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500 Stroker Question

jeeper

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I'm considering buying a car. It is set up for street and strip and the seller is quite experienced with racing etc. It is unfinished. He built a pretty nice engine and I'd like a best guess HP estimate. I am going to use it as a toy and street and strip car. It is not the precise build I would use, but it looks decent.

I was at one time pretty into Mopar, and then got into Jeeps etc. and have been away for awhile. New to strokers.

He has a 440 block with the 440 source 500 cubic inch kit that was for 11.4:1 compression with stealth heads. He had the block decked and all the machine work completed at a quality shop. Im pretty confident in his work.

This is what I know:

500 CID kit in engine
Stealth heads cleaned up
Lunati Hydraulic cam that has a 6200 RPM max (he didn't recall .050 numbers)
I think 2" primary tube headers
m1 single plane intake
950 CFM carb
MSD type distributor
He did indicate that he ran some slightly thicker head gaskets.
Lastly, he was intending to spray it. He has not even started it, just an FYI.


This is what I want to know:

-Should be OK tuned sharp on 93 octane?
-Approximate HP on a typical build like this?
-Approximate torque?
-Other thoughts about this as a typical street strip engine that will likely see more street.

I am assuming that with 500 CID it should be pretty drivable as it is.

Thank you for your input.
 
I'm No engine build expert, but seems like this is more geared towards strip usage ?
 
I would like to know the camshaft numbers, but if I were to guess.....
with a small hydraulic cam and a zero decked block, and at least 11.5 cr, I would bet it won't run on straight 93. Maybe, if it has a bunch of camshaft in it, 250+degrees at .050.
Then again, I'm used to california can pee 10%alky 91, and I KNOW it won't run on that. I'm running a 10.5 iron head 440 on 2/3 91, 1/3 100LL avgas.
No such thing as 93 pump in this state.
 
I made close to 600 HP and over 600 TQ with a similar build using a 236/242 hydraulic roller. A lot will depend on the cam. It will also affect your ability to use pump gas.
 
My 496 w Comp hydraulic roller 230/236 massaged Stealth heads made 610/670 hp/tq at the crank. But I'm at 10.2:1 compression on 91 octane.
 
Anyone who doubts a 11-1 engine can not run on 93, I offer this fact. I have 93 at the pump on a 11.4-1 compression 360 with a cam spec @050 of 224/230. I do not suggest it though. It can be a little cranky (sensitive) with fuel and heat of the day. Much better off at a 10.5-1 or lower. It’s much more octane friendly.

Have a great day everyone.

@jeeper I don’t know how anyone can come up with HP and Tq. numbers, it is not going to happen because there is a lot of missing information. The actual air flow of the head and the cam specs. To say, “I have Stealth heads cleaned up.” is going to leave a lot to the imagination. We can only guess.

One member said it seemed like a track build. Without the duration @050 numbers for the cam, that’s a pretty broad statement to make which assumes a lot. While the M1 single plane is a strip intake, it’s completely drivable on the street if the combination is right and you can live with the power band of the engine. A Hyd. cam that has a listed peak power of 6200 is not a big cam. These power band ratings are very general since,
1: There rated with a single engine in mind when they were designed, not all big blocks will perform in the same rpm band as the cam is listed.
2: There is a huge difference between the old popular 383 & the 440. Your even larger @ 500. The larger the engine, the shorter the cams power band is.
(A blind bet you dyno this thing and peak power rolls in at 5800 or less.)
3: The over all build can extend the power band of most any camshaft with better breathing intakes and higher flowing cylinder heads. The better you make the air pump the broader in rpm it will perform in.

IMO, I think the single plane intake and smallish cam (rpm rated wise to 6200) is an odd combination. Considering the engine is 500 cubes, it could work. That’s a lot of engine with a small runner intake. A bunch depends on the cars overall as driven weight, a darn good converter and a set of properly selected gears to work well with everything as a package.

I’m collecting parts to do a similar build. 400B to 500-ish cubes, M1 single, 2 inch fender well headers for the Duster, etc….. just more camshaft given the listed rpm above.

See if you can find out what cam it is! That would be awesome to know.
 
Not an exceptional design for a mostly street engine.
 
That was confusing. I was commenting on the engine the OP was considering.
 
I have run a zero deck flattop 406 smallblock on pump 10% 91, with around 11 to 1. But that was with a 265/270° at .050 solid roller, aluminum heads, in a LIGHT car, with a lot of gear.
Sure wouldn't recommend 11 1/2 and a 225° cam for a heavy street car, even with aluminum heads
 
My 440 stroked to 512 with stealth heads, street dominator, sniper EFI, 10.35 compression, mild (.535) cam and big headers did 515 h.p., 580tq. on pump gas. The engine guy figures that will go up slightly as the EFI tunes itself.
 
We built a 505 with CNC ported Stealth heads. It has a Howards hydraulic roller that is .545 lift and 234/241 duration @ .050. With 10.4:1 it would run on the cheapest pump gas but I seldom did. We bumped it to 11:1 this past winter and it runs fine on 93 octane pump. Made 600 hp and ran 11.19@121 @ 3600 lbs. on the lower CR. Without ported heads, you're probably right at 500.

Headers seem a little large.
 
I have run a zero deck flattop 406 smallblock on pump 10% 91, with around 11 to 1. But that was with a 265/270° at .050 solid roller, aluminum heads, in a LIGHT car, with a lot of gear.
Sure wouldn't recommend 11 1/2 and a 225° cam for a heavy street car, even with aluminum heads
As I said in the post, not recommended.
I do not suggest it though. It can be a little cranky (sensitive) with fuel and heat of the day. Much better off at a 10.5-1 or lower. It’s much more octane friendly.
It has 3.55’s on small 26” tires and a good converter custom built for the car by ProTorque. The ‘67 Cuda FB has manual everything. All steel, full interior. Unknown exact weight.
 
Compression seems pretty high for that combination and pump gas?
That 11.4:1 does look like the quoted compression ratio from 440 source got the flat top (and zero decked block) 500" stroker with 80cc heads.
You mentioned thicker head gaskets which would lower the compression a bit.
Not sure on the cam, but sounds like about [email protected]" duration.
I would use it, but setup the fuel system up for E-85 fuel.
With out knowing much about the build, maybe 530 HP, and 580+ torque?
With head work and larger cam, it could make 600+ HP
 
Ok I appreciate all of your effort and time. I am not new to engines or necessarily big blocks but it has been about a decade and I know Mopar guys are generally very knowledgeable and competent.

It is not necessarily how I would have built this engine, but it is completed. Seems like a guy could get over into unstreetable pretty quickly where you run a bigger cam for octane reasons etc. and power and now it isn't really driveable. I am beginning to think the whole deal is not what I need right now honestly even though it does all work together for the most part.

It is a decent combo overall, but I am honestly more in the 440/.484/Holley 750 neighborhood for what I need.

Thank you and I will keep checking in!
 
Compression seems pretty high for that combination and pump gas?
That 11.4:1 does look like the quoted compression ratio from 440 source got the flat top (and zero decked block) 500" stroker with 80cc heads.
You mentioned thicker head gaskets which would lower the compression a bit.
Not sure on the cam, but sounds like about [email protected]" duration.
I would use it, but setup the fuel system up for E-85 fuel.
With out knowing much about the build, maybe 530 HP, and 580+ torque?
With head work and larger cam, it could make 600+ HP
I know he worked pretty closely with 440 Source. He was quite successful racing but with GM products. He has a lot of experience and I know he had work done at a local quality race shop etc. It was decked and he used all ARP stuff etc. He did a decent job overall. I believe he was going to spray it down the road......
 
One issue is that the stealth heads are about the only aluminum head that kept the stock spark plug location. Great if doing more of a restoration, but not so great for low octane fuel.
I have stealth heads on a 440/505" (4.25" stroke crank), built with the -17cc dish pistons, around 10.3:1 compression, and a mild comp 236/242 Hydraulic roller cam. It runs on pump gas, but still need to be careful on how much ignition advance it has. The heads did have some mild port cleanup and fresh valve job, plus springs and retainers to work with the camshaft.
 
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