Death came knocking and took my Coronet

[themechanic]

My 69 Coronet R/T has been at my daughter and son-in-law's (Jeff) since Rusty, Uncle Bill's 70 Cuda, came home to me for a thorough going through about a year and a half ago. Jeff seldom drives the Coronet. When he does, he just goes for gas and back.

Friday, Jeff calls telling me he drove to the gas station about 1/4 mile away, filled up and on the way home heard a noise under the hood. I went up there yesterday and started the car. No noise. We drove around a few blocks then I heard a knock that increased with rpm. I popped the hood and listened and think I heard a slight knock on the driver's side. I started back to Jeff's house and the engine stalled then wouldn't crank. We managed to tow it back and parked it in their garage.

Before starting I pulled the dipstick and saw dark oil but could still see through it to the dipstick. I wiped it off and checked again. It didn't feel dirty but was slick and no smell of gas in the oil. This time the oil looked almost new; Brad Penn oil is kinda greenish.

I don't know the history of the rebuilt 440. I was told it was a rebuilt RV 440. I did see cross hatching in the cylinder bores when I pulled the oil pan to fix a leak a while ago. The tops of the heads looked clean when I replaced the valve cover gaskets. I use Brad Penn 10W-40 oil and change the oil and filter yearly. I don't drive the car much, probably less than 300 miles since I bought it in 2012. So, I always crank the engine until I see at least 20 psi oil pressure before pumping the gas and starting. I explained that procedure to Jeff but I don't know whether he followed it. The temperature never gets over 200 on 100 degree days.

I plan on swapping cars again when Rusty is back on the road so I can pull the engine at my house. I'll either buy a crate engine or take mine to a machine shop in town for a teardown and rebuild.

My guess is the rebuild to stock would be the least expensive route. I don't want or need 500 horsepower. I just want a good, reliable driver.

I just thought I'd let you know about my misfortune. At least I was the one driving and we were only a few blocks from home.

 

[440 PHIXX]

Damn. It hope you are able to get the 440 up and healthy again. The current inflation has slowed my progress down immensely.

 

[beanhead]

So..that's it? You're assuming the engine is toast? No guarantees of course, but it's possible it could be something less catastrophic.. a loose bolt up front, seized starter or accessory....or maybe the noise and stall condition are unrelated. I've had alternators seize and prevent the engine from cranking. All I'm saying is, consider doing some forensic investigating first.
On the other hand, if you've been waiting for the slightest excuse to pull the engine for a rebuild, I understand that too! Good luck either way.

 

[Kern Dog]

First up, I don't like the idea of extended cranking of a dry engine. The bearings, cam and lifters will be better off when the engine fires quicker compared to grinding away with no oil on them.
Secondly, Lloyd/Beanhead is right...Why give up so easily? Do some detective work and fix what you have first.

 

[Jerry Hall]

I hate hearing of anyone's misfortune, just check everything before you pull the engine. Hearing a noise, and stalling and not cranking can be unrelated. In any case, I always go by the old saying "the devil you know is better than the devil you don't know". Before you decide on a completely different engine, just be sure what you have is bad.

 

[furious70]

Torque converter bolts are worth checking based on description

 

[themechanic]

I'll look into it before I pull it. I'll start with getting the car home and draining the oil; after all, it's that time of year anyway. I'll pull the spark plugs and attempt to rotate the engine by hand.

I can only work on cars a few days a week between migraines. And Rusty will take another month to finish, at least at the rate I work.

So, it's going to be a month or so before I get the Coronet (AKA Penney, cause T5) home.

 

[SattyNoCar]

Torque converter bolts are worth checking based on description

Probably a rare instance but speaking of torque convertors, a long time ago I picked up a '73 Sebring (w/318) for CHEAP because the owner said it had a rod knock. Turned out that the torque convertor snout that engages the pump had split in two length wise. Threw in another convertor and no more noise.

 

[Nxcoupe]

My 69 Coronet R/T has been at my daughter and son-in-law's (Jeff) since Rusty, Uncle Bill's 70 Cuda, came home to me for a thorough going through about a year and a half ago. Jeff seldom drives the Coronet. When he does, he just goes for gas and back.

Friday, Jeff calls telling me he drove to the gas station about 1/4 mile away, filled up and on the way home heard a noise under the hood. I went up there yesterday and started the car. No noise. We drove around a few blocks then I heard a knock that increased with rpm. I popped the hood and listened and think I heard a slight knock on the driver's side. I started back to Jeff's house and the engine stalled then wouldn't crank. We managed to tow it back and parked it in their garage.

Before starting I pulled the dipstick and saw dark oil but could still see through it to the dipstick. I wiped it off and checked again. It didn't feel dirty but was slick and no smell of gas in the oil. This time the oil looked almost new; Brad Penn oil is kinda greenish.

I don't know the history of the rebuilt 440. I was told it was a rebuilt RV 440. I did see cross hatching in the cylinder bores when I pulled the oil pan to fix a leak a while ago. The tops of the heads looked clean when I replaced the valve cover gaskets. I use Brad Penn 10W-40 oil and change the oil and filter yearly. I don't drive the car much, probably less than 300 miles since I bought it in 2012. So, I always crank the engine until I see at least 20 psi oil pressure before pumping the gas and starting. I explained that procedure to Jeff but I don't know whether he followed it. The temperature never gets over 200 on 100 degree days.

I plan on swapping cars again when Rusty is back on the road so I can pull the engine at my house. I'll either buy a crate engine or take mine to a machine shop in town for a teardown and rebuild.

My guess is the rebuild to stock would be the least expensive route. I don't want or need 500 horsepower. I just want a good, reliable driver.

I just thought I'd let you know about my misfortune. At least I was the one driving and we were only a few blocks from home.

Sorry to hear this. Yes, rebuild would be the best route, imho. I plan to do the same to my 361. How was the oil pressure on the engine?

 

[themechanic]

Sorry to hear this. Yes, rebuild would be the best route, imho. I plan to do the same to my 361. How was the oil pressure on the engine?

Oil pressure had always been good. It was around 60 psi that day.

 

[themechanic]

So..that's it? You're assuming the engine is toast? No guarantees of course, but it's possible it could be something less catastrophic.. a loose bolt up front, seized starter or accessory....or maybe the noise and stall condition are unrelated. I've had alternators seize and prevent the engine from cranking. All I'm saying is, consider doing some forensic investigating first.
On the other hand, if you've been waiting for the slightest excuse to pull the engine for a rebuild, I understand that too! Good luck either way.

I'll check the alternator. There was a problem with a new gauge reading high. The gauge was adjusted using a voltmeter to read the same as the battery voltage while charging; 14.2 volts. I noticed the gauge read about 16 volts that day.

 

[beanhead]

I'll check the alternator. There was a problem with a new gauge reading high. The gauge was adjusted using a voltmeter to read the same as the battery voltage while charging; 14.2 volts. I noticed the gauge read about 16 volts that day.

While it's not likely the cause of your engine issue (I mentioned my experience just as an example), it does sound like there's something going on there too..16 is a little high for sure. Hey whatever happens keep us updated!

 

[68-500]

Ya I had a engine that had a knockish noise that increased with rpm. It turned out to be a bolt that backed off behind the power steering pump pulley. I only realized it after I took the engine out. Frustrated I took the car for a drive to find or fix the noise for good, it blew up on that drive.

 

[Cranky]

First up, I don't like the idea of extended cranking of a dry engine. The bearings, cam and lifters will be better off when the engine fires quicker compared to grinding away with no oil on them.
Secondly, Lloyd/Beanhead is right...Why give up so easily? Do some detective work and fix what you have first.

I've torn engines down that had been sitting for years and the bearings were still oily and so was the cam......

 

[1 Wild R/T]

As has been mentioned a couple times already... Check the torque convertor bolts... I had one last year It would run fine then suddenly start knocking so bad you'd think a rod was hanging out the side... I was fully expecting to put another engine in the car but decided to check the T/C bolts as my first task... It was a good choice... That car runs great & has been driven thousands of miles since tightening the T/C bolts....

 

[Big Bad Dad]

Another vote on check the convertor bolts. Had it happen on a poly 318 in an old pickup. One backed out and knocked badly. Even "machined" a shallow groove in the lower block flange. Replaced one bolt, and tightened them all up good. Drove that old truck for a few more years, no problem.

 

[themechanic]

If the engine won't turn how can I check all the converter bolts?

 

[Don Frelier]

Remove the inspection cover on the lower front of where the transmission housing hangs below the engine block.
Take a light and look up in there.
The flex plate bolts on the back of the crankshaft and has 4 arms which each have a bolt holding on the torque converter.
But if one is loose or hitting on top it could be tough to rectify.
Might have to rotate the engine backward?
Or unbolt the trans and slide it back a bit to make room for a wrench.

Mopars almost NEVER go from running OK to seized when they have oil in them.
And I mean any kind of oil.

 

[Rebelrouser]

If the engine won't turn how can I check all the converter bolts?

You will have to rotate the engine backwards with a bar, because the bolt worked its way out and is hung on the block. Years ago, I welded an extension on an open-end wrench just for this problem. Could not get it spun around but could get it spun enough to get the wrench on and tighten the bolt so it would rotate again.

 

[1 Wild R/T]

As stated, use a breaker bar & see if it'll move in any direction...