The slug 400 on the dyno.

[IQ52]

Understand from the get-go, this isn't a high performance 400 B engine build. This is what the customer wanted for his '72 Dodge pickup. Lots of things could have been done differently. But with the instructions, "My employees will be driving this truck, I don't want anything wild," we settled on a 7.5:1 compression, 85 octane, 2bbl rebuild.

Decked and then bored +.030" and honed with a torque plate.
Stock replacement cast pistons.
The stock 1972 2bbl holley and stock 2bbl cast iron intake.
We fudged some with the cylinder heads. 346 heads with hard exhaust seats, 2.14/1.81 valves and flowing.

Lift.............INT/EXH

.100............85/58
.200..........164/120
.300..........217/168
.400..........234/198
.500..........253/212

Camshaft is the Summit 6400, 214/224 @ .050, 444"/466" @ 1.5:1
New, take off, 440 Source valve springs set at 120# seat, 240# @ .450" lift
Comp 10 degree retainers and locks.
Standard Sealed Power oil pump 45 psi hot oil pressure at 750 rpm idle and 75 psi @ 5200 rpm.
Stock 1972 400 distributor recurved. 18 degrees initial 37 degrees total @ 2500 rpm.
And used our dyno headers.

We dyno'd it with the 2bbl carb and intake and then switched to a 383 Holley Street Dominator and a Quick Fuel Q950. What follows are the results.


RPM................2BBL TQ/HP................4BBL TQ/HP

2500....................351/167.....................337/160
2600....................350/173.....................334/165
2700....................355/183.....................325/167
2800....................367/195.....................325/173
2900....................371/205.....................337/186
3000....................368/210.....................359/205
3100....................369/218.....................379/224
3200....................366/223.....................381/232
3300....................367/231.....................389/245
3400....................361/234.....................399/258
3500....................359/239.....................400/267
3600....................360/247.....................399/274
3700....................354/249.....................399/281
3800....................351/254.....................402/291
3900....................343/255.....................403/299
4000....................337/256.....................401/306
4100....................329/257.....................401/313
4200....................325/260.....................398/318
4300....................326/267.....................397/325
4400....................323/270.....................396/332
4500....................322/276.....................383.328
4600....................307/269.....................381/334
4700....................318/285.....................386/345
4800....................308/281.....................383/350
4900....................302/281.....................375/349
5000....................297/283.....................370/352

Made a backup run with the 4BBL and it made 397 LB-FT @ 3600 rpm and 361 HP @ 5100 rpm.

Ahhh, 7.515:1 compression? Yep!

Not too bad considering that the 10:1 HP383 was listed at 335 horsepower and the 10:1 HP440 engine was listed at 375 horsepower.

Now we put the 2BBL back on and the customer can install the 400 in his truck.

 

[5wndwcpe]

Cool beans, thanks for posting, I love threads like this.

 

[moparmarks]

Pretty dang good numbers from a slug.

 

[67Satty]

Dang, it really liked that 4 barrel!

 

[Badvert65]

Great info. I am assembling a similar engine for my 65 Belvedere Bracket car to work out any bus before the 440 goes in. Gives me some idea on how it might run.

 

[YY1]

Any idea how that street dominator works versus a torker 383?

 

[69 GTX]

Interesting......

 

[IQ52]

Any idea how that street dominator works versus a torker 383?

Sorry, no idea about the Torker 383. Wish I had an Edelbrock Performer RPM to try on it also, but I didn't buy one just to satisfy my curiosity.

 

[451Mopar]

Made more power below 3,000 RPM with the 2-bbl. Think that is from the intake design or the carb or both?

 

[super-bee_ski]

Great build IQ 52!

 

[IQ52]

Made more power below 3,000 RPM with the 2-bbl. Think that is from the intake design or the carb or both?

It seems to be the intake design as the fuel mixture was better with the 4bbl. I get better torque with all the iron dual plane intakes below 3000 rpm.

 

[YY1]

Sorry, no idea about the Torker 383. Wish I had an Edelbrock Performer RPM to try on it also, but I didn't buy one just to satisfy my curiosity.

Yep, I was looking for an RPM, but found a swap meet torker for $60.

Seems like it's been "cool" to dislike the torker for a few years, and that's making them cheap.

Since it's a similar design as the street dom, I though maybe you'd done a side by side in the past.

 

[IQ52]

Great build IQ 52!

Thanks, the owner is a little worried that it will be too much power for his employees even with the 2bbl. I tell him, "Okay, we'll retard the spark when you put it in the truck."

The horsepower is just incidental when you build a clean engine. It's like you can't keep it from happening.

Dad built a 440 for a circle track A-Body in 1982. The owner said, "Put as much power in it as you can." The first time the owner came out of the corner and rolled on the throttle the car went up the track and slammed into the wall on the front straight.

He went immediately into the pits and shouted, "Take some horsepower OUT!"

I guess it runs in the family.

 

[451Mopar]

It seems to be the intake design as the fuel mixture was better with the 4bbl. I get better torque with all the iron dual plane intakes below 3000 rpm.

It would be interesting to put an adaptor on the stock intake for the 4-bbl to see if the intake or carb is the choke point?

 

[IQ52]

It would be interesting to put an adaptor on the stock intake for the 4-bbl to see if the intake or carb is the choke point?

I'm sure that both the intake and carburetor really stink. Here is a flow test on an mildly ported RPM cylinder head. Then we attached a stock 1969 iron 4bbl manifold and a 850 Mighty Demon carburetor and reflowed the head. Next was an Edelbrock Performer RPM manifold and the same 850 Demon carb. We also did a Torker II, M1 and a Victor but I won't list their flows right now. This is just to give you an idea how poorly the stock iron intake flows. 1st column is just the cylinder head flows, 2nd column is the head with the stock intake and the 850, 3rd column is the head with the RPM intake and 850 Demon.

Lift.............1...................2...................3

.100..........72.................69..................71
.200.........150...............131................145
.300.........212...............172................195
.400.........254...............187................228
.500.........276...............199................240
.600.........290...............203................251
.700.........302...............204................256

Even at .400" lift the stock iron 4bbl intake is flowing 41 cfm less that the RPM intake. At .400" lift the stock iron intake with the Demon carb is 55 cfm behind the Torker II with the Demon.

 

[Ghostrider 67]

440 wedge warm up.

Hey IQ52, and any others of this ragtag band of MOPers that are interested, can you please give your expert opinion as to what YOU would do to a 1974 440 wedge V8 to warm it up? Going into a 67 Coronet. It has a steel crank and is stock otherwise, has a big 4bbl carb(Holley) that iv'e yet to identify. Discuss amongstyerselfs.

Understand from the get-go, this isn't a high performance 400 B engine build. This is what the customer wanted for his '72 Dodge pickup. Lots of things could have been done differently. But with the instructions, "My employees will be driving this truck, I don't want anything wild," we settled on a 7.5:1 compression, 85 octane, 2bbl rebuild.

Decked and then bored +.030" and honed with a torque plate.
Stock replacement cast pistons.
The stock 1972 2bbl holley and stock 2bbl cast iron intake.
We fudged some with the cylinder heads. 346 heads with hard exhaust seats, 2.14/1.81 valves and flowing.

Lift.............INT/EXH

.100............85/58
.200..........164/120
.300..........217/168
.400..........234/198
.500..........253/212

Camshaft is the Summit 6400, 214/224 @ .050, 444"/466" @ 1.5:1
New, take off, 440 Source valve springs set at 120# seat, 240# @ .450" lift
Comp 10 degree retainers and locks.
Standard Sealed Power oil pump 45 psi hot oil pressure at 750 rpm idle and 75 psi @ 5200 rpm.
Stock 1972 400 distributor recurved. 18 degrees initial 37 degrees total @ 2500 rpm.
And used our dyno headers.

We dyno'd it with the 2bbl carb and intake and then switched to a 383 Holley Street Dominator and a Quick Fuel Q950. What follows are the results.


RPM................2BBL TQ/HP................4BBL TQ/HP

2500....................351/167.....................337/160
2600....................350/173.....................334/165
2700....................355/183.....................325/167
2800....................367/195.....................325/173
2900....................371/205.....................337/186
3000....................368/210.....................359/205
3100....................369/218.....................379/224
3200....................366/223.....................381/232
3300....................367/231.....................389/245
3400....................361/234.....................399/258
3500....................359/239.....................400/267
3600....................360/247.....................399/274
3700....................354/249.....................399/281
3800....................351/254.....................402/291
3900....................343/255.....................403/299
4000....................337/256.....................401/306
4100....................329/257.....................401/313
4200....................325/260.....................398/318
4300....................326/267.....................397/325
4400....................323/270.....................396/332
4500....................322/276.....................383.328
4600....................307/269.....................381/334
4700....................318/285.....................386/345
4800....................308/281.....................383/350
4900....................302/281.....................375/349
5000....................297/283.....................370/352

Made a backup run with the 4BBL and it made 397 LB-FT @ 3600 rpm and 361 HP @ 5100 rpm.

Ahhh, 7.515:1 compression? Yep!

Not too bad considering that the 10:1 HP383 was listed at 335 horsepower and the 10:1 HP440 engine was listed at 375 horsepower.

Now we put the 2BBL back on and the customer can install the 400 in his truck.

 

[jprather]

man oh man, i wish you were in florida, i'd just bring it to you!

 

[casey henson]

Understand from the get-go, this isn't a high performance 400 B engine build. This is what the customer wanted for his '72 Dodge pickup. Lots of things could have been done differently. But with the instructions, "My employees will be driving this truck, I don't want anything wild," we settled on a 7.5:1 compression, 85 octane, 2bbl rebuild.

Decked and then bored +.030" and honed with a torque plate.
Stock replacement cast pistons.
The stock 1972 2bbl holley and stock 2bbl cast iron intake.
We fudged some with the cylinder heads. 346 heads with hard exhaust seats, 2.14/1.81 valves and flowing.

Lift.............INT/EXH

.100............85/58
.200..........164/120
.300..........217/168
.400..........234/198
.500..........253/212

Camshaft is the Summit 6400, 214/224 @ .050, 444"/466" @ 1.5:1
New, take off, 440 Source valve springs set at 120# seat, 240# @ .450" lift
Comp 10 degree retainers and locks.
Standard Sealed Power oil pump 45 psi hot oil pressure at 750 rpm idle and 75 psi @ 5200 rpm.
Stock 1972 400 distributor recurved. 18 degrees initial 37 degrees total @ 2500 rpm.
And used our dyno headers.

We dyno'd it with the 2bbl carb and intake and then switched to a 383 Holley Street Dominator and a Quick Fuel Q950. What follows are the results.


RPM................2BBL TQ/HP................4BBL TQ/HP

2500....................351/167.....................337/160
2600....................350/173.....................334/165
2700....................355/183.....................325/167
2800....................367/195.....................325/173
2900....................371/205.....................337/186
3000....................368/210.....................359/205
3100....................369/218.....................379/224
3200....................366/223.....................381/232
3300....................367/231.....................389/245
3400....................361/234.....................399/258
3500....................359/239.....................400/267
3600....................360/247.....................399/274
3700....................354/249.....................399/281
3800....................351/254.....................402/291
3900....................343/255.....................403/299
4000....................337/256.....................401/306
4100....................329/257.....................401/313
4200....................325/260.....................398/318
4300....................326/267.....................397/325
4400....................323/270.....................396/332
4500....................322/276.....................383.328
4600....................307/269.....................381/334
4700....................318/285.....................386/345
4800....................308/281.....................383/350
4900....................302/281.....................375/349
5000....................297/283.....................370/352

Made a backup run with the 4BBL and it made 397 LB-FT @ 3600 rpm and 361 HP @ 5100 rpm.

Ahhh, 7.515:1 compression? Yep!

Not too bad considering that the 10:1 HP383 was listed at 335 horsepower and the 10:1 HP440 engine was listed at 375 horsepower.

Now we put the 2BBL back on and the customer can install the 400 in his truck.

I wonder how much a set of HP exhaust manifolds would change these numbers if any ?