727 shifting at 4100 RPM

[Garys1969RR]

I have a 727 behind a low compression 440 that came out of an RV. The transmission works great, shifts good and is fairly low mileage. Only problem is under wide open throttle acceleration, it still wants to shift at 4100 RPM. I'm pretty sure this is the way the RV transmission valve body was designed. My question: is there any way to just raise the shift RPM without totally redoing the valve body? Like possibly readjusting the governor? I have the kickdown rod adjusted where it's all the way back when the throttle is wide open. And it does shift into passing gear when you floor it, it just shifts way too early. Thanks for your help or suggestions.

 

[NOSTRT980]

http://www.aandatrans.com/Departments/Chrysler-727-Trans/Governor-Kits.aspx

this may help

 

[69 GTX]

To remove the governor you must remove the tail shaft housing, which in my mind is a bigger pain than changing a valve body.

 

[Garys1969RR]

So it looks like the lighter weight governors make it shift at a higher RPM, is that right?

 

[Dibbons]

FYI: Parents new 1971 383 Road Runner shifted at 4500 RPM at full throttle.

 

[Dipstick]

Before tearing into the governor, be sure the linkage is pushing the transmission lever near full back at WOT and be sure the carb is going to WOT.

 

[Garys1969RR]

Before tearing into the governor, be sure the linkage is pushing the transmission lever near full back at WOT and be sure the carb is going to WOT.

Right, I have already checked that, and at WOT the lever IS all the way back. And the carb is opening all the way. I have found that different trannys had different weight governors. The max wedge 727 shifted at the highest RPM from the factory, at about 6,200 RPM. I think the hemis were around 5600, and the Roadrunners and Super Bees shifted at around 5000 RPM. My RR did. So i need a lighter weight governor, to shift closer to 5000. This RV tranny is shifting on its own at 4100. Makes sense. Low RPM torque motor.

 

[BSB67]

http://www.aandatrans.com/Departments/Chrysler-727-Trans/Governor-Kits.aspx

this may help

Funny. I just ran across an invoice from John Veatch when I bought my first governor kit from him long ago. It was $8.

Some times there is an unacceptable difference between the 1-2 shift rpm verses the 2-3 shift rpm. If that is the case, set the 2-3 shift with the governor, then put a stiffer 1-2 shift valve spring in (valve body). Ricky A has a couple of those too, but I ended up going to a spring supplier and ordering a bunch to try.

 

[Garys1969RR]

Yes it does seem to rev higher on the 2-3 upshift, under part throttle, than it does on the 1 - 2 shift. Still looking for a governor from a late 60s 727. Dont want to spend alot when I'm just experimenting. May just buy an old 727 for $75, and use it for parts. I just gave one away 3 months ago, before I bought this car.

 

[Garys1969RR]

Plus it's fun to have an extra tranny around to mess with. And practice on.

 

[BSB67]

Plus it's fun to have an extra tranny around to mess with. And practice on.

If you're only interested in the WOT shift rpm, you only need to concern yourself with the inner weight. Get yours out, weigh it and take a picture of it. We can probably get you where you want with spending anything.

 

[Garys1969RR]

If you're only interested in the WOT shift rpm, you only need to concern yourself with the inner weight. Get yours out, weigh it and take a picture of it. We can probably get you where you want with spending anything.

Oh that would be great! I have read that you can drill out the center hole in the weight to 3/8 " to lighten it, or even grind down the edges. Then I guess you just re install it. Ok I'll get it out soon.

 

[wyrmrider]

Talking Torqueflytes Chrysler Power Mag Nov 89 great article on governors (I helped edit it for Roland
all good advice so far what's missing in the article is the weights
get a spare governor then just swap
you can go .450 deep on the small weight bore
governor weights and springs changed in 71 do not mix early and late late has "club foot" thicker flange on the inner governor weight
write back with the correct year of trans and I can shoot you some numbers
adjust your throttle pressure on the valve body stock is 90 lbs but cross rams ran 105 do not run any more on the street or it will tear up frictions
I run transgo reprogramming kits but there is only so much you can do with a shift kit

 

[Dipstick]

The OP states that he doesn't like the 4100 upshift but I'm wondering what he desires. Playing around with governor weights can get you in trouble such as a 6200 rpm governor hooked to a motor that runs out of steam at 5500.

Easiest way out of the dilemma is to use the shifter to hold the gear until the desired rpm. Costs zip and your hands stay clean.

 

[wyrmrider]

Getting that way too high or way too low is usually from mixing early and late parts
That's why you build a spare governor
They are not hard to change
but you are correct on the hand shifting
get the TransGo TF2 reprogramming kit for starts and get your pressure correct
low pressure will cause low shifts
incidentally TransGOs new separator plate replaces that old worn out one in your valve body- the one where your balls leak

 

[Garys1969RR]

Ok here is a pic of a used one I bought today. It prob came out of a late 60s 727.

Is the hole where the pen top is, the one you drill out to 3/8"? To lighten it? And you don't want to drill more than .450 deep? Is that right?

 

[Garys1969RR]

I'm trying to get to a shift point of around 5200 RPM. Thought I might modify this one slightly, after I remove what's in there. I will compare them first.

 

[BSB67]

Ok here is a pic of a used one I bought today. It prob came out of a late 60s 727.
View attachment 677945 View attachment 677946
Is the hole where the pen top is, the one you drill out to 3/8"? To lighten it? And you don't want to drill more than .450 deep? Is that right?

So the inner weight in your pic has a thicker margin at the top than the HP, higher rpm weights, so the "rules" on how deep will be different. Secondly, the later model governors have a heavier spring than the earlier higher rpm units which also effects shift rpm. However, because your only trying to get to 5200, you can probably make what you have work.

I'm traveling this weekend and don't have access to my weights or info, which I'm not sure would give the definitive answer as to how deep to drill. But for sure, if you drill as you suggest, the WOT rpm will increase. Saying how much exactly will be a bit of a guess.

Do you have access to a scale?

Have you checked the 2-3 WOT shift rpm? And do you care about the 2-3 shift rpm?

 

[Garys1969RR]

It shifts at 4100 on both the 1/2 & 2/3. So I can cut 1 coil off the spring to raise the shift point? And or lighten the inner weight.

 

[Garys1969RR]

Apparently the weight and spring get retracted when the line pressure goes up. Then the centrifugal force of rotation, plus spring pressure, force the inner weight outward causing the shift to occur. So a lighter weight and lighter spring result in a higher RPM shift. Right? Just trying to understand how it works.