HELP please .. any advice on starting up my 440 for first time in a decade ???

[tallhair]

I've got my R/T in the garage finally. It has not been fired up since about 2003 so 10 years. I'm thinking it would be wise to pull the heads and check out the cylinder walls since I've never had them off previously. It's an matching numbers engine that doesn't look like its ever been apart, and it hasn't been turned over for 10 years, there is no oil left on the cylinder walls etc. I did put a socket and breaker bar on the harmonic balancer bolt and it did move .. but I didn't want to push it and just moved it a little to see if it was locked up.

I'm thinking I should pull the heads take a look and see what I see. Then spray some WD 40 or PB blaster around the rings etc and let that work it's magic for day or two. If everything looks ok and it wants to move then pour some oil over each piston and let it work its way past the rings. '

Next step in my plan is to use the oil pump priming tool to pressure up the oil pump and rotate the assy with the crank bolt again through a whole cycle to get it lubed up good.

Followed by buttoning up the heads intake etc and put a carb on it and see if I can fire it up. (I plan to get a new fuel tank, pick up, and maybe fuel lines first. I'll also be draining oil and trans fluid/filter)

The carb is missing so I have to get one. I found a supposedly new 750 Edelbrock on CL for $135 and while searching for that I came across this set of heads.

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Mopar Heads: V8 440 completely rebuilt by machine shop; 1968 Hi Perp, casting #2951250, date code C-20-8. Only $140.00

I haven't checked my R/T heads but according to the casting number that's the same set of heads. I called the owner and he didn't have them done. He said he was told they had a "standard head job done". I don't know what that means for the set and he didn't either but I'm assuming it's not a 3 angle valve job and I have no idea what they did with the valve guides or seals or if the heads have been surfaced. There is some rust so this was a while ago. If they did the valve guides and seals this seems like a good purchase for me to freshen up the engine. I also have a set of 915 heads off of a 67 383 that have the small exhaust valve and a set of 906 heads. These heads as well as the ones on my 440 all are in need of a valve job and seals, guide work etc.

Recommendations on my plan above and/or the purchase of these heads? i would appreciate all comments and suggestions and if I'm missing something obvious please point it out.

 

[440ronnie67]

Congrats on getting back to your mopar ! Personally I think taking the heads off is a waste of time and money. if your concern is the cylinder walls are rusty remove the plugs and pour a little tranny fluid in the holes (don't need much) you have already said your going to prime the oil system remember to rotate the crank to ensure both heads get oil. if you have already rotated the crank a little your probably going to be ok. Get that carb and fire her up!. then if you want you can perform a compression test to verify ring and head condition. Just me 2 pennies

 

[Cranky]

Where was the car for those 10 years? Inside or outside? I've seen engines that sat longer than that fire up without any problems. Know anyone that has a borescope that you can borrow? Also the 250 heads were not high performance castings but usually came on the 2 barrel engines. IMO, if there was rust buildup in the cylinders, you wouldn't have been able to turn it at all....

 

[tallhair]

Thanks Ronnie. So don't try the WD40 first? Just squirt some AT fluid in the holes?

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Thank Cranky. The car was in a garage. No heat no cool but with concrete floor. I don't know anyone with a borescope unless some of you guys out there have one and are near me ??

Thanks for the heads up on those heads ! I misread the chart yesteday

 

[Photon440]

Rather than WD40, I would use this:
http://www.amsoil.com/shop/by-produ...engine-fogging-oil/?page=/storefront/fog.aspx

In fact, it's a good idea for anyone storing an engine for awhile.

I wouldn't pull the heads either. But it might be a good idea to remove the intake and pour some fresh oil all over the cam. You already mentioned priming and turning the engine by hand, so you should be good after that.

I hope that you don't have ten year old gas in the tank....

 

[razreddobie]

I agree pulling the heads is not necessary. I would put a new fuel pump on though. Run a hose to a gas can and give her hell.

 

[tallhair]

I agree pulling the heads is not necessary. I would put a new fuel pump on though. Run a hose to a gas can and give her hell.

Recommendations on fuel pump welcome.

thanks razr I may put a six Pak on it once it's running, driving, and handling reliably, but an interim step will probably be an Edelbrock Torker I have back at the other place.

To plan ahead and have clean gas I do plan to put a new gas tank and probably larger 3/8" fuel line and add a 5/16th ?? return also. Also thinking of larger pick up tube for the fuel tank. Should I go with the stock hemi style mechanical fuel pump?

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Rather than WE40, I would use this:
http://www.amsoil.com/shop/by-produ...engine-fogging-oil/?page=/storefront/fog.aspx

In fact, it's a good idea for anyone storing an engine for awhile.

I wouldn't pull the heads either. But it might be a good idea to remove the intake and pour some fresh oil all over the cam. You already mentioned priming and turning the engine by hand, so you should be good after that.

I hope that you don't have ten year old gas in the tank....

Will do on the intake and oil pouring technique and that amsoil looks like great stuff. Will probably start putting it in lawn equipment too.

 

[Garys1969RR]

I have a 69 RR came with a 440 that had sat for 12 years with out running. I put in new oil, filter, and primed the oil system. New fuel pump and starter were also needed. Put the fuel pump pick up hose into a gas can, poured some fuel into the carb with the throttle open, it fired right up and ran great! The fuel pick up tube in the fuel tank was clogged, so replaced it with the hemi/440-6 pick up tube which is 3/8 diam. Was a great running 440 after all that! Oh yea, had to re build the carb too.

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My son was amazed that it ran so well! These are very durable motors.

 

[Meep-Meep]

I wouldn't pull the heads unless it absolutely needed it - meaning water came out of one of the cylinders or it was frozen! If it was in dry storage it will probably be fine so dump the oil, pull the valve covers, and refill the sump with equal amounts of oil down each bank. Dribble oil on the rockers while keeping the oil from spilling over the exhaust side of the head. After you have oil make a full revolution by hand and be aware of anything that doesn't feel consistent. Plugs out of course and a shot of oil in each cylinder and it should turn pretty smoothly. If you had rust build up you would get some resistance when that piston hit that spot on the cylinder. Also when you shoot oil into the plug holes make sure you hit the cylinder wall so it can actually run down and capillary around the top ring and not just sit on the piston top. If everything is smooth up to this point roll it over a few more times then prime the oil system with a drill. After you have oil pressure crank the engine over with the plugs out. Cranking with the plugs out will work the fuel pump and hopefully give you an opportunity to check for fuel leaks and do repairs as required while preserving some battery juice through lower cranking amps. If all is well (and for the most part it will be) throw in a fresh set of plugs and let it rip. Once warmed up and the cooling system is under pressure (hopefully), verify all fluids stay where they belong. Close the session by performing supervised acceleration trials to thoroughly distribute the fluids in the running gear.

 

[tallhair]

I have a 69 RR came with a 440 that had sat for 12 years with out running. I put in new oil, filter, and primed the oil system. New fuel pump and starter were also needed. Put the fuel pump pick up hose into a gas can, poured some fuel into the carb with the throttle open, it fired right up and ran great! The fuel pick up tube in the fuel tank was clogged, so replaced it with the hemi/440-6 pick up tube which is 3/8 diam. Was a great running 440 after all that! Oh yea, had to re build the carb too.

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My son was amazed that it ran so well! These are very durable motors.

Thanks Gary .. where did you source the pick up? I presume you are happy with it. I'm also leaning to converting to larger lines with a return line and a stock Hemi style fuel pump for eventual planned 6 BBL set up.

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I wouldn't pull the heads unless it absolutely needed it - meaning water came out of one of the cylinders or it was frozen! If it was in dry storage it will probably be fine so dump the oil, pull the valve covers, and refill the sump with equal amounts of oil down each bank. Dribble oil on the rockers while keeping the oil from spilling over the exhaust side of the head. After you have oil make a full revolution by hand and be aware of anything that doesn't feel consistent. Plugs out of course and a shot of oil in each cylinder and it should turn pretty smoothly. If you had rust build up you would get some resistance when that piston hit that spot on the cylinder. Also when you shoot oil into the plug holes make sure you hit the cylinder wall so it can actually run down and capillary around the top ring and not just sit on the piston top. If everything is smooth up to this point roll it over a few more times then prime the oil system with a drill. After you have oil pressure crank the engine over with the plugs out. Cranking with the plugs out will work the fuel pump and hopefully give you an opportunity to check for fuel leaks and do repairs as required while preserving some battery juice through lower cranking amps. If all is well (and for the most part it will be) throw in a fresh set of plugs and let it rip. Once warmed up and the cooling system is under pressure (hopefully), verify all fluids stay where they belong. Close the session by performing supervised acceleration trials to thoroughly distribute the fluids in the running gear.

Very well laid out Meep thanks for the detail and encouragement brother. My biggest concern is the pulling of the gear to use the drill and getting it back in correctly. But I bought the tool for a reason so I'm planning to use it and hope it goes back together correctly. If anyone has a diagram or instructions on how to do this it would be mucho appreciated.

Thanks again to everyone who has provided feedback and suggestions so far.

 

[MarPar]

Meeps is DA MAN!! sounds like you have a good plan here to get the olde girl fired up, B.

do it to it brother!! and dont forget to take a video!!! good luck!

 

[Meep-Meep]

You got it brother! No worries about the distributor gear. One tooth off will be very visible, so mark or take a pic of where it is and duplicate on install. I just glance at the location and remember it.

If for some reason you get messed up with the gear install, the FSM has the proper orientation as if starting from scratch.

 

[Garys1969RR]

The 3/8 pick up I found at a Denver area Mopar used parts dealer. Try Summitt, Year One, Classic Industries, or PG Classic parts in Canada. Mine works fine, but had to re calibrate the fuel level float assy by bending the float arm. Kinda like when you have to fix the toilet. Lol. Got the old 5/16 pick up tube cleaned out, but the wire from the sending unit had broke off so was no fuel level signal to the gauge.

 

[tallhair]

Meeps is DA MAN!! sounds like you have a good plan here to get the olde girl fired up, B.

do it to it brother!! and dont forget to take a video!!! good luck!

I'll definitely get'r done brother and will take some photo's. Can't promise on the video but I'll give it a shot if my daughters or son can assist

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The 3/8 pick up I found at a Denver area Mopar used parts dealer. Try Summitt, Year One, Classic Industries, or PG Classic parts in Canada. Mine works fine, but had to re calibrate the fuel level float assy by bending the float arm. Kinda like when you have to fix the toilet. Lol. Got the old 5/16 pick up tube cleaned out, but the wire from the sending unit had broke off so was no fuel level signal to the gauge.

Thanks Gary. I was assuming you bought it new so was hoping to capitalize off of your experience. I'll check all the sites I know to price shop it and a new tank. Assume the pick up and tanks are made by the same manufacturer so quality will be the same and just shop for the best deal.

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You got it brother! No worries about the distributor gear. One tooth off will be very visible, so mark or take a pic of where it is and duplicate on install. I just glance at the location and remember it.

If for some reason you get messed up with the gear install, the FSM has the proper orientation as if starting from scratch.

Mucho appreciated Meep. I'll add that to the mental file when it's time .. which will be this week hopefully. I'll check out the FSM tonight and get some images to help.

 

[nervus rt]

Just started my 440, after 6 years. Drain and replace gas and oil, Remove spark plugs, squirt trans fluid into each spark plug hole,( a couple of squirts from a small oil can) Free's up the rings, Put new plugs in each hole, Charge battery, fire it up!

 

[miller]

As Meep said, I'd definately pull the valve covers, before you preoil. But, with the valve covers off, look for any signs of rust. Motors sitting around like that can 'sweat', and rust in unusal places inside the motor. Doesn't hurt to look!
Also recommend having the covers off, for the 'first' preoil. If all is good, even preoiling by hand (how I do it), you should get oil pooling into the rocker arms, both sides. It's whether you have a grooved cam journal, cam bearing, or plain jane stuff, if you have to rotate to oil both rocker shafts. I'd also rotate the motor a few times, to make sure it swings free.

Using trans fluid is good...but it will smoke big time...for just a short. No biggie!

If it's a go, back on with the valve covers, and just before you want to fire off, I'd preoil again. Just plan on that, only leaving the plugs and dizzy install needed, to fire off.
Dropping in the distributor drive, and distributor is nothing. Just bring #1 to TDC, drop the drive gear in, so the 'slot' is in line with the crank (and engaged with the oil pump), then the dizzy.

 

[Cranky]

Hey, this thread is like 73 years old!!

 

[coronet340]

Hey, this thread is like 73 years old!!

I was about to comment oh his math skills when he said "like 10 years" until I looked left. lol

 

[miller]

Wow! That is sitting on the deal.

 

[Garys1969RR]

We just spent around eighty dollars for a 3/8 fuel pick up that goes in the tank, for my sons 1970 Super Bee! Advance auto parts. Spectre line. And they also have the gasket for another 4 dollars. We are installing a nitrous oxide boost system, so figured we needed the extra fuel delivery capacity, which the 3/8 pick up provides.