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Solid Rollers or Flat Tappet for street and strip. Looking for LONGEVITY and low maintenance!

biomedtechguy

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Unsure of cam specs, but the engine will be a Bill Mitchell aluminum block, 4.50 bore and 4.25 stroke for 541 cu in.
Trick Flow 270s (Max Wedge ports)
Horsepower and Torque 700 HP? and as flat and high torque # as possible w/7,000 RPM capability.
7,000 RPM capability based on current tire height (25.6") and Wallace calculator 10.4 second 1/4 mile at 133 MPH 3,800 lbs. 4.10 gear.
Now I am certainly open to changes!
I may need a taller tire so as to not have to spin up to 7k, or maybe put the 3.54 gears back in?
BUT
Given the Bill Mitchell aluminum block, Molnar crankshaft and 7.100 rods, matching quality pistons-that can also handle the occasional 150-200 shot of nitrous (if I ever manage to harness the power I already have) springs and so on 7k RPM should be no sweat for reliability.
I guess the easiest way to deal with RPMs is a taller tire. If I wind up going over 133 MPH (like if I do hit the juice) I don't want to have to live with the bad manners and maintenance I ASSUME would come with a 7,500 RPM engine.
These are questions as much as they are projected parameters. I'm trying to paint a picture of what I will wind up with so I can get advice on lifters and maintenance.
Back to my question:
What is the best lifter so as to not wind up with needle bearings scattered throughout my oil pan, or having to rebuild lifters, etc. and still choose a lifter that works with the cam that works with everything else?
I don't mind an "annual maintenance weekend" if neccessary, but I have to be honest and say I'd rather not have to spend a lot of time under the hood.
 
Man, you are really throwing some money into your car!
 
Man, you are really throwing some money into your car!
Will be, however long it takes.
I don't want the "power ceiling" and wear or breakage concerns that come with a stock block. I figure why invest so much in something that could fail and has limits built in, limits that if I want to go beyond I would have to start over with an aftermarket block anyway. So say I add the best girdle and caps, and the cost of that. Then I have to be able to have someone find a factory block that has good walls, no bad core shift, etc, that I can trust, and buy that block, add that cap and girdle kit and the machining involved.
Well it's not that big a step to a Bulldog iron block, at $3,900, and that's even heavier than the factory block. So stepping up from there, less than $2k gets me an aluminum block. That saves me 150 to 200 pounds off the front end, and "WOW! That's an aluminum block?!" is worth some money to me at cruise ins and car shows.
So what am I going to do with my aluminum block? Put Eagle crank and rods in it? I was going to use Eagle in a factory block based build, but when AndyF says "If it was my engine I would________"
then if Andy would do it and is kind enough to offer me his advice? Damn straight I'm going to do what he would, because how can that be the wrong advice to follow...Besides, every time I see a higher end build, I usually see Molnar associated with it.
To me, this is a one time only thing, my Roadrunner is a big investment but also the centerpiece of the fun things I do because I do so much classic cars related stuff for fun. Cruising, monthly car shows, and racing, so why not?
 
Who will be checking the machine work and heads before final blueprinting??
John Mercedes is who I'm dealing with at Southeast Performance R/T. He is brokering the block, TF270s, and as many of the components that he can get at the best price/value. I looked up the Molnar crankshaft and it's around $900. For something like this, spending more if it buys me: peace of mind, performance, longevity, stability, strength, rarity and some bling and bragging rights makes it worthwhile. I can only do what I can, when I can, so we've already discussed there being a longer timetable involved and he said he would work with me, so I'm in.
The only way to a completed stroker is to start, and that block is one heck of a starting point.
If my life explodes at some point in the build process, look in the for sale forum for some killer deals...
 
The interaction with him and some unique "connecting points" convinced me that I have found someone I can work with, and trust.
Here's a sample of the credentials that his shop/business has that really impressed me:
"I have two shops, one is cylinder head repair and porting with over 35 years’ experience. The other is engine building with cylinder head modifications. I hired the chief engine builder from Penske Chrysler Nascar who was laid off when Chrysler backed out of Nascar. I also hired the chief cylinder head expert from Joe Gibbs pro stock. He was in charge of all cylinder head modifications for Gibbs racing. Over 30 years’ experience."
Works for me...
 
I'll tell you, you, AndyF, Jim Laroy, and many many others on this forum are and have been so helpful and inspiring, even if the advice was counter to the direction I thought I wanted to go.
For example, I was "sure" that I was going to get a RMS or Gerst triangulated 4 link, and while ultimately I will do what I want to do with my car, the Assassin/Calvert rear suspension will work great for me, be easier for me to adjust, and easier should mean more successful in having it do the job I bought it for. It's more easily reversed too, because I have some degree of custodial responsibility for my real V-code Roadrunner. I'm fogging (storing) the engine that's in it now, because that's a known commodity, that runs strong, and one day, hopefully after my dirt nap has begun, the current engine may make the car more marketable if my wife or heir decides to sell it, or if life forces me to.
In the meantime, the forum helps me make the right choices, or at least makes me aware of what choices I have, and most importantly, motivates me to see it through.
I've already bought a bunch of stuff for the Roadrunner that I still need to install, and once the Wilwood brakes come in, those and the QA1 K-member and front suspension I've owned for a year are going in. Some of the other stuff (Vintage Air AC, Hydromax T.O. bearing) will have to wait until I can afford to have it installed or do it myself, but doing it myself takes time, being a one man business usually means time costs money. I want to do the rear suspension asap too, because it doesn't make sense to put any more power under the hood when I'm not getting off the line traction now. I want to go ahead and get the block in the next 6 months though because they are available and that will push me to get that build done, although it will take some time.
 
Will be, however long it takes.
I don't want the "power ceiling" and wear or breakage concerns that come with a stock block. I figure why invest so much in something that could fail and has limits built in, limits that if I want to go beyond I would have to start over with an aftermarket block anyway. So say I add the best girdle and caps, and the cost of that. Then I have to be able to have someone find a factory block that has good walls, no bad core shift, etc, that I can trust, and buy that block, add that cap and girdle kit and the machining involved.
Well it's not that big a step to a Bulldog iron block, at $3,900, and that's even heavier than the factory block. So stepping up from there, less than $2k gets me an aluminum block. That saves me 150 to 200 pounds off the front end, and "WOW! That's an aluminum block?!" is worth some money to me at cruise ins and car shows.
So what am I going to do with my aluminum block? Put Eagle crank and rods in it? I was going to use Eagle in a factory block based build, but when AndyF says "If it was my engine I would________"
then if Andy would do it and is kind enough to offer me his advice? Damn straight I'm going to do what he would, because how can that be the wrong advice to follow...Besides, every time I see a higher end build, I usually see Molnar associated with it.
To me, this is a one time only thing, my Roadrunner is a big investment but also the centerpiece of the fun things I do because I do so much classic cars related stuff for fun. Cruising, monthly car shows, and racing, so why not?
BioMed....Speaking of high end builds my 1011HP 572 Hemi has a Molnar Crank and BME (Bill Mitchell) forged aluminum rods....best you can get...it also has a Donovan Gear Drive up front.
Heck, why not just build a Hemi to start with....think about that....
Get a Hemi block rather than a wedge block to start with then go from there.
Don't get real crazy with valve spring pressures, etc and the motor would be real reliable.
You can top it off with a Ray Barton Single Plane intake with a 1450 Dominator and easily make 900HP. And of course, the Hemi blocks are 4 bolt mains so making well over 1000 up to 1500HP is not a problem for that block...no worries about girdles, etc...and put on all the Nitrous you want.
again..think about it...Want to be a hit at car shows, etc...this will do it !
1st picture is my motor but 2nd picture shows a nice Hemi with the Ray Barton Single Plane intake and a BIG Dominator (plus I think there is even Nitrous on that setup) plus looks like it has a vacuum pump setup.

2.jpg untitled 1.png
 
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Thanks Mike, and you too have been a great help.
I just mentioned my "custodial responsibility" of having a real V-code Roadrunner (non #s engine) and I've said a hundred times whatever I wind up with it will be fed by 3x2 of something. It's got to be a Wedge too Mike.
Gen 2 Hemi engines are the pinnacle of Mopar power as far as I'm concerned, and they have a much more widely known legendary status than a 6bbl RB, but I will do my best to make my 70 Roadrunner a "local legend" and have a lot of fun with it I hope. So far, it has overall been a great car to own, show, drive, and I have even had some fun racing it, but that is on hold until I get the front suspension and brakes installed, and I probably won't go back to the track again until I at least have the Hydramax hydraulic throwout bearing and HitMaster launch control system installed. I'd like to wait until I can get the Assassin/Calvert rear suspension system installed, but I may have to hit the track for a little "before and after" test and tune.
For the benefit of the forum and the data I can provide, of course....lol.
 
Bio , I got a bitchin tool box , how do I get a the medical equipment gig going? , lol.
 
Bio, I think your original question was roller or solid flat tappet cam? I have run both for many thousand runs on each. I have "worn out" roller lifters, not failed but the needles were getting rough. Never had issues with any of my flat tappets. I believe you can find solid flat tappets that can produce the type of power you want. "Back in the day" my mushroom solid cam made equal or greater than my roller cams. Just say'in. Check with the experts on what flat tappet would meet your needs or go for the lower friction of the roller, your choice.

I forgot, great idea to spend on the block. Wish I would have got a Mega Block when they were available.
 
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Tom Molnar is a great guy. Good parts at a reasonable cost. Lifters? In a word, bushed. I use Isky Red Zone. They are expensive. 420 [email protected]" lift 300#/820# spring pressure, still going. The previous Comp 929 failed in 216 passes. No more needle bearings for me.
Doug
 
Tom Molnar is a great guy. Good parts at a reasonable cost. Lifters? In a word, bushed. I use Isky Red Zone. They are expensive. 420 [email protected]" lift 300#/820# spring pressure, still going. The previous Comp 929 failed in 216 passes. No more needle bearings for me.
Doug
The world of roller lifters seems to be a game of “the latest gimmick”. Kind of like needle bearings in a rocker arm, bushings in a lifter make zero sense. My understanding is durability is no better than a bearing and the only upside is that there’s no needles to scatter inside an engine. Supposedly, they’re also more susceptible to any contamination in the oil. Having said all that, I have a set in my engine to try for myself. Time will tell.
 
Seems to me both needle bearings & bushings wear in rocker arms. All depends on the loads they get & the lubrication (clean oil). Roller lifters vs solid lifters???? Both have advantages.
 
If your not going to the top of the line on roller parts, which is no guarantee, then a good solid will be fine. EDM light weight solid lifters on top of a cam that fits the duration your driving in and with enough lift to take advantage of the cylinder heads flow capabilities is all you will need.
 
Bio, I think your original question was roller or solid flat tappet cam?
Back to my question:
What is the best lifter so as to not wind up with needle bearings scattered throughout my oil pan, or having to rebuild lifters, etc. and still choose a lifter that works with the cam that works with everything else?
I don't mind an "annual maintenance weekend" if neccessary, but I have to be honest and say I'd rather not have to spend a lot of time under the hood.
 
I have my opinion that comes from an expensive learning curve. Be that as it may with ANY lifter if you stay on top of the valve lash you can see when a lifter is going south.
OH! WAIT,,,,,your already SOUTH:rofl:
 
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