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'69 Coronet R/T Fender tag decoding without fender tag

Wietse

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Hi all,

As I recently found out that my car turns out to be a original Coronet R/T I started digging a bit regarding the options on the car, what is standard and what is optional.
This to see what is original on the car and being aware of taking the right action with restoration etc.
When the car was re-painted to the current colour they must have had a big pile of parts left after rebuilding as a lot of rubber seals etc. are still missing.
This makes me wonder if there were any items added or removed/not installed back.
The fender tag(s) are removed here in the Netherlands with registration as it is not allowed to have a removable VIN tag and should be stamped in the chassis so I have no reference.
See below link to my "welcome thread" with pictures of the car.
Also there you can find pictures of the VIN stampings on the engine and chassis.
VIN: WS23L9E112164

http://www.forbbodiesonly.com/moparforum/threads/hi-all-a-mopar-fan-from-the-netherlands.129288/

I've been looking into several obvious things that would be a option or something that would be more likely to come with an R/T compared to the standard model.

This is how far I came:

Radiator: Although the car is equipped with a 26 inch radiator I believe it is not original.
What I found was that these came when the car was equipped with A/C which it is not. Unless a 26 inch radiator was standard for the R/T?
Or was this optional on all cars by adding the "26" on the tag?

*Rally instrument cluster: This was optional with code A62.

*Power brakes: This was optional with code B51. In this case should come with front disc brakes for the R/T?

Transmission: Should be code D32, Heavy Duty Automatic transmission. (description for '69 model)

Engine: For the engine there should be a code E86, 440 4-barrel HP.

Body side mouldings: According me these are the shiny strips below the doors. Normally option code M33, but the wide version is standard for the R/T.

*Quarter scoops (simulated): As what I found these are optional with code M46. Mine have chrome edges. From what I read the scoops for the Coronet R/T should be without chrome. Because of this it makes me wonder if they are original or added. Or someone replaced the edges with the wrong ones.

*Hood scoops: The dual scoop was 1 of 2 options for the R/T hood. If, like in my case the dual scoops were chosen does this mean there supposed to be a Ram charger frame below the hood? I do not have that, but maybe there was a option of just the dual scoop for optical reasons only? I do need to check the part number (3417096) of the hood if possible as this should be different then the standard hood. There are rectangular openings below it, which look original. If the Ram charger frame always comes with it I should try to find one. (if possible) The option code for the hood scoops simulated is M47, are these the ones? If it originally came with the Ram Charger, as it is a 440 HP engine, it should have the N96 code "Fresh air hood".

Power steering: Not sure but I think this was optional?? Code S77

*Premium steering wheel Wood grained: Not sure but I think is optional with code S81.

*Interior: Regarding the seats I did not find much. What I found was that it looks like these seats are for a different model car (cant remember now of what car I did see a picture of with similar seats). To me this a split vinyl bench with armrest?? I cannot find any codes with example pictures.

Next time when I will be working on the car I will try my luck again and maybe find a build sheet under the seat, but that will be pushing my luck I guess.
I also registered myself on the Coronet registry and left a thread there with the VIN in case someone has any documentation or tags of the car.

Anyway, please correct me where I am wrong.
(I am a Mopar virgin so please be gentle) :thankyou:
 
Last edited:
Do you have a Build Sheet or a window sticker? If you do not have those nor a FT, Who know's....At that point you can only go off what the car tells you....
 
Nope, I do not have the build sheet or stickers.
That is why I am hoping someone might know what is standard on an R/T.
Like the hood scoops, does the ram charger frame below the hood always come with them in the case for an R/T, or was there also an option to add just the 2 scoops only without ram charger frame?
If the ram charger frame supposed to be there I need to find one to get it original.
If both options are possible, yeah who knows.
 
Nope, I do not have the build sheet or stickers.
That is why I am hoping someone might know what is standard on an R/T.
Like the hood scoops, does the ram charger frame below the hood always come with them in the case for an R/T, or was there also an option to add just the 2 scoops only without ram charger frame?
If the ram charger frame supposed to be there I need to find one to get it original.
If both options are possible, yeah who knows.
Ahh I got you now...The scoops/air grabber was not standard on an RT. The standard hood had a bulge in the center with chrome trim. All I have seen with scoops had the air grabber as well.
 
:realcrazy:Hi all,

As I recently found out that my car turns out to be a original Coronet R/T I started digging a bit regarding the options on the car, what is standard and what is optional.
This to see what is original on the car and being aware of taking the right action with restoration etc.
When the car was re-painted to the current colour they must have had a big pile of parts left after rebuilding as a lot of rubber seals etc. are still missing.
This makes me wonder if there were any items added or removed/not installed back.
The fender tag(s) are removed here in the Netherlands with registration as it is not allowed to have a removable VIN tag and should be stamped in the chassis so I have no reference.
See below link to my "welcome thread" with pictures of the car.
Also there you can find pictures of the VIN stampings on the engine and chassis.
VIN: WS23L9E112164

http://www.forbbodiesonly.com/moparforum/threads/hi-all-a-mopar-fan-from-the-netherlands.129288/

I've been looking into several obvious things that would be a option or something that would be more likely to come with an R/T compared to the standard model.

This is how far I came:

Radiator: Although the car is equipped with a 26 inch radiator I believe it is not original.
What I found was that these came when the car was equipped with A/C which it is not. Unless a 26 inch radiator was standard for the R/T?
Or was this optional on all cars by adding the "26" on the tag?

22 inch was standard with automatic. 26 inch was not an option you could order. If you ordered A/C, trailer towing or any axle package, you got the 26 inch. The four speed required an axle package so if it was a four speed, it got a 26 inch. The 26 inch radiator used a different radiator yoke. How wide is the opening?

*Rally instrument cluster: This was optional with code A62.

*Power brakes: This was optional with code B51. In this case should come with front disc brakes for the R/T?

Transmission: Should be code D32, Heavy Duty Automatic transmission. (description for '69 model)

Engine: For the engine there should be a code E86, 440 4-barrel HP.

Body side mouldings: According me these are the shiny strips below the doors. Normally option code M33, but the wide version is standard for the R/T.

*Quarter scoops (simulated): As what I found these are optional with code M46. Mine have chrome edges. From what I read the scoops for the Coronet R/T should be without chrome. Because of this it makes me wonder if they are original or added. Or someone replaced the edges with the wrong ones.

*Hood scoops: The dual scoop was 1 of 2 options for the R/T hood. If, like in my case the dual scoops were chosen does this mean there supposed to be a Ram charger frame below the hood? I do not have that, but maybe there was a option of just the dual scoop for optical reasons only? I do need to check the part number (3417096) of the hood if possible as this should be different then the standard hood. There are rectangular openings below it, which look original. If the Ram charger frame always comes with it I should try to find one. (if possible) The option code for the hood scoops simulated is M47, are these the ones? If it originally came with the Ram Charger, as it is a 440 HP engine, it should have the N96 code "Fresh air hood".

Only two hoods available. The standard bulge hood or the Ramcharger set up with scoops. No scoops without the air box.

Power steering: Not sure but I think this was optional?? Code S77

Optional

*Premium steering wheel Wood grained: Not sure but I think is optional with code S81.

Optional

*Interior: Regarding the seats I did not find much. What I found was that it looks like these seats are for a different model car (cant remember now of what car I did see a picture of with similar seats). To me this a split vinyl bench with armrest?? I cannot find any codes with example pictures.

Buckets standard. Fold down arm rest aka "buddy seat" optional.

Next time when I will be working on the car I will try my luck again and maybe find a build sheet under the seat, but that will be pushing my luck I guess.
I also registered myself on the Coronet registry and left a thread there with the VIN in case someone has any documentation or tags of the car.

Anyway, please correct me where I am wrong.
(I am a Mopar virgin so please be gentle) :thankyou:

See above
 
Thanks guys, no we are moving :)

So for sure I can try and find the air box that bolts below the hood for the scoops.
This probably was beyond repairs and they scrapped it instead of repairing/replacing it. :(

I understand the radiator issue. I did measure 26 inch when I had to order a new fan shroud for a 26 inch radiator (Summit Racing) but this fan shroud was 1" wider then the radiator. (shroud bolt holes did not fit over the studs)
So I fabricated something to get it to work but that also made me wonder what was going on.
Most likely a radiator from another model car.
 
Thanks guys, no we are moving :)

So for sure I can try and find the air box that bolts below the hood for the scoops.
This probably was beyond repairs and they scrapped it instead of repairing/replacing it. :(

I understand the radiator issue. I did measure 26 inch when I had to order a new fan shroud for a 26 inch radiator (Summit Racing) but this fan shroud was 1" wider then the radiator. (shroud bolt holes did not fit over the studs)
So I fabricated something to get it to work but that also made me wonder what was going on.
Most likely a radiator from another model car.

If it's an original 26" radiator, the part number on the top of the tank will end in 054 or 055.
 
The fender tag(s) are removed here in the Netherlands with registration as it is not allowed to have a removable VIN tag and should be stamped in the chassis so I have no reference.

Hi Wietse. So does the statement above imply that the government removes the tag upon entering the Netherlands? If so, is it possible it is in a file on record that could possibly be accessed for reference? Sorry, I don't know how you're regulatory bodies work. But I'm wondering about a few things. Such as a car leaving the Netherlands will never have it's fender tag again? In any case, if it's in a file somewhere maybe you can get access.
 
The part number on the radiator is as follows: 2786 942, and another number: 61018 and a Pentastar logo.
Looks like the radiator support frame has been modified actually to suit the bigger radiator, there is extra cut out on the passenger side which looks like not original.

@gdrill:

When a car was imported in them days, the VIN number was hand stamped in the chassis.
The VIN and it's location on the car (left, right, firewall, fender, etc.) was recorded in the documents.
After the tags were removed they were discarded, maybe you could keep them if you asked for it but i don't know. (i was still liquid in them days :) )
There are still plenty vintage cars here which still carry all original fender tags, most of them have them because they are imported from a time that this became important.
In the 80's i guess nobody would have cared.
The main reason was that a tag was removable and there could be swapped around with.
Instead of swapping fender tags, some other illegal actions were taken:

Let's say you have a Coronet 500, which was involved in a crash and is beyond salvage.
You import another car, let's say you find a nice looking R/T for a good price.
Only other details you need to have correct is exterior color (say Green, being it Dark green metallic or Sublime...green is green on the document), the same engine displacement and amount of cylinders.
After the car arrived, you remove all the fender tags, add a extra coat of paint over the stamped "partial" VIN numbers that not many people knew of in them days.
Hand stamp the VIN of the totalled car in exact the same place as it was on the Coronet 500, swap the licence plates and you are done.
As a last, make sure your old car is going to be turned into razor blades to hide the evidence.

This is what was done with my car, it has been registered on a different VIN which does not match.
The registered VIN is WP23G0A, which is a '70 model while it's a '69.
Apart from that, now all Mopar fans (including me, only since recently :) )know the locations of the partial VIN on the chassis and engine.
These i all found and are matching #, WS23L9E, check my welcome thread for pictures. (last page)
 
Well if you can't find a broadcast sheet anywhere then you can put on whatever you like. Waiting for new pictures when going along. Have fun.
 
"Looks like the radiator support frame has been modified actually to suit the bigger radiator, there is extra cut out on the passenger side which looks like not original."

That tells you the car had the 22" radiator meaning it was an automatic with no A/C and had 3.23 gears. That would be the standard set up.

2786 942 looks like a '67 part number.
 
So if any optional rear diff package was selected they also included the 26" radiator?
If I ever need to replace the radiator I will see and get the right size.

I am new with the car but I have a feeling the diff gears feel like a 4.10 because of the "high" rpm's while drive along at "higher" speeds.
But I will do the check with lifting the rear and turn the wheel and count the drive shaft revolutions to confirm.

Anyway, got already some solid info.
So the car would have had the N96 option for the hood, I just need to confirm if there is a part number on the hood to make sure it's original and not a modified standard hood.

What about the quarter scoops?
Mine have 2 inlets, I've also seen a single (bigger) inlet style, or does this depend on the year or different model?
Like I mentioned I've read something that the R/T did not have the chrome bezels around the "inlets" but mine has. They supposed to be same colour as the car?
Think I never seen them without chrome, or never noticed. :)

@ Oldbee:

Of course without a build sheet or fender tag there is nothing that can be 100% certain.
Mind you with the limited resources here in Europe for parts and accessories for these cars it was not so easy to get "upgrades" as being so close to the source in the US.
Years ago with the shipping prices etc. I don't think many people would spent a lot of money to import parts to change/modify the car.

I am just trying to find the most logic reasons for an option to be true or not and work with that as "original" for my car.
Chances that I will ever find a fender tag or build sheet are very very small, at least I tried to get everything as correctly dated as I can.
 
So if any optional rear diff package was selected they also included the 26" radiator?

Yes. Stock 22" radiator would be the 2949 053.

 
Noted.

Am I right in saying the R/T came with front disc brakes when Power brakes were selected?

M33, Body side moldings: These are the strips below the door right? From what I read these (wide version) was standard for R/T.
 
You could have power drum brakes. Disc brakes was a separate option but disc brakes did come with power assist.

The sill (the chrome molding below the door) molding is M25.
 
Thx guys!

Good info, at least settles me a bit with what supposed to be on there and options or what is not correct.
 
Is there a way to figure out around what date my car was build by looking at the sequence number?
Like a list of a individual plant could show the amount of cars build each month or something?

As my VIN shows it was the 12.164th car i think it will have been a "early" '69 car.
This count is the total count of all vehicles produced in that factory right?
So if the factory also makes other models, Chargers, Darts, etc. the next sequence number might have been stamped on a Charger or Dart?

Something i can lead off this being a early '69 car or not is that it is fairly possible that it came with door handles with black buttons instead of chrome.
As from what i read the black buttons were used until 1968 model year, but still earlier '69 models also were found with these.
 
If your VIN is WS23L9E112164, here's the best I can do for you....car 112054 has a scheduled date of Oct 3rd. Car 112864 has a scheduled date of Oct 8th. (800 cars over five days). The first week of October is the closest I can get. Production at the LA plant was pretty low so the tag info is harder to find and the SPDs get spread out very quickly.

Yes, early 69 models could come with black buttons. My early November St. Louis car has black buttons.
 
800 cars in 5 days :eek:, I don't call that low production figures!!
The must have been hammering cars out them good old days.
So but these 800 cars included all models that they made in the LA plant right?
There is no different count for each individual model line, pure count of the B body's produced there.

Anyway, thanks for that.
That is close enough for me :thumbsup:

I was wondering previously but did find the answer already on this; The production of the '69 model started August 1968. (or was it September?)
So the first cars SPD dates were 801 (August 01 '68) instead of counting from 101 (Jan 01 1969); correct?

The door handles looks appear to be quite aged so I guessed they were original.
I want to buy a set of new ones so questioned if they are correct.
For now I am still searching to find a local address to get them re-chromed together with bumpers and some other stuff.
 
800 cars in 5 days :eek:, I don't call that low production figures!!

Consider that others plants like Hamtramck, Lynch Road and St. Louis were doing 1,500-1,800 a day. 800 over five days is pretty low.

The must have been hammering cars out them good old days.
So but these 800 cars included all models that they made in the LA plant right?

Yes.

There is no different count for each individual model line, pure count of the B body's produced there.

Correct. VINs include all models made at the plant. LA also made A bodies that year.

Anyway, thanks for that.
That is close enough for me :thumbsup:

I was wondering previously but did find the answer already on this; The production of the '69 model started August 1968. (or was it September?)
So the first cars SPD dates were 801 (August 01 '68) instead of counting from 101 (Jan 01 1969); correct?

Pilot cars, generally, have July production dates but for the most part, regular production starts 801 depending on the year and plant.

The door handles looks appear to be quite aged so I guessed they were original.
I want to buy a set of new ones so questioned if they are correct.
For now I am still searching to find a local address to get them re-chromed together with bumpers and some other stuff.

See above.
 
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