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Thoughts? Stroker 318(392) vs 440 block

Plymouth71

Plymouth71

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for those of you who don't know I have a 1971Plymouth Satellite it is a.42,000 mile 318 2 bbl car. I would like some more power. I'm looking at a couple of options. I would like to drive it while I am building another engine. A friend of a friend has a 318 with a 3spd AT. He wants $300.00. The engine wasn't running well, but the trans was fine. I wold like to build a 392 stroker with it, if I Choose that direction.

I just spoke to another friend who advised me he has a 440 block complete with heads. It would need a rebuild.

I'm new to this, but I have numerous friends with experience. My biggest worry is money. I live in Canada so buying power is diminished by the value of our dollar and shipping costs.

Any suggestions? I'm open to your views.

Thanks for your response.
 
With costs being a big factor, I would stick with a small block. The switch to a 440 would include a lot of secondary costs; transmission, pulleys and brackets, headers..

I think a small block can be built to haul these cars without much trouble. Just my 2 cents.
 
*****Disclaimer - I'm pulling these numbers and figures literally out of my ***.. take them with a grain of salt ****


Well let's see here.... Cambell enterprises sells a 392 stroker kit for a 318 (+.040 w/ 4.0" stroke) with a cast crank for around $1400 USD. Add in machine work and other misc gaskets and etc, and you're going to be looking at somewhere around $2,200 USD + the 318 (let's face it.. you're probably going to want to put a fresh cam all that jazz in there too)

or

you can rebuild the 440, which will cost you around $800 for a master rebuild kit, plus another 4 or $500 for a good trans, plus whatever the price is on getting your driveshaft resized (last I checked was around $90 for cut/balance), plus headers ($200-ish), and other misc goods (new cam, timing set, oil pan, brackets, motor mounts, etc... so... another $500-ish oh yeah, and the machine work on this engine too).. so you'd be at around the $2,200 USD mark that way too


TL;DR - you'll be at around the same either way you go
 
I too am looking into 390 stroker! I got a 74 charger se. My uncle has a 440 road runner and dad has 383 stroker I can tell u that everything for big block cost more then small blocks. Plus the change over from sb to bb motor mounts, trans, driveshaft, u probably got 8 1/4 rear which big block would blow even on street hiring out and going for second. I considered going big block but to me cheaper to go stroker. Scat 4" cast crank, scat I beam rods everyone says with those rods don't need clearancing of block but just heard that is all.
 
I'm thinking the small block would be nicer for handling while the 440 is nicer for resale If I were ever to part with it. The other nice thing about the 318 option is the spare trans included.
 
Weight is also a consideration. 71s are fairly heavy cars so anything you can do to cut weight is a worthy goal. A torque-y small block that gets ya 375 hp will still weigh less than a stock iron headed 440. I don't think anybody mentioned the extra cooling capacity you'll need with either engine, that could add cost too. Everbody loves a big block and 440s are among the best, but depending on what you want to do with your car, sometimes (usually) a small block will work just fine...heads up racing, top speed, bragging rights, all go to the B/RB and Hemi guys. Auto-cross, handling events, and decent mileage with money left over for beer goes to the small block owners. JMHO.
 
5-6 years ago Hot Rod did a story on SB vs BB (Chevy). They built 2 hot street/strip engines with identical cubic inches, one SB the other BB. They matched components as much as could be done across the 2 engines, cam specs, compression, intake manifold style, etc. Prevailing wisdom was the BB would win out due to head flow capability. Some people even said "why bother" with this comparison, the BB is the obvious winner.

The small block produced more power and torque. They were surprised, but it makes sense that the lower reciprocating mass, and lower weight across all components contributed to more power.

The article also stated that at the extreme limit, taking maximum advantage of the BB architecture (way more cubes than you could ever stuff in a SB, much larger race head ports, etc), the BB would be the hands down winner.

Food for thought anyway. I'm going with a BB in my street car, but I gave serious consideration to the SB stroker option. The BB just has that 60s exclusive vibe! :) They are like classic art - aint making 'em any more.
 
I'd like to see that Hot Rod story and curious who did the builds between the two engines and also would like to know what made the small block out perform the big block. Was the tests done on a dyno or in real world cars and what kind of rpm were they turning etc? If anyone pays any attention to some of the Competition Eliminator classes, you'll find a lot of small blocks in them but man, they zing them to the moon with rpm. Many years ago a buddy of mine was running in SS/O with a 265 56 Chevy and was launching it at 9000 and shifting at 9500 and could run well under the index with low 11 second passes! And this was in the 80's....what are they doing now? Also, how long will a low rpm torque monster last vs a high rpm horse power small block last?
 
Who's making/selling stroker cranks for 318s these days? Back when I was piecing together a 408 there was nothing available for 318s as far as I could tell. Sheeit, I've given away 318s because the crank journals were scored and it wasn't worth the cost of the machine work. But a nice stroker replacement...? That's a different story.
 
It's a great write-up, yes. But 7 grand for 400 HP? Seems a little steep.

I didn't read the whole thread, so it may have been addressed later, but the H-beam rods and forged pistons seem like overkill in a 400 hp mill unless he's gonna add nitrous later. I don't think he ever claimed it was a "budget" build.
 
If you choose to go with the small block, I highly suggest that you also spend the money on some good cylinder heads like the RMS or Edelbrock RPM... I think if your not racing it, going to be mainly a street car, I'd go with the stroked LA SB 4" Eagle assembly from Mancini Racing... IMHFO it's a little less expense initially, when your not having to change, radiator {bigger/more rows}, motor mounts, torsion bars {for the heavier BB}, exhaust manifold/head pipes & converter/trans, crossmember or driveline {Because the BB stuff is completely different} 1st off {probably should upgrade thou}... But also if you do the LA-SB 390-392ci LA-318ci stroker, I would highly suggest spend the extra $300 for the internal balancing too, you can use allot of your original parts that way, weight is also a bag factor, in performance... I'm a die hard BB Wedge guy too & usually stroker... Generally the BB stuff is more money, part for part too... I did a 4" Eagle kit 0.030" over 318ci/5.2ltr Magnum Headed Engine in a 99 2wd Dakota Sport {R/T Clone} a few years ago, it was a damn great combo, what a night & day difference it was, it had the balls & bottom end torque of a stock stroke BB, but economics of a SB, spent way less than $5k, for 450+HP... It put a really big smile on this die hard BB guys face... Good luck, what ever you decide I'll try to help you...

- - - Updated - - -

you maybe able to build the stock 440ci BB cheaper initially, but all the extras I mentioned earlier, will add up pretty quickly...
 
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