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B/RB Standard Cams

wyrmrider

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Some data on the non Magnum Cam
Note that at least two vendors base their Muscle cams on the stock cam not the Magnum
lift...........050
392/390 192/192 Cam Dynamics 15202 383 4bbl 315 Hp 2268405



434/431 260/268 206/209 WG-1121 395hp 413 Wolverine

431/429 283/296 208/210 113 LCA 110 ICL 116 excl Elgin E-327S

434/431 284/293(SAE) 206/209 113LCA 110 ICL 116 EXCL Sealed Power CS-327 Melling SPD-11

-7 33 40 -11(.050) 22 74 74 39 SAE (.004) 2894/2870 lobe lift
intake close in Bold SAE is .004 lobe lift with 1.5 rocker (.006 at the valve)

434/431 207/210 Crane# 967981 365hp 426 hp 2268405 113lca (not in current catalog)

434/434 260/268 206/208 113/110 Howards CL727511-13 365HP/440 cam (#2532190).

Many other Production grinders use the SAE method and Crane uses .004 so tomorrow we can compare with some Crane masters
fixed typo in SP excl
 
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One thing to look at is the Harvey Crane "intensity" of the ramps
here .004 to .050 in crank degrees or (.050 to .004 on the closing ramps)
Intake open 29
Intake close 41
exhaust open 34
Exhaust close 50
note the extra long closing ramp- room for improvement

and the overlap
.004 61
.050 -18
Below .050 from Exhaust closing at 11 BTDC to Intake open at 7 ATDC @.050
I did not see .006 timing anyone have it like on a
Does Howard use .006 for advertised? YES Hughes?
dbl check my math
This cam was designed for 1967? 68 for sure High(for today) compression motors This is not the Magnum or 6 Pack cam
posted this one first as this is what most of the posters working with Motorhome or late engines have to work with and you have to know what you are starting with to make changes- in this case to bump up dynamic compression mostly for street motors- You do not start building compression till the intake closes
If you are racing just rev it up
 
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Some cars have pretty high compression these days....like the Ford GT350. That thing is running 12-1!
 
some have port and direct injection which I guess gives a stratified charge effect
port is so lean no detonation till direct squirts up near TDC and plug (s) fire
what about the boost on the supercharged and turbos
still making progress on combustion chambers too
Wonder why ma mopar did not make some new hemi's for the -let's call it' traditional- block It was built for hemis in the first place
I've never looked- are the bore centers for the hemi the same as the "new" smaller V8? Tooling is expensive
Friggin Cadillac has a new one but New tooling- not Northstar (or 215 Buick which lasted a long time)
 
Crane lobes with similar or less SAE duration (.004) as stock 440 Intake with more lift

lift .004 .050 .200 Intake Close (same intake lobe center (ICL)
[email protected]
434 284 206 ??? 74 IC stock 440
431 283 212 112 Direct Connection 260
------------------------advances intake closed by * degrees
458 264 202 120 64 *10 Mike Jones
459 268 212 127 66 *8 H3 Crane
431 274 202 114 69 *5 H2
480 276 220 136 70 *4 H3
429 279 210 340 HP intake
same intake closed as stock 440 , fatter lobe
456 284 212 125 74 0 H2
501 284 228 145 74 0 H3
More duration @.004 than stock 440 or 340HP intake -- less than 440 magnum
522 292 236 153 H3 78
480 294 222 136 H2 79
543 300 244 161 H3 82

447 302 213 440 83 Magnum Intake @.004

lobe series H3 has more acceleration = will need more spring
Overlap would be reduced by same number of degrees-
allowing LCA to be squeezed for some additional intake closed goodness (on low compression build)
 
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I Found a vintage 1988 cam Doc of the DC 260 cam
431/430 DC 260 212.3 211.9 113 lca 109 Icl/117excl -2.8 34.6 43.1 -10.8 -13.6 olap @.050 Mopar DC 260
434/430 (260/268) 206/209 113 lca 110ICL/116excl -7 __33 ___40 -11 __ -18 olap @.050 stock
the 260 MOPAR duration comes out to be about .008 cam lift
so it does look like DC is Fatter than Stock 260/268 factory stock eventhough lift is the same
all the others seem to be copies and not "our improved version of"

I have cam docs of the other DC cams "somewhere"
 
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283/296 (SAE) 208/210 Elgin E-327S
284/293(SAE) 206/209 Sealed Power/ Melling
284 DC 260 checks out same seat duration @.004 = SAE
279/289 210/221 340 HP cam @.004
264 Jones 202 .458 lift asymmetrical grind
269 Bill Jenks/Moon 195 Heavy truck/ bus special
 
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For Direction Cams see (are listed by duration @.008)
https://www.forbbodiesonly.com/moparforum/threads/direct-connection-cams.154098/
we have established that Mopar seat durations are about .008 similar to Engle
The B/RB standard cam and the 260 MP are 260 HP cam 268
..............lift ....lobe.....008....050...200 .275

K-52HYD .458" .305"_ 254° 209° ??? 6 less seat degrees at .008
Jones___458 __ 305 _ 246 202 120 64 14 less seat duration @.008 than Mopar
stock . _ 434 2894/__ 260 206
DC 260 _.431 __ ____260 212 115 42 Note that Jones is 50% larger at .275 lobe lift
K-54HYD .470" .313" 260° 214° 127° similar seat degrees at @008
340 HP 429 268 209
440 Magnum 447 268 213
K 56 Hyd .520 272 224 140
 
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Still playing with distributor on my 440 motor home eng.
Found one of my old distributors with a 9.5 slot plate. so I stuck it in this eve , now I can keep my mechanical timing around 36/37 total.
Still trying to understand all the cam specs and how they work with the engine / valve timing.

the card on the Comp xe262H - 10 I installed shows.
gross valve lift - 462 int 470 ex
dur @.006 tappet lift - int 25 btdc 57 abdc
Ex 69 bbdc 21 atdc
specs for cam installed 106.0 intake centerline
dur @.50 int 218 ex 224
lobe lift int .3080 ex . 3130
lobe separation 110.0

I have no degree wheel and didn't know how to use one correct so I installed it dot to dot.
even with the low comp bottom end it seems pretty decent on the low end I am guessing my distributor plate swap letting me run more timing at idle now should help a bit more on the low end or off idle.
later this week I am going to run a compression test and see what I get.
Thanks for all the cam info and taking time to post it.
 
I'll get to comp I'm trying to find stock duration at .006 data
I do have it for DC 260 is 269 @.006 so you are a little shorter than the 260 DC
So the Harold Berkshire (UDHAROLD)designed Comp 268HE (1977 vintage) is about the same seat duration as a 260 Mopar Performance,
will do Magnum next
thanks for the post
let me know how it runs with your trans/ gears etc
cheers
 
Cams with .006 Advertised shorter than Stock 383-440 grind for help with low compression builds sorted in duration order
.006

lift _.006 .050 .200 lobe grind#

.432 250 206 117 XE 5440 XE250H 600-4800 19 51 16 64

.454 250 208 VD 60300 also used for AMC

.452 252 208 121 XFI 5082

.473 252 206 126 HM2063164A

.454 254 202 120 Jones special @.275 lobe lift Jones is 64 when DC 260 is 42

.479 255 208 128 HM2083190 Used for AMC

.447 256 212 124 XE 5441 XE256H 22 54 20 68

.454 256 213 VD 60301 also AMC 0701 1000-5000

.458 256 212 125 XFI 5083

.483 157 210 130 HM2103219

.468 260 216 129 XFI 5084

.494 261 214 134 HM2143294A

.462 262 218 130 XE 5442 XE 262H 1300-5600 int 25 btdc 57 abdc Ex 69 bbdc 21 atdc

.473 262 218 131 XFI 5085

.498 263 216 136 HM2163318A

.482 262 217 134 . X4X4 5903

.475 262 220 VD 60302 1400-5800

.502 265 218 138 HM2183345A also used for AMC

.488 266 221 138 . X4X4 5904 MI 23.5 (11.3/12.2)

.506 267 220 140 Howards 721141-08 1600-5400 ( HM2203372A intake lobe)

.477 268 224 137 XE 5443 XE 268H MI 22.9 (11.1/11.8) 28 60 26 74 1600-5800

.488 268 224 138 XFI 5086 MI 23.1 (11.2/11.9)

.494 268 226 VD 60303 AMC 0703 1800-6200

.430 206 Howard American Muscle 1400-5000

.434 207 Crane 967981 Blueprint

.430 269 212 115 DC 260 early from cam doc (Early Direct Connection did not show .050)

.430 269 221 DC260 late- showed .050 in 2001 catalog

Exhaust lobes are not shown on shelf cams

Comp XE and XFI are .842 lobes XE4X4 are .904 lobes note less intensity ( and I suspect more area)
and would be easier on the valvetrain

Comp shelf cams intake closed @.006 shown IN bold would change if you changed centerlines or LCA

intake closed point would be very similar with other cams at same intake duration--- you can use to help figure your dynamic compression

HM Howard- one shelf cam in this duration range
VD Lunati Voodoo all “shelf cams” if ex and lca fit your needs

recent check confirmed eventhough Lunati Voodoo showed exactly same lift, duration and .050 as for a chevy the MOPAR had more duration at .200 and I suspect meaningful more area “under the curve”

If you need Lunati .200 call
Bullet also has .904 lobes but I have not yet called to see at what height "advertised" is

Jones asymmetrical max area lobe is extremely fat 250-275 lift
 
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MAGNUM CAM Data Factory says 268 intake degrees

447/464 272/292 214/226 Crane 680101 Blueprinted 2843564 (35212907) 115lca -5 51 39 -5 @.050 uses MOPAR advertised

447/459 302/324 213/225 115LCA 112ICL 118 EXCL Elgin E-1094-P Shows SAE- .004 Advertised

Melling SPD-31 66-440
447/459 302/[email protected] 213/225 .298/.306 lobe 113LC 111 Icl 115 EXCL

-6 39 50 -5 @.050 26 96 83 61 Timing @ SAE MELLING

-5 39 51 -5 @.050 from Crane

464/464 268/[email protected] 222/226 110/106 28 60 24 72 @.006 Comp 268AH-10 “step up from oem”
COMP using same grind for 340- is this ethical?

449/ 464 292/309 @.006 216/225 115LCA / 110 ICL .2990/3090 lobe Sealed Power P CS-661

455/470 278/288 216/226 Lunati 10305 Lunati's version of 375HP 440 112 LCA
 
340 HP CAM specs for you low compression 318, 340, 360 builders

429/444 279/[email protected] 209/220 114LCA 112 Icl 116 EXCL Melling SPD 22 Elgin E-578 s 20 79 79 30 SAE/ .004 -8 37 36 -6 @.050

429/444 268/276 210/220 WG-1118 114LCA 112 ICL 116 EXCL 275hp 340 Wolverine- (268-276 is FSM Mopar duration not at any known lift but close to .008)

429/444 210/221 Crane 963901 276hp 340 114 lca Cam dynamics 15002

464/464 268/276 222/226 110LCA 106 ICL Comp 20-309-4 28 60 24 72 @.006 (no relation to reality)
(Comp uses this exact same grind for the BIg Block - while hinting that it is factory replacement-- is that ethical

462/473 298/308 232/242 Lunati 10402 Lunati's version 112lca (then “exact factory replacement)
 
https://www.forbbodiesonly.com/mopa...fsm-cams-compared-to-detroit-grinders.154324/ see here for .004 list
https://www.forbbodiesonly.com/moparforum/threads/direct-connection-cams.154098/ see here for stock and Direct Connection
https://www.forbbodiesonly.com/moparforum/threads/camshafts-for-chrysler.154364/ see here for the usual performance grinders at .006
I would suggest you find the duration or intake closed point you wish to look at then print out the appropriate pages from the lists above to compare all the vendors
 
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