeter with a volt meter. Spendy but not near as much as a fire. Here is a pic of mine after the resto.

100_9658.JPG
 
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I'm pretty sure this is the first time the dash has been apart - nothing on the cluster has ever been touched, from what I can tell and the wiring all looks pristine. It was even still in all the clips on the dash structure! The speedo works well enough but I'll probably shoot some dri-slide (motorcycle cable lubricant) down the sleeve just because I have access to it. I'm not worried about the ammeter - been fine for 50 years, and no signs of any heat or chafing on the connections so clean all the contacts and hit them with some preservative, and I'll leave it original.

I've got a 12v power supply in the house - the three lights on the smaller gauges (fuel, temp, oil, amp) work fine when I feed ground to the chassis, and power to the lighting pin. I'll take out the headlight switch and plug it into the car, with a jumper across the bottom two terminals on the dash dimmer socket, and see if the other lights fire up in the car when I turn on the headlights (I have jumper wires to ground each socket for testing). White LEDs are on the way, so as soon as I know the sockets work, it can all go back together!

I just need to decide what to do about the dimmer, and the clock. I'm not that worried about the clock working, but a quartz movement would be nice. I dunno. I can do that later - my budget it still reeling from buying the car in the first place! And honestly it won't be out much at night anyway - I live in deer country, and these grilles are EXPENSIVE...but I do need dash lights if I get stuck out after dark.

And, I need a horn relay. I cleaned the contacts in the clockspring, and tested continuity all the way from the wheel to the relay terminal. Still nothing. I had to open up the relay and force it to make contact manually, and the horns wheezed to life...so the wiring is good, at least. I just need to adjust the horns themselves, and test them with the car running so they're getting the right volts and amps.

Progress....
 
NO NEED TO CHANGE THE AMMETER FOR VOLTIMETER

read on board what we have talked about latelly that and what you need to really pay attention about the charging system
 
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