Torque Flight Skips 2nd

1962 - 1965 Mopars

  1. wagonwedge330

    wagonwedge330 Well-Known Member

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    Anyone ever had a torque flight shift from 1st gear to 3rd only when the car has sat overnight. I have 400 BB and PB torque flight in my ‘63 Polara. The trans has a small shift kit. Even more strange if we drive the car to a cruise or show, and maybe meet friends at a restaurant afterwards, the trans will shift perfectly, it pretty much has to sit at least over night, or several days. Any ideas if this might become an issue, or if anyone has had this problem, input appreciated!
     
  2. 493 Mike

    493 Mike FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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    Is this "no 2nd" shift only during the first shift sequence? Does it shift normally after the "no 2nd" sequence?
    Mike
     
  3. wagonwedge330

    wagonwedge330 Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Mike, my apologies, I should have given better details, but yes sir that’s correct....the trans only skips shifting to 2nd once, after that, it never misses a shift, performs perfectly each and every time m....1st to 2nd and from 2nd to 3rd. Thanks
     
  4. 4406bbl

    4406bbl Well-Known Member

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    Mine was worn reaction shaft, front pump and rear governor rings when it did that. Front rings had a hugh gap, can't believe it still worked.
     
  5. wagonwedge330

    wagonwedge330 Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for your input, I appreciate it. This transmission has probably 4,000 miles built by folks that has built several for me over the years. With that said, I understand anything is possible. I do appreciate it.
     
  6. dvw

    dvw Well-Known Member

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    Reaction shaft rings would affect 3rd and reverse. The only item being applied during the 1/2 shift is the front band. Could be a servo issue but I doubt it. My bet is the 1/2 shift valve is sticking in the valve body.
    Doug
     
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    • 4406bbl

      4406bbl Well-Known Member

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      True, but the governor plugs are behind the 1-2 and 2-3 shift valve with 5-40 psi, more with a shift kit, so leaking governor rings could do it. Shift kits make it worse for some reason, Gil Younger always said check those rings for this issue. Hope it is just a valve for you.
       
      Last edited: Sep 1, 2020
    • 493 Mike

      493 Mike FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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      I learned the hard way to check the governor seal rings back in 1971 at the dealership I was working for. Had to pull the trans on my dime and take the extension off. Just resealing the clutch packs did not do the job! That lesson taught me to completely disassemble and inspect EVERY part in the trans. Still do the same today.
      Mike
       
    • Dipstick

      Dipstick Well-Known Member

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      If that were true there would be no fluid supply for the 2-3 shift valve.
       
    • 4406bbl

      4406bbl Well-Known Member

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      Same story for me, a friend that worked at the dealership told me there was nothing back there to check when he taught me how to do a rebuild in the 70s, many still do not check those rings. I got to pull one on my dime too. You have to remember dealer mechanics are trying to beat the flatrate, and are working on new cars, parts are new so all do not need changed. I could be wrong but can't you slide the parking gear back and change those rings in the car?
       
    • dvw

      dvw Well-Known Member

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      If it were the governor rings why would it skip only the 1st 1/2 shift of the drive cycle?
      Doug
       
    • 493 Mike

      493 Mike FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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      I never tried but that ring material went somewhere and I wash everything. Torque flites and most GM trannys will tolerate a fair amount of dirt. Fords-really fussy.
      Mike
       
    • 4406bbl

      4406bbl Well-Known Member

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      Yes, polished up many c6 valve bodies, sticky valves.
       
    • 4406bbl

      4406bbl Well-Known Member

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      I can't answer that. If I was the OP I would remove the valve body, make sure all valves fall out when clean with no oil, then check the rings. The other classic issue with worn rings is no upshift at all till high speed, hard throttle then let off, trans will do that one time then work normal all day. It shows up sometimes when shift kits go in, so I assume it is high pressure on the back side of the governor plugs?
       
    • 383man

      383man Well-Known Member

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      Seen some break\drop out the front band strut which is applied in second. Then the trans has no second so it stays in first until enough road speed for gov pressure to make the third gear shift. Ron
       
    • 493 Mike

      493 Mike FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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      Reread the original post Ron.
      Mike
       
    • Dipstick

      Dipstick Well-Known Member

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      Because, as the road speed increases, so does the governor pressure. When the governor pressure is high enough to overcome the ring leakage, it will shift direct to 3rd, probably at a road speed higher than the normal 2-3 upshift.

      In the pre-'66, line pressure for the governor is supplied by the rear pump, this might explain why it only happens after sitting a while.
       
    • wagonwedge330

      wagonwedge330 Well-Known Member

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      Mike, I totally agree....you mention the dealership which reminded me of a Buick dealer I worked in 1987 (parts dept), two of the Grand Nationals came in both had blown apart their 700R4s I don’t remember how bad they actually were, but a GM person was sent to see it for him self.....anyway your right, I need to stop looking for an easy answer and get off my arse and pull the thing out! Thanks very much!
       
    • dvw

      dvw Well-Known Member

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      I may be missing something. When governor pressure over comes throttle pressure the shift occurs. If there isn't enough governor pressure my take is it won't shift period. If the rings are worn when it does make enough pressure why would it skip 2nd? I'll be the 1st to admit I'm no stock valve body guru.
      Doug
       
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      • wagonwedge330

        wagonwedge330 Well-Known Member

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        Thanks Doug, I appreciate it...The issue or the thing that I can’t understand is the transmission only does this 1st to 3rd thing once, after the car has sat at least over night, It shifts perfectly every single time after. If I go to cruise, which is anything but, lol, (we do a lot of bs and bumper racing ), anyway, the car sits sometimes at a couple of the larger cruises, four hours, or so, when we fire up to leave, the trans shifts beautifully.
         
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