71-74 B Body Tremec TKO 600 conversion? BE ADVISED!!!

Engine, Trans & Driveline

  1. Wookie316

    Wookie316 Well-Known Member

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    I have a Tremec TKO 600 in My 71 Charger and have been fighting a road speed vibration since I have put it together. After speaking with numerous people and getting opinions from driveline angles to an unbalanced engine I think I may have discovered the issue. The problem is one that I am not sure if it can be fixed?
    I have had the trans out of the car once, checked the bell housing for a proper dial in and changed the clutch, I have put a second set of axles in the car mostly because I broke one and none of this made it go away.
    I know the driveshaft had been out a couple times to have the balance checked but I had always been suspicious of it since day one.
    Wanting to go to a 1350 yoke I decided to order a high spun shaft from Denny's.
    I gave them the measurements as they list on their sight and 3 weeks later I had my shaft.
    I installed and went to road test the car. The car didn't want to go into first very well and I wasn't sure why? I went around my block once. It went into 2nd just fine but 1st and 3rd would not go.
    I put it back on stands again and crawled underneath and this is what I discovered.
    IMG_3474_zps65b3e939.jpg
    IMG_3477_zps15eda260.jpg
    As you can see the shift rod hangs out the back further than the end of the case in 1st, 3rd or 5th by 1 1/4". After speaking with Denny's they told me that I am the victim of a piss poor design for a lack of a better term. This design makes the driveshaft slip yoke have to stick out of the tranny further than it is designed to be. This causes a high speed off load vibration or shudder because the slip yoke is not where it should be and it will become unstable on coast mode.
    What Denny's described is exactly what I have experienced since day one.
    I have returned the shaft to them to have it shortened a tad more. The problem is that the closest the slip can sit in and still clear is about an 1 1/4". Whether that will be enough is yet to be determined?
    The damage on the shift shaft is more an eye sore than anything. It actually will help with clearance. I will pull it off this winter and clean it up and give it a bit of an angle to help it clear. Denny's said I'd need about a 1/4" clearance to be safe.
    So while I wait on my shaft to come back from Denny's I put my old shaft back in and find the slip sticks out 2". That's too much!
    IMG_3478_zps09c40bbc.jpg
    Like I say, I won't know until the new shaft is back to see if my vibe goes away?
    Just posting this to make others aware that if you are considering a TKO 600 in a 71-74 B Body or a 70-74 E Body for that fact since they are the same kit, you may want to re-think your options?
    Also I will point out that I have spoke with other Tremec users in older B Bodies with the different shifter position not experiencing any vibrations. But my guess is that the driveshaft is fit into the tranny properly in those applications?
    I like my overdrive, but this has been a pain and I have hardly any miles on my car because of this issue.
    If the proper driveshaft length is the miracle cure I will be a very happy guy once again!
    Denny's
     
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    • 451Mopar

      451Mopar Well-Known Member

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      Thanks for the info. Looks like you can grind that for a bit more clrearace.
       
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      • 747mopar

        747mopar Well-Known Member

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        Was this a Keisler supplied tranny???? The reason I ask is I heard bad things about some of the mods they made to the shifters in order to make them bolt in jobs.
         
      • Wookie316

        Wookie316 Well-Known Member

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        No. American Powertrain.
         
      • 747mopar

        747mopar Well-Known Member

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        Thanks, I'm planning an overdrive upgrade in the future but haven't decided on which one (T56 or TKO600) so I'll keep this in mind.
         
      • Wookie316

        Wookie316 Well-Known Member

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        Shift rail positions.
        1st, 3rd & 5th
        E74E7A57-CAFD-4362-8BD7-FABF962097BC_zpss4kehyiz.jpg

        Neutral

        C2D6E4BB-D8BC-4DB1-9FD2-A54DEFBA4109_zps5gq2abqe.jpg

        2nd, 4th and reverse.

        D7720BE8-66A8-4DC5-A4A7-B6984C6C558F_zpsfmlhpdrz.jpg

        No room to modify and shorten shaft because of where 2nd, 4th and reverse are. They can't move any closer to the case. Who ever designed this obviously didn't take this into account. Crazy!
         
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        • 74Beeper

          74Beeper Well-Known Member

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          i just got my TKO600 installed and noticed the very same vibration during driveline slack. The first thing I thought was the driveshaft not being long enough and not in the tail housing far enough. I balanced the driveshaft and it seems to be gone but haven't put many miles on it yet. Thanks for the heads up, I'm gonna look into this a bit further.
           
        • moparmarks

          moparmarks FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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          In the first original picture it looks like the yoke is too far in. The later pictures look more correct. The yoke needs to be about 1 to 1.5" back from bottomed out on the shaft to have some travel for the rear end to go up and down. I've done a few TKO conversions and set my shafts up more like what you have in the later pictures. If the drive shaft angles are off much you will get some vibration.
           
        • Bb70charger500

          Bb70charger500 Well-Known Member

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          Please keep up the info I was going to go this route but decided to go 4 speed for now to get it on the road then look into a 5 or 6 speed setup.
           
        • Topper_X

          Topper_X Member

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          Wookie, did you give up on this?
          Has ANYBODY done a successful TKO 600 swap into a '71-'72?
           
        • Bb70charger500

          Bb70charger500 Well-Known Member

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          I see a possible fix with some mods . ,so say you take that (call it a knuckle) off fan a new one with the opening half as big towards the front basically the back side wall would be right above the set screw then simply cut the rod (notch it ) cut the back material off . Not seeing why this wouldn't work but I don't have it sitting in front of me ether! But that's what I was know for at the shop . I was the best qt winging it! I made some cobbled together crap when in a bind!
          Hell quick story, I was on night shift by my self they were running the fleet dump trucks equipment ect night and day to get the job done on time to receive the bonus. We had 3 grease trucks that held enough fuel for there crews eqt till the big truck got there 500-1000 gals. So without these trucks everything stops! We already had one broken with a Blown out trans (waiting on parts ) so the old one git towed in as I was getting ready to head home! Then the crap hit the fan ,I had 3 of the big boss' screaming for this truck to be fixed asap. So the a/c comp locked up and threw the belt . So no one had a replacement comp half of the comp parts were missing and the truck needed that pulley there . So I grabbed some 8 ga steal and some nuts made a bracket and some spacers then took a pulley off the shelf for a different truck welded this disaster together! Figured as long as it makes it out to the job they will be happy . So I got this thing done and as the driver was gripping about no a/c I went home and left a note about getting a comp ordered in ,I also told the driver to bring the truck back in when they were finished working it. So when I came in the boss came in with a smile and he said they were so happy with my quick thinking the big boss wanted me in a service truck if they needed a mechanic in a bind . At the time this was great ,raise free ride to and from work ,didn't even have to put fuel in my truck... god I wish I just played stupid that night they ran me ragged the following 4-5 years 80-90 hours a week day night 7 days a week! My wife hated the company after that . But they did give alot of perks lots of free material s like steal ,brake cleaner nuts bolts car battery's ect
          I miss my job !
           
        • Wookie316

          Wookie316 Well-Known Member

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          Yes abandoned the Tremec years ago. Have a 727 in it running low 10’s on motor. Decided Racing was more fun than cruising.
           
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          • 74Beeper

            74Beeper Well-Known Member

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            I’ve had it with my TKO as well. Just destroyed 3rd gear again! I’m in the process of doing a T56 Magnum 6 speed conversion now. This one should hold up to the power and the 7500 rpm shifts!
             
          • shag766

            shag766 FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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            thanks for putting this out there wookie. i have something very similar going on with the tremec behind the hemi in the 69. it is barely noticeable but it is there mainly in 5th o/d when i let off the peddle and just cruise or coast along. everything is new from the block to and including the rear and i was thinking the angles were off. like i said it is barely noticeable but being an old long haul truck driver any little vibration no matter how small tends to bug me. i have checked the yoke's, the balance and the angles a couple of times and they were good but it was still there. again thanks.
             
          • Topper_X

            Topper_X Member

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            74Beeper, what's causing the problem with 3rd? Is it because the Tremecs won't let you shift fast?
            Shag, I know what you mean by vibrations. Usually it means something's wrong.
            Aren't the engines in our cars offset to the right a small amount for starter/steering gear clearance?
            How did the factory make that work?
             
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