The TF headed 505 is done, and she is wicked

[Paul_G]

But, you know what they say... if I didnt have bad luck...
Well, the first issue was with the Harland Sharp rockers. Dont believe TF's BS just because they are the recomended rocker to use that they are going to be right. The geometry on those is awful! I ended up spending much more than I budgeted for the valve train to get it right. B3 racing made shims for me that got it right. Spent about $1470 on the valve train not including cam and lifters.

The engine is in my 73 Rallye Charger, 4 speed car with a 3.23 geared sure grip. I am using a Mcleod Super street Pro clutch. It is on the hairy edge of being able to handle the power. Needs a recommended 500 miles of easy street driving to break in. Waiting is going to suck. So far I have not abused it.

The car is wicked quick. It will go triple digit speeds in what seems like just half peddle. I have been easy on the clutch, but from a stop rolling out till the clutch is at full engagement and then nailing it... it's a smoke show and the car is going sideways.

The other day I was cruising around the neighborhood. Maybe about 2 miles from home I get on it pretty good. I get in the garage and see a water trail on the garage floor. Center core plug on the passenger is gone. Bad luck. The machine shop put those in for me. I pray the engine is OK. New plug came today. Install tomorrow.

 

[biomedtechguy]

the first issue was with the Harland Sharp rockers. Dont believe TF's BS just because they are the recomended rocker to use that they are going to be right. The geometry on those is awful!

If you could start over, who would you suggest for rocker arms?
I'd be inclined to go to B3 from the get go for the rocker arms, etc.

 

[Hemirunner]

If you could start over, who would you suggest for rocker arms?
I'd be inclined to go to B3 from the get go for the rocker arms, etc.

Just buy good rockers in the first place, T&D or Jesel.

 

[biomedtechguy]

Just buy good rockers in the first place, T&D or Jesel.

I'm sorry I don't know this, but do you have Trick Flow heads? If "yes", Is one of those 2 brands what you used?

 

[Lefty71]

I ended up spending much more than I budgeted for the valve train to get it right. B3 racing made shims for me that got it right. Spent about $1470 on the valve train not including cam and lifters.

Can you clarify a bit on the cost breakdown?? My thinking was that B3 was quite reasonable for the job and product they provided. What else did you need to buy to correct the geometry, besides the lifters themselves, special pushrods & ?? Sounds like a fun ride, which is all that matters in the end!

 

[ruffcut]

Following

 

[Hemirunner]

Just buy good rockers in the first place, T&D or Jesel.

Let’s start a new thread so we don’t derail Paul’s thread. Congrats on the new monster, Paul!

 

[Paul_G]

If you could start over, who would you suggest for rocker arms?
I'd be inclined to go to B3 from the get go for the rocker arms, etc.

Yes. On the phone with Mike he talked about rockers he sells that are right for TF heads and at a much lower price than the HS rockers.

Can you clarify a bit on the cost breakdown?? My thinking was that B3 was quite reasonable for the job and product they provided. What else did you need to buy to correct the geometry, besides the lifters themselves, special pushrods & ?? Sounds like a fun ride, which is all that matters in the end!

Harland Sharp rockers $909.99
Push Rods $105.99
B3 Racing shims, shaft machining $406.39
Mounting stud kit I could'nt use $60

 

[Paul_G]

Just buy good rockers in the first place, T&D or Jesel.

I would be wary of any rocker fitting the TF heads and having good geometry unless I knew someone who has tried them and knows they are OK. B3 makes a rocker that works.

 

[matthon]

Mike at B3 knows his stuff.

 

[biomedtechguy]

Mike he talked about rockers he sells that are right for TF heads and at a much lower price than the HS rockers.

Thanks a lot @Paul_G, and congratulations on the new mill!

 

[BSB67]

Why does everyone talk about bad rocker arm geometery like it's the rocker arms fault? There is nothing you can change in a roller tip rocker arm that will change/fix the relatonship between the valve tip and shaft pedestal.

 

[Wietse]

I always wondered why manufacturers of aftermarket heads never set this straight and re-designed the shaft pedestal for that reason.
Thinking about that, if they did make it to work perfect with a certain brand/type rocker, the client will be stuck with it and looses the freedom to choose his own rockers.
It also depends on your valve lift, and again you can design it to work with a certain valve lift but when you deviate from that you are out-of-center as well.

One could do the math himself once the decision has been made on camshaft and select a good brand roller rockers that come as close as possible to the perfect setup.
You would need to know all dimensions of the different rocker arms, which the manufacturer does not provide i think.
But a roller rocker means that you will have to raise the rocker shaft, so to get it right B3 is going to be the man to talk to anyway.
Or you go to the extend of machining down the rocker shaft stands, design and machine your own that require a bolt-on setup to the heads....not sure what that would cost you though.

Don't want to deal with all that? Stay with a mild cam and OEM stamped rockers.

 

[biomedtechguy]

I have a competent, trusted builder, but one exception to the "don't build by committee" rule is I absolutely will reference B3 for rocker arm geometry.
Actually, I will be surprised if my builder doesn't already know him.

 

[ckessel]

See if the machine shop installed chebby 1 5/8" freeze plugs as opposed to correct Mopar 1 41/64". Might be the problem.

 

[69 GeeTeeX]

I just dropped my 505 into the car last weekend. Trickflow 240 heads with Hughes 1.5 rockers, no problems with geometry at all. This is a street motor so the cam lift might be the difference. I was able to use my original stock valve covers so it appears to be a 440.

 

[biomedtechguy]

I just dropped my 505 into the car last weekend. Trickflow 240 heads with Hughes 1.5 rockers, no problems with geometry at all. This is a street motor so the cam lift might be the difference. I was able to use my original stock valve covers so it appears to be a 440.

Hydraulic roller?

 

[69 GeeTeeX]

Yes, hydraulic roller camshaft.

 

[Paul_G]

I just dropped my 505 into the car last weekend. Trickflow 240 heads with Hughes 1.5 rockers, no problems with geometry at all. This is a street motor so the cam lift might be the difference. I was able to use my original stock valve covers so it appears to be a 440.

My cam is a 542/539 lift. I am using stock valve covers. I have a set of tall valve covers that wont fit till I move the brake booster over.

 

[69 GeeTeeX]

Your cam lift is less than mine and you still had problems with geometry? I’m sure you had to get longer pushrods.