Weakened torsionbars?

[Wietse]

Hey guys, how it's going?

Last time i set the ride height a little lower as per the books says, though it sits actually a little lower now after a quick check.
I wonder if these torsion bars, which are likely the originals, could weaken due to age/use??
The adjuster threads are sticking up very high and getting near the limit, and this while the car sits lower than as per specs.
You would say it should be around the middle of the adjustment range once the ride height is correct.
It's a '69 Coronet R/T 440-4 and has the .90-ish size torsionbars.
My plan is to replace them anyway this winter for some 1.03" PST bars or Hotchkis bars, not sure yet what to pick....

 

[Speedbird]

Firm Feel.

 

[F4R/T]

I’m a firm feel guy, they can also reclock the original bars if want to keep your originals.

 

[AR67GTX]

You might want to verify they are installed on the correct side if you think they may have been removed before.

 

[Wietse]

Thx guys, i did not even know FirmFeel makes them.
At their website each set/size has a WR number (175, 225), are those the spring rates in lbs/in?
IIRC the original R/T torsion bars are something like 160-180 lbs/in, so a 1.06" (WR 225) would be a little stiffer ride which would be ok.

I am not desperate to keep the original ones, also problem will be shipping to the US and back to Europe which will cost an arm and a leg.

But it is common these bars also start to sag like a spring that looses its power?

You might want to verify they are installed on the correct side if you think they may have been removed before.

They were removed by me when i replaced all bushings etc. but i kept them on the correct side of the car and in the correct orientation so they went back in as they came out.

 

[R/T Boy 67]

You're a little off on the stock bar rate. I believe the hemi -440 bars were in the 115 to 125 lb range, depending on what chart you read. A 1.06" bar would be a LOT stiffer.

 

[Wietse]

115 to 125 lb range

I was miles out was I, found some charts on the web with similar numbers.
Strange enough indeed not all are saying the same, but close though.
In that case, i think i need to stay below 1" diameter because i would like a bit firmer ride but don't want anything crazy, just to improve handling and get a bit more stiffer.

Anyone any experience with the Mopar Performance .960" torsion bars?

 

[wahya]

I put a pair on my satellite. Small block with factory air. Car certainly rides with a more firm ride and I like it. Adjuster bolts are protruding down maybe a quarter inch or so.

 

[ckessel]

Springs/t-bars etc are like us. We are not as strong as we used to be when young. They lose their ability over time. Lots of calendar time and load cycles takes its toll. Get some new ones.

 

[Wietse]

Not really, i get the feeling my body is getting more stiff as age goes by
Some jobs crawling around and bending over and i feel like a race spring!
But with respect to the springs i can understand.

 

[PST]

Our 1.03 torsion bars are the most popular bar that we sell for the B body. They have a 20 degree clocking designed into them for proper pre-load. So you should have no issue attaining stock ride height or a lowered stance if desired. The spring rate on these are bars 209lbs. Also as a member of the forum you would be eligible for FBBO discount which is 10% off order of $200 or more. If you have any questions please let me know. These torsion bars are proudly made in the USA.

Thanks
James From
PST

 

[Sonny Black]

So, you lower them, (in the garage) & they look correct.....once you drive it they tend to lower or relax more.....//jmvho

Sonny tip; leave them alone

 

[Wietse]

Our 1.03 torsion bars are the most popular bar that we sell for the B body.

How harsh do these get?
I don't want a too stiff front end but do look foor that more solid cornering.

The last time i had adjusted the ride height up, as i had it quite a bit lower than as per book but after some time i've measured it again and it sat lower than before.
I did test drive after the last adjustment and measured again after that to confirm it stayed as adjusted, i know it will sag a little after a drive so i was prepared for it.
That time i just adjusted it and did not pay any attention, last week i had the wheels of for a good clean and was looking straight at those adjuster bolts and noticed they are far out and are getting near the end of the adjustment.
Thats why i suspected these torsion bars to be sagging, likely due to age.

All other stuff of the suspension already has been renewed, PST tubular upper control arms, all bushings, ball joints, steering linkage and new shocks.

 

[AR67GTX]

I put these (1.03 PST) on my Hemi Satellite after I could not find the MP .96 bars in stock anywhere. Unfortunately due to a melted wiring harness that become apparent on my test drive I have limited experience with them. My first impression was they rode very well - but then the Hemi is a pretty hefty piece of iron hung out there.

Steel chemistry can change steel shape properties so much that I wonder if the rate and ride is as much a function of the steel material as the diameter. They obviously use spring steel but just like any steel the exact material properties may depend on it’s chemistry - or at least it would seem so to me. So may be kind of hard to compare torsion bar performance from bars from different manufacturing sources just by diameter and length.

 

[Wietse]

I put these on my Hemi Satellite after I could not find the MP .96 bars in stock anywhere. Unfortunately due to a melted wiring harness that become apparent on my test drive I have limited experience with them. My first impression was they rode very well - but then the Hemi is a pretty hefty piece of iron hung out there.

Steel chemistry can change steel shape properties so much that I wonder if the rate and ride is as much a function of the steel material as the diameter. They obviously use spring steel but just like any steel the exact material properties may depend on it’s chemistry - or at least it would seem so to me. So may be kind of hard to compare torsion bar performance from bars from different manufacturing sources just by diameter and length.

I have a 440 4 barrel, which would be a bit lighter than a hemi, but i guess not much difference, thx for your feedback anyhow. Did you get the wiring harness sorted out?

Spring steel is a typical type(s) of steel containing a lot of carbon, IIRC also Silicon and Chromium contents are important factors.
Then its also tempered/heat treated for improving its properties, there will be endless combinations i guess and probably all manufacturers use a different cooking book for their product.
If, for example, PST uses the same steel for all their torsion bars the diameter becomes the depending factor obviously.
I got a little scared a 1.03" torsion bar would turn it in a stiff ride.
For now i've narrowed it down to the MP .96" or PST 1.03" torsion bars.

 

[PST]

How harsh do these get?
I don't want a too stiff front end but do look foor that more solid cornering.

Our 1.03" torsion bars are not harsh at all. If you do a search of the forum you will find that many of the customers that installed them on here have been more than happy with the results. Many described the ride firm but not harsh and provides the car with a more modern feel. Then if you pair them with a good quality shock like a Bilstein you have quality ride and feel.

Thanks
James From
PST

 

[Cranky]

How harsh do these get?
I don't want a too stiff front end but do look foor that more solid cornering.

Do you have a sway bar on it? I like big sway bars and a bit softer springs for a better straight line ride on the junk streets we have. Having a rear sway bar too only ads to the cornering fun.

 

[Wietse]

The Bilstein shocks are in place already.
You guys provide the 10% discount as well, neither the MP as well as the PST have a local supplier here in Europe so i will have to deal with shipping and import anyway.

Do you have a sway bar on it? I like big sway bars and a bit softer springs for a better straight line ride on the junk streets we have. Having a rear sway bar too only ads to the cornering fun.

Yep, a sway bar at the front and the rear.
Think the front was a 15/16" from Hellwig.

 

[AR67GTX]

Did you get the wiring harness sorted out?

.

The new one is in place but enough disassembly was required that a lot of mission creep set in including a trip to the plating shop where the owner recently got Covid. Lots of down time.

 

[Wietse]

Small project always tend to expand to bigger than planned with these cars.
You're not the only one with that issue..
And on top of that this pandemic is a PITA as well, also with global supplies.
Even vintage car parts run out of stock