Tips for 'restoring' old lacquer paint?

[Triplegreen500]

So, I've been having moderate success on my '70 Charger. It has an old, non-original paint job on it. It was a FL car all its life, and I suspect paint fade and/or a garage door incident on a quarter panel (and subsequent "we can't match it so we'll paint the whole thing") caused the car to be shot in a different light green than the factory F4. It's laquer, single-stage, no clear. Crackle-glaze, the whole nine yards. The rear is worse than the front (it must have had its *** pointed out of the carport or garage most of its life).

I've hand-wet-sanded the entire car. First with 1000 grit; then 1500; finally 3000 on an orbital, followed by polishing compound on an orbital, and hand-waxing. Looking across the finish, the shine appears nice and sharp, but looking at the finish the reflections are...blurry, is the best way to describe it. Like the surface isn't smooth/glossy, even though my fingers squeak when I slide them across it.

I'm thinking of getting another couple sets of sanding sponges and doing it all again...but I don't want to burn through.

I am NOT a body guy; this is the first time I've ever put sandpaper to a vehicle finish and I'm actually ecstatic that I haven't burned through to bare metal or primer yet! Does anyone (with actual bodywork experience LOL) have any ideas? I know it's hard to be specific without seeing the actual paint, and photos...well, they're difficult to get, and have show what I'm talking about.

In this photo, you can see what I mean by "looking across" the finish - it's nice and shiny and glossy from this angle in this light:

But if I look AT the paint, like standing by a front wheel and look at the hood, it's like I can see scratches and buff marks in it. Very odd. Almost like as if it was a clearcoat finish, and the color coat under the smooth clearcoat was what was scratched...

This is why I don't do bodywork...

 

[Nevada dan]

you've probably got it as good as it's ever going to look , laquer doesn't like temperature changes that's what causes a lot of the cracking , checking , you don't even want it under new paint , laquer primer included , it was used because it was cheap , just keep it waxed and enjoy your car the only alternative is to strip and repaint

 

[69 Sleeper Bee]

Even with the questionable paint it is still a beautiful car. I live in Florida and the sun really does a number on old paint jobs.
Like Nevada dan says, keeping it waxed is the best you can do without a strip and repaint.

 

[Michael_]

Judging by the photo it looks good enough for me!
It looks gorgeous in this picture ^^

 

[diesel_lv]

My '67 has the original paint, El Paso TX sun for 29 yrs, Las Vegas sun for 18 yrs and Fort Mohave AZ sun since 2014. Always garaged, but still driven to work n parked in the sun. They never had modern, glass looking paint jobs to begin with. Clay bar it n wax it n enjoy it.

 

[1968rt]

Just wet sanded and buffed my laquer paint after 35 years. looks very good! i have a gallon of TT1 light green if you need any. should be close to F4

 

[Nevada dan]

View attachment 1099829 My '67 has the original paint, El Paso TX sun for 29 yrs, Las Vegas sun for 18 yrs and Fort Mohave AZ sun since 2014. Always garaged, but still driven to work n parked in the sun. They never had modern, glass looking paint jobs to begin with. Clay bar it n wax it n enjoy it.

Your paint if its original is alkyd enamel was a pretty durable paint, oops I mean acrylic enamel , alkyd was before that

 

[slimt]

Working with Acrylic Lacquer back in the day was very forgiving and easy to use. A really good product. I caught a good portion of it when I started in the trade in 1974.

 

[RM23M9A]

So, I've been having moderate success on my '70 Charger. It has an old, non-original paint job on it. It was a FL car all its life, and I suspect paint fade and/or a garage door incident on a quarter panel (and subsequent "we can't match it so we'll paint the whole thing") caused the car to be shot in a different light green than the factory F4. It's laquer, single-stage, no clear. Crackle-glaze, the whole nine yards. The rear is worse than the front (it must have had its *** pointed out of the carport or garage most of its life).

I've hand-wet-sanded the entire car. First with 1000 grit; then 1500; finally 3000 on an orbital, followed by polishing compound on an orbital, and hand-waxing. Looking across the finish, the shine appears nice and sharp, but looking at the finish the reflections are...blurry, is the best way to describe it. Like the surface isn't smooth/glossy, even though my fingers squeak when I slide them across it.

I'm thinking of getting another couple sets of sanding sponges and doing it all again...but I don't want to burn through.

I am NOT a body guy; this is the first time I've ever put sandpaper to a vehicle finish and I'm actually ecstatic that I haven't burned through to bare metal or primer yet! Does anyone (with actual bodywork experience LOL) have any ideas? I know it's hard to be specific without seeing the actual paint, and photos...well, they're difficult to get, and have show what I'm talking about.

In this photo, you can see what I mean by "looking across" the finish - it's nice and shiny and glossy from this angle in this light:

View attachment 1099766

But if I look AT the paint, like standing by a front wheel and look at the hood, it's like I can see scratches and buff marks in it. Very odd. Almost like as if it was a clearcoat finish, and the color coat under the smooth clearcoat was what was scratched...

This is why I don't do bodywork...

You ARE Wet-Sanding that 3000? That WILL make a difference.. My A12's that way, my father and I painted it "Nut & Bolt" 30 yrs ago. "The ONLY way You'll EVER Drive that Car Boy" kinda father. Well, now I own it. He pointed out how we WEREN'T fixing some Imperfections "Because in April 1969, that's how they Came off the Line". (My Dad's quotes). Its a driver. So its gonna get chips etc. I even learned to LEAD (Shhhhh!) no epa lol! You're doing it the right way. Latest thing I had to do was a 1/4 panel extension.
Had a big chip in the V2 paint I couldnt live with. Took FOREVER! As Im a perfectionist. But, one thing I learned was I can only get it so close to that OLD single stage, using today's Urethane crap. The less I dwelled on it and now have to tinker with Ye Ole 6 Pack? I forgot all about how the CORRECT V2 paint is just a shade off, and I had to model brush in a few chips.
This is why I'm an ELECTRICAL guy, not body work. Paint's more frustrating to me anyway.
(BTW, Lynch Road never used gaskets, just seam sealer & a finger)! As I learned...

 

[Photon440]

A couple of my old bodywork/paint books from over forty years ago remark that old lacquer paint that shows checks or crazing can be helped by spraying a coat of straight lacquer thinner (slow dry) over the whole body to allow the paint to 'melt' back into a smooth surface.

But if I look AT the paint, like standing by a front wheel and look at the hood, it's like I can see scratches and buff marks in it. Very odd. Almost like as if it was a clearcoat finish, and the color coat under the smooth clearcoat was what was scratched...

As for the sub surface scratches, you could be right about your idea. Some of those paints had low hiding properties and were partially translucent, so if the primer under the colour wasn't properly smoothed and had some light sanding marks, they could show through beneath the surface as you described even though the outer surface is now polished smooth.

 

[Triplegreen500]

Yes, all surface work is being done wet - wet-sanding, and liquid wax/compound. I never do anything dry (heheh...).

I tried to get some pics in the garage last night to illustrate.

Nice and glassy:

...especially if you look at the reflection of the motorcycle. (Yeah, the stains are in the paint...they're patina!) But, when you look down AT the paint, it gets blurry:

Quarter panel:

Trunk:

(and no, I haven't done anything at all to the dutchmen's panel at the base of the back window...it's on the list).

A good point above about the base being scratched/uneven. I don't know why the car was painted. I suspect living in Florida faded it...or, the one spot where my magnet doesn't stick (top of the driver rear wheel opening) rubbed against a garage door frame and when they repaired it and couldn't match the paint, they painted the whole car (the wrong shade). It looks like a $99 Earl Sheib job - no trim removed, most of the dirt wiped off before painting...but lord knows what kind of "prep" went into it.

I just hate to keep wet-sanding it, and end up burning through the top color is all.

I have thought about painting it. But, I like the originality - every panel is original, the paint is original-ish (my guesstimate is late 70s/early 80s), and it has a TON of patina. But...I hate the rub strips on the sides, and there's no way to get them off without painting. And if I get into stripping before paint...what will I find? How much will it snowball?

I just need to get over my OCD and live with it. I may take one more swipe at it with fresh sponges - wet 1000, wet 1500, wet 3000, then another round of compound and wax - and just be done with it.

For now.

 

[AR67GTX]

The crazing does sound like lacquer but I wonder if you really have an old enamel paint job. Refinish enamel was bad about going dull and non-reflective with time and i never had any luck bringing back a deep, reflective shine to it. From an angle it would look smooth and glossy after compounding and polishing, but looking directly into it, it would look cloudy and dull. Usually lacquer, if it was originally of good quality, will shine back up and have good depth and reflection after buffing.

 

[Triplegreen500]

Yeah...who knows. I got a lot of paperwork with the car (original dealer order, original bill of sale, original loan paperwork, broadcast sheet, owners manual, some random receipts)...but nothing about the paint, and nothing about the vinyl top that was added at some point (fender tag and broadcast sheet show painted roof; "Charger" emblems are in the wrong location).

Oh well. I'll just get it as nice as I can, and keep socking away cash for an eventual repaint and a fresh top (I like the vinyl, and the contrast of roof against quarter panel really shows off the curvy hips!). Appreciate all the input!

 

[RGAZ]

For older paints I have found the modern polishes just cannot get the shine right. So I swear by Meguiars #7 Show car Glaze. If you do some research you will find it is a very different compound and really designed for older paint styles. It is not a miracle treatment, but if you follow some of the Youtube suggestions and layer it on really thick so the oils seep in, its actually pretty good. Check it out, It made my old 64 Buick look way better.

RGAZ

 

[Nevada dan]

I don't know if that's laquer, it looks like old synthetic enamel like what shieb's used , if it was laquer you can tell by finding a place that wont show and rubbing a cloth rag with laquer thinner on it if it is laquer color will come off, enamel wont, if it is synthetic that's all the better your going to get, it's still a nice survivor and I wouldn't mind driving it at all

 

[Triplegreen500]

All good thoughts, thanks! I definitely enjoy driving it - mom bought a '70 500 brand new that was F8, vinyl top, green interior, 318, factory a/c...and my cousin totalled it in '75. This F4 car is about as close as I'll ever get to her old one - and it even has the same wheelcovers! (at least, until I upgrade from nonpower drums to power front discs...).

 

[slimt]

Keep in mind. Over the years. Any oils, sap , water droplets off a light post. Will Stain the finish. Sunlight will discolor the paint. On old enamels or lacquers , everytime you cut polish , you remove paint. It was this to begin with. Alot thinner over 40 plus years of wear. I have a 65 Coronet with the original paint from factory. Its kept its shine to a point. And it has its stains that have absorbed into the finish. Its all part of the charm. Its enamel on mine. Lead based lacquer primer underneath will give staining as well.

 

[Triplegreen500]

Yeah, I'm not worried about the stains. I like them - they're scars, and I wear MY scars with pride! (I have plenty of them!) I just like things to be as presentable as humanly possible - clean, well-kept, well-maintained. That's how I save money in life - I take care of stuff instead of letting it rot and die and having to repair or replace it.

Bought brand new in 1991. Total survivor - factory paint, factory interior, factory clutch fercrissakes.

My Cummins - 270,000 miles, it got a clutch at 250k, gives me 20mpg, I use it all the time for my gigs hauling my gear and it towed my Charger back from FL for me with no problem, 80mph, 17mpg, with the Charger behind it:

And its not just my toys - my company equipment, too. Professional PA system for live concerts. Electronics, cables, speakers, all of them carefully packed, stored, cataloged, maintained...they work every time I set them up, with no failures and no mid-show issues. I set up quick, it works every time, and every show sounds great. It pays off - I get a ton of gigs through word-of-mouth (well...I did, when the world was open for business...).

I work hard for my stuff...I like it to be as nice as possible

 

[Triplegreen500]

Well....someone posted a while back (maybe Kern?) where a buddy did some test polishing on their red car, with meguiars 110 and 210 compounds. I have been looking for those for a while...and tonight I found them!

The day I got the car:

And tonight. Final round of 1000 wet sand, 1500 wet sand, 3000 wet sand, meguiars 110, meguiars 210, and meguiars gold class wax:

Dutchmen panel, trunk, and passenger quarter panel top, are done. I'll work my way through the rest of the car this week and weekend.

I'm PSYCHED! That stuff is pure magic. Love it, thank you to everyone!!

 

[AR67GTX]

For older paints I have found the modern polishes just cannot get the shine right. So I swear by Meguiars #7 Show car Glaze. If you do some research you will find it is a very different compound and really designed for older paint styles. It is not a miracle treatment, but if you follow some of the Youtube suggestions and layer it on really thick so the oils seep in, its actually pretty good. Check it out, It made my old 64 Buick look way better.

RGAZ

I have an old Corvette and the guys on the C2 forum had an active thread recently about this same treatment and lots of favorable comments about the excellent results.