Timing issue?

Frankb

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Having many problems getting this engine to run. 400/511. I'm not sure of the timing. In the pic there are two marks: white mark on post #1 of distributor cap and a black mark on distributor base. The black mark represents where rotor is pointing with engine at TDC on compression stroke. The black mark is about 1/2 inch to the right of the #1 terminal on cap which means the rotor is not lined up exactly with #1 spark plug wire. Its a half inch off. Does the rotor need to be in exact alignment with the distributor cap terminal to be correct? Looks to me like rotor has passed by #1 terminal when engine is exactly at TDC? Does distributor need to come out and be re-positioned in engine??

timing marks.jpg
 

MoparLeo

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Here is the info right out of your Factory Service Manual. Do you have one ?
 

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sam65

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The rotor will be passed the no1 terminal because initial timing is where the rotor should line up with the terminal. So what ever you have your initial timing set at put that degree mark on the zero on timing tab and rotor should be close.
 

1 Wild R/T

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Lots of variables & lots of questions.... The factory service manual is great if your car were stock... 500 CI isn't stock.... How much cam? What distributor/ignition? If the timing it locked the yeah the rotor should point at the tower... But if it has advance whether it's mechanical/vacuum or computer controlled and the advancing hasn't occurred yet then the rotor needs to be past the tower and as the timing advances the rotor will move toward the tower...
 

MoparLeo

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The Service manual gives you a start. Naturally you will have to advance the timing to get it started. He said that his problem was getting it to run.
Also has the actual tdc mark on the balancer been verified ? Verifying tdc would be the first thing to do.
 

Bee1971

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383/432 Stroker

Engine running at idle

16 degrees before

I wanted to check rotor phasing so I punched a hole above #1 in an old distributor cap

Snapped picture with engine running at idle - Also have a few videos

Then I brought up RPMs with both ported vacuum and just mechanical advance

Perfection

AFA2E17B-8FF5-4E39-9740-455C7BBE36E2.jpeg
 

Frankb

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Its a hyperspark dist. Directions say "Position the rotor contact so it is pointing to the desired direction of the #1 spark plug wire". Thats what directions say. Well, it is and it doesn't run. So I gu half inch was close. I don't know. I guess its not because it wont run
 

Bee1971

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Don’t you also have to phase the distributor housing also


4. Next, place the provided clear distributor cap over the rotor, the cap is formed to accept the rotor, as seen below in (Figure 1).
5. Now, rotate the distributor housing until the housing locks into the cap, this process phases the distributor housing. The below
image shows the cap and distributor housing in their “locked” position (Figure 2).
 
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1 Wild R/T

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Its a hyperspark dist. Directions say "Position the rotor contact so it is pointing to the desired direction of the #1 spark plug wire". Thats what directions say. Well, it is and it doesn't run. So I gu half inch was close. I don't know. I guess its not because it wont run

Are you sure it's a rotor phasing issue? Does it have spark? Hyperspark is the Holley EFI distributor, do the injectors fire? Does it have fuel pressure? No starts can go in many directions..
 

Frankb

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Yes the dist was phased. Exactly how directions said. Clear cap was used. Now that I think about it, I had to rotate the dist about I'd guess 10-15 degrees to get the cap to align on the rotor.
Thanks 413, that's on the list
I don't know why car won't run. Actually it starts but runs like ****. Spark yes, injectors yes, manual gauge for full pressure. Pressure's perfect.

I was going to remove the dist, rotate rotor clockwise, reinstall. If it doesn't line up then at least it will be BTDC, not ATDC where it is now.

Appreciate all the input. Just really frustrated with this car right now
 

1 Wild R/T

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Yes the dist was phased. Exactly how directions said. Clear cap was used. Now that I think about it, I had to rotate the dist about I'd guess 10-15 degrees to get the cap to align on the rotor.
Thanks 413, that's on the list
I don't know why car won't run. Actually it starts but runs like ****. Spark yes, injectors yes, manual gauge for full pressure. Pressure's perfect.

I was going to remove the dist, rotate rotor clockwise, reinstall. If it doesn't line up then at least it will be BTDC, not ATDC where it is now.

Appreciate all the input. Just really frustrated with this car right now
I tend to think your looking in the wrong place.. Rotor phasing issues typically show up at higher RPM's if it's close enough to fire it's close enough to run reasonable up to around 4K... Something else is going on...

Holley's clear cap alignment tool works & if you used it I would tend to trust the rotor phasing... Want confirmation? Grab a spare cap & drill a hole as shown in the video I linked above..
 

MoparLeo

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Have you verified actual TDC on your balancer ?
Here is the procedure:( one of them anyway)

One way for sure to find out - buy a piston stop tool, install it in #1 spark plug hole.
Big socket on crank bolt, spin the engine SLOWLY until #1 piston hits the stop on the compression stroke.
Mark the balancer (the dots on the one in the pic below).
Spin the engine the opposite way, then when the piston hits the piston stop tool again.
Mark the balancer again.
TRUE TDC is exactly halfway between your "dots".
In the example below, it was, fortunately. Balancer timing mark verified!

timing-marks-verified-jpg.jpg


number one plug wire 440.jpeg




383 440 firing order diagram.png
 

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  • 383-440 DISTRIBUTOR OIL PUMP DRIVE INSTALL (1) (1) (2) (1) (1).pdf
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RemCharger

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Yes the dist was phased. Exactly how directions said. Clear cap was used. Now that I think about it, I had to rotate the dist about I'd guess 10-15 degrees to get the cap to align on the rotor.
Thanks 413, that's on the list
I don't know why car won't run. Actually it starts but runs like ****. Spark yes, injectors yes, manual gauge for full pressure. Pressure's perfect.

I was going to remove the dist, rotate rotor clockwise, reinstall. If it doesn't line up then at least it will be BTDC, not ATDC where it is now.

Appreciate all the input. Just really frustrated with this car right now
You say it runs.. that means it has spark and must be close.

NOW, what's this about fuel injection?? Do we just assume that it dialed itself in , in 1 second?
 
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