about That car....

[moparnation74]

Keep in mind that I was invited since this thread pertains to MY project. Individuals like you (moparnation74) have turned this into nothing more than a Which Hunt. It's no longer about the "story" but the things I do as a Company. You present your lies about me and then expect me to remain silent. Continue your conversation but "leave" me out of it. Don't use anything that pertains to me or my project as an example if you don't want me involved. Is that simple enough for you to understand?

Typical ECS trying to get another thread locked.
If you cannot handle unbiased questions that is your problem.....do you need timeout?

 

[cudak888]

Typical ECS trying to get another thread locked.
If you cannot handle unbiased questions that is your problem.....do you need timeout?

Take it easy - remember, just the facts, Joe Friday ;)

 

[moparnation74]

Take it easy - remember, just the facts, Joe Friday ;)

Thanks, your right!(cudak888)

 

[ECS]

Thanks, your right!(cudak888)

I think you meant YOU'RE right.......just thought I would help you out a bit there.

 

[BeatersRus]

I think you meant YOU'RE right.......just thought I would help you out a bit there.

Individuals like you (moparnation74) have turned this into nothing more than a Which Hunt

btw,to help you out a bit there,its Witches not whichs,
or to be contextually correct,witch.

can we get back to the story now?

 

[Richard Cranium]

Lousy spellers are tearing this board apart!

 

[moparnation74]

I think you meant YOU'RE right.......just thought I would help you out a bit there.

Actually, you did not....but I am not a grammer junkie until someone chimes in...
You're is a contraction which I prefer not to use that contraction. Some use you're, You Are, or your.....its a choice and all are grammatically correct...

Anyhow, back on topic please!

 

[BeatersRus]

Lousy spellers are tearing this board apart!

the futurd of hour memberz depends on gud speelin richurd i wood think ewe knowd theess.

 

[cudak888]

Careful, you'll spell the VIN wrong.

 

[moparnation74]

the futurd of hour memberz depends on gud speelin richurd i wood think ewe knowd theess.

BeatersRus, Rob, too funny!

 

[moparnation74]

Careful, you'll spell the VIN wrong.

LOL.......

 

[ECS]

btw,to help you out a bit there,its Witches not whichs,
or to be contextually correct,witch.

can we get back to the story now?

You didn't understand the sarcastic humor in my message. Some of these guys don't know WHICH aspect they want to complain about. The Car, the Story, the appearance, the Fender Tags, the VIN, the correct Part Dates.........

So again, witch aspect of the Project is really the problem here?

 

[BeatersRus]

I've said NUMEROUS times that we were going to build this Car regardless of what Roger Johnson wrote about. Finding out about his article (AFTER THE FACT) was just an added perk.

A car that is scratch built as a tribute to another

im just curious as to which way it really is.
your cronie there seems very confused.
was this built as a concept or built as a tribute to the car that wasnt made,
erm cant be proved by anyone to have been made??

because you do recall,the entire purpose of this thread is to determine how false the story is,right?
or hey true even,
wouldnt it be great to have the designer guy hook you up with the Real people who worked there back then and then maybe you could prove or disprove this whole story??

Edit:So again, witch aspect of the Project is really the problem here?
thats actually not bad and i wondered if that had been your intention.
carry onwards!!

 

[ECS]

im just curious as to which way it really is.

I can only speak for my intentions. I saw an Artist rendering of a gray/blue 4 Door Cudas and talked to Steve about the difficulty in trying to build it. After discussing it for a couple weeks, we decided to give it a go. About 3 weeks later, Steve saw the article written by Roger Johnson. We hadn't really begun to work on the Car so it was easy to change the direction to build it as a representation of what Roger Johnson wrote about. If you go back and look at the first threads on this project, you'll see that it was originally going to be a lemon twist yellow Car, with a Gator Grain Top and a Rally Hood. There's no contradiction to anything. I simply decided to change directions while there was still the opportunity to do so. It really shouldn't matter though. Changing direction on the build of a "fake Car" should be of no real bother to anyone.......right?

 

[BeatersRus]

i agree,and i think that you understand what some of us are saying here.
from your involvement in the industry,im sure you understand our concerns about the story becoming attached to the car for future generations to gullibly accept as fact.

might i ask why you dont simply promote it as a What-if car instead of a recreation of the car that cannot be proven to have been even made in clay??

that would kill the story/which is really the only dark cloud over the entire project.
at least as far as im concerned.
and you would be More famous as a What if creator than a recreation project,wouldnt you??

as far as the body vin numbers go,im not sure if you answered this,i tend to look at your pics more than the commentary soooo,
the body you are using now,was that a shell of another car and if not how did you stamp a body shell out?
if it was a shell,wheres the vin from that car?

if us normal peasants built a car,like this,and then wanted a vin,
we would have to take the car to a Inspection state point,and then if it passes,we would receive a Reconstructed title.
we most certainly would not be given choice of vin numbers.
does make me wonder how you got legal paperwork and vin plates for this car when its not even a finished product nor inspected yet....?

yes,im a highly logical person and yes,very blunt but i mean no offense.
teach me,teach them,teach us,if you can.

 

[BeatersRus]

We'll have everything back to normal in a day or so. I guess we should have never assumed that 340 components from a 1972 or 73 would work with a 1970 setup. Detailing a 340 Engine has been a new learning experience to say the least.

was it because they changed the cranks to cast perchance?
im assuming you of course knew the difference between ac pulleys and no ac pulleys.
i ask this because i remember going thru hell w my 72 340 duster pulleys.
funny part is,i took off the ac which made that car even more valuable.
we were such dumb kids back then......

 

[ECS]

*.....i agree,and i think that you understand what some of us are saying here.

*.....and you would be More famous as a What if creator than a recreation project,wouldnt you??

*.....as far as the body vin numbers go,im not sure if you answered this,i tend to look at your pics more than the commentary soooo,
the body you are using now,was that a shell of another car and if not how did you stamp a body shell out?
if it was a shell,wheres the vin from that car?

I think part of the problem is that you guys are looking at things through your point of view instead of mine. I'm not sure what Industry you work in but I'm sure you have developed working relationships that I don't have access to. The person who set up our Company VIN Computer Server is the National Director for the Computer Systems of the US Army. He has a security clearance higher than most Senators in the Government. I don't have access to his information but I'm not bothered by that fact. He EARNED his ability to obtain that high level security ranking......I didn't! I've worked in this "VIN" area for the better part of 17 years. I have developed personal relationships/Friendships with the heads of the NICB, Chrysler, Ford, GM, etc....... I talk directly to them to understand information regarding what to do with the project I am working on. I don't use my contacts for other people because I would drive my constituents CRAZY with the constant requests from outside people. I am able to find out when ANY vehicle was manufactured, the day it was sold, by what Dealership, the hour of the Day it was registered and the Salesman who sold it. I have access to this information used for security reasons. I can't have these Directors running around trying to document Cars for every Hobbyist who wants to know what Dealership their car was sold at. I've never used my contacts to find out information on my cars and I never will. Those avenues are only used for when there is fraud involved. There is nothing I am doing that someone else here couldn't do. They might have to go through different routes but the end result would be the same.

I'm not concerned with "fame" about this project. Once again, I think people are judging me vicariously through their perception of how they would feel if they were involved with this project. I have personally spoke with Roger Johnson on many occasions. I was just as pessimistic as some of you were until I heard the Man speak and give his personal recollections. If you haven't talked with the Men I have talked to, I don't know how you can make definitive statements about them or expect me to share your unsubstantiated views about them. While I'm not the smartest person in the World, I do have the ability to listen to someone for 2 minutes and know whether they are bamboozling me or not. I guarantee that Roger Johnson is not lying about his recollection of the 4 Door Barracuda he claims he saw in 1969.

There was never another vehicle that had numbers on it. We couldn't use any Body Part that would have been stamped with an identifying number because it would not have worked on this project. The B Body Cowl would not accommodate a Factory E Body Dash so that entire section was changed with a blank AMD E Body cowl. Granger sells stamps that you can stamp any type of metal that you want. I don't know if the fonts are correct but it didn't matter with this Car because it represents nothing more than its own build. Everyone should know a VIN sequence that ends in all zeros is an impossibility in the VIN World. The stamping on this cowl can NEVER be confused with a production car so it should never be an issue.

 

[ECS]

was it because they changed the cranks to cast perchance?

Part of our problem was that we had a mix up of Pulleys that were working against each other. Since the other Pulleys didn't have a part number or date code, we didn't know which (or witch) ones were causing the alignment problem. We could have swapped everything over to a 1973 version and then they would have all lined up. The 1973 Water Pump Pulley is a smaller diameter that the 1970 version. I believe this was done to increase the water flow for better cooling. We decided to remove them ALL and start fresh with the correct 1970 units.

 

[BeatersRus]

our first great reply,TY.

now we are making progress.
this leads us to our next point,the people who Did work there,in the designer studios,not just some mailboy.
why wont you just get in touch with the people who really knew the deal?
i understand you believe him,i even understand why.
but,as you know,if someone makes themselves believe something long enough,they can then tell you a story without any hesitation and convince You,because hey they have convinced themselves.

( indeed,this is my main concern,because you see how easy he convinced you right now how easy will it be to convince the uninformed average enthusiast there was a 4 door cuda and now here it is?? )

so,if the designer guy we have here,can hook you up with people who actually worked there and Can confirm or deny the existence?
then why havent you done this?
it would most surely End this whole story debate,wouldnt it?

 

[ECS]

why wont you just get in touch with the people who really knew the deal?

Why would I? You guys have made it perfectly clear that the people you talked to had ALL claimed they never saw the vehicle that Roger Johnson wrote about. They also were not aware of the 4 Door Concepts that Larry Saunders & Sonny Benson had told Roger Gibson about. I believe you when you say that your Contacts told you the stories you said they they told you. There's no sense in me wasting time contacting people who have already admitted they're not aware of the information. MANY Designers were not aware of the Concept Cars that were made in the Design Studios by the various Auto Manufacturers. That fact has already been established.

I'm not out to re-write History. If I find information to supports Mr. Johnson's story, that's fine. If I don't, that too is fine. It isn't a deal breaker for me in the build of this Project.