How hard is it to rebuild an A-833?

[NJRR]

Put this in my other thread, but maybe it wasn't seen by many on here. Trying to decide on the 833 rebuild. My brother, who owned a transmission shop for 5 years, is suggesting I might not want to totally rebuild the gearset if the synchros and gears are in excellent condition, which I think they are. He said that if it is shifting smooth now, not to mess with it since it is an intricate reassembly and just change seals and bearings. So, he has placed some doubt in my mind. Is his suggestion sensible? Anybody have any thoughts on the skill level needed to totally disassemble and reassemble an 833? The last thing I want to do is screw it up and grind the gears and synchros up. Another option is I found a relatively local Mopar specialist who will rebuild the trans including blasting and painting the case for $500 (which includes the $100+ rebuild kit). Is it critical having someone with experience do it or can it be done by someone who has never rebuilt a trans before (me!)? All opinions are welcome. Thanks gents.

 

[Lowhound]

Its like the old saying, "If it aint broke ,don't fix it"

 

[MNBiker]

Its like the old saying, "If it aint broke ,don't fix it"

X2

 

[Hemi Rebel]

If you have no experience you might want to not mess with it. Its not hard to do, but there are a lot of pieces. The counter shaft roller bearings are not caged and will all fall out when you remove the shaft. Getting it all back together will be a a test of your patience and skill. Personally I say go for it. Learn it and learn it well. Then you can make 400 bucks.

 

[68GTX440]

I would not do anything other than what your brother recommended but if you want to try it and replace anything it is a "fairly" easy trans to do.
But then again I am the type of person that takes satisfaction in taking things apart and putting things back together again. (it's an ego and satisfaction thing)
If you decide to do it hear are a couple things to do.
First off get a manual for the trans.
Be careful as you take it apart and pay attention in detail as you take it apart. Get some good white lithium grease or even the red trans lube and put a thin layer on most of the moving parts when putting back together especially the needle brgs to keep them in place while putting back together.
First take off the side cover remove the bolts from the ext housing and the front 4 bolts. Then remove the input shaft cover/cone most times you can remove the input shaft without getting the output shaft to move back. Now when you get the input shaft out you will have a bunch of needle brgs in the end of it. Some have a cage inside but most are individual brgs. Don't lose any of them and count them so you make sure you get the correct amount when putting back together. Now if you haven't yet, break the seal from the ext housing at the case and remove the housing. Then you should be able to work the rest of the gears and shaft out of the case through the shifter cover.
You might have to the remove the pin/shaft on the idler gear and reverse to help get it out of the case.
This is a fairly easy trans to do, just pay attention to what and where you remove the parts and you will not be afraid to do it again.

Good luck if you decide to do it yourself and remember to pay attention while doing it. (Take pictures if you need to while taking it apart for reference)

 

[NJRR]

But then again I am the type of person that takes satisfaction in taking things apart and putting things back together again. (it's an ego and satisfaction thing)

I'm the same kind of guy, plus, my son is all psyched up to rebuild it also, so I might just go for it. One of the things that is leaning me towards a total rebuild is that although the gears shifted smoothly by hand ( the trans was not in a car, I bought it used and don't really know the history, just see the condition from opening it up), I don't know if it shifted smoothly out of the car it was in and who knows what condition the internals are in other than the gears and synchros which i can visually inspect.

Brewer's has a rebuild kit that I was looking at which has all the smaller parts needed to rebuild it. I figure if i tear it down, I will replace everything I can.

"Bearing and seal rebuild kit for all 1966-69 B-body and 1967-1974 A-body transmissions with 23 spline input/30 spline output. Includes main bearings, tail shaft bushing, countershaft rollers/spacers/thrust washers, input rollers, snap rings and all appropriate gaskets & seals, including speedometer adapter o-ring and seal. Flat paper gaskets supplied in this kit are manufactured exclusively for Brewer’s Performance with a high performance matrix material, providing excellent flexibility, low flange pressure sealing, good bolt torque retention and reduced fluid wicking. This material does not require the use of additional sealants. Continuous temperature rated to 400 degrees Fahrenheit. Additional sealants can cause the gaskets to squirm while torquing, thus resulting in a torn or damaged gasket!"

Also, they have this grease I was considering: "Trans-Jel Gold is specifically formulated for use as an assembly lubricant for all automatic and manual transmissions. It lubricates and helps hold in place needle bearings, thrust washers, sealing rings, "O" rings, hydraulic seals and gaskets during assembly. Trans-Jel Gold remains smooth and stable at working temperatures, and is soluble in all transmission fluids and gear oil"

Anyone have opinions on Brewer's stuff?

 

[Meep-Meep]

X2 hemi rebel.

They are pretty straight forward but do require more than pliers and a screw driver for an easy disassembly. I will add that you need to know what you are looking at to determine what's good or bad. If you want to get into it I and others here can provide you with very detailed instructions.

 

[snakeoil24]

It is only hard until you do it once. Make sure you have a clean area and if you need bearings or parts buy from DTS and ask for Domestic Timken or Dana replacement parts. Measure everything and get a shop manual to check all specs.

 

[NJRR]

Meeps- Thanks for the offer. I will definitely take you up on it! - Abe

X2 hemi rebel.

They are pretty straight forward but do require more than pliers and a screw driver for an easy disassembly. I will add that you need to know what you are looking at to determine what's good or bad. If you want to get into it I and others here can provide you with very detailed instructions.

- - - Updated - - -

Snakeoil- Any idea what bearings are in the Brewer kit?I know Timkens are top shelf. I replaced the front wheel bearings on my Tacoma pick-up with Timkens. The local parts shop showed me cheap chinese bearings vs the Timkens. Night and Day. I will def check with Brewer before I order anything.- Abe

It is only hard until you do it once. Make sure you have a clean area and if you need bearings or parts buy from DTS and ask for Domestic Timken or Dana replacement parts. Measure everything and get a shop manual to check all specs.

 

[Cornpatch MO]

Having syncros and mateing gear teeth in good condition is important, and Expensive. You need to know what good ones look like................................MO

 

[BeastlyBirdie]

As to what others have said, its not a very difficult transmission to rebuild, but, get a book or two, make sure you have things such as snap ring pliers, etc. A press is handy, and a vise.
Both Brewers and Passon are good sources for parts. Not sure what bearings either use, but, they come in kit form, which is much easier if you're inexperienced with cross-referencing bearings.

 

[NJRR]

Only reason I bought this trans was because the synchros and gears looked pristine when I opened it up to inspect it. The levers were still attached, so i shifted thru all gears by hand first, all very smooth. Whatever fluid was left when I opened it up was pretty clean, no metal filings, no rust, no chipped teeth, clutch forks looked solid. Not sure if you can see in the pics below.

Having syncros and mateing gear teeth in good condition is important, and Expensive. You need to know what good ones look like................................MO

- - - Updated - - -

Doing my homework now. I believe in measuring twice and cutting once. Trying to pound that lesson in my son's head too !!!! :violent1:

As to what others have said, its not a very difficult transmission to rebuild, but, get a book or two, make sure you have things such as snap ring pliers, etc. A press is handy, and a vise.
Both Brewers and Passon are good sources for parts. Not sure what bearings either use, but, they come in kit form, which is much easier if you're inexperienced with cross-referencing bearings.

 

[396 Signet]

After doing a half dozen of these things my experience is you'll never know what you'll find. I've had an unbelievably cruddy one that actually was near perfect internally after cleanup. My latest 65 Satellite had an untouched original trans (133k) that looked every bit as nice as yours inside (drove perfect) but was a leaker at the shift o-rings. The reverse idler has to come out to fix so I just decided to take the thing apart & re-gasket on the cheap. Amazed to find the countershaft & rollers near completely wasted. My recommendation is to not buy a kit to start, rather disassemble & see what you have. The Brewer’s kits do use Chinese bearings, they have no problem with them & I’ve used them before but there are better ones out there. Based on work experience (power plant) the SKF’s are the best followed by Timken. You can even get the SKF’s with extra ball (9 vs. 7?) which makes them much stronger. You don’t want to buy the ball bearings from a trans shop. Find out what the SKF or Timken part #’s are & then buy on e-bay- they are actually just standard metric bearings used on stuff not limited to transmissions. I got some smoking deals on SKF’s which retail for over $100 for $20-30. Rebuild is not hard at all but there are lots of little things you need to get right to do a first rate job- get a factory service manual & careful to keep all your parts in exact order. Only really special tools you need are good snap-ring pliers, a caliper (if you replace the select fit snap-rings), & some sort of dowel for replacing the countershaft/ needle bearings (I use an old 3-speed countershaft for this). You also need a press for removing/ installing the bearings but any trans or machine shop should be able to do this. Also, if you replace the front bearing, make sure you re-use the original bearing snap-ring which is thinner than the those on the replacement bearing or you will crack the cast bearing retainer (ask me how I know). Here’s my 65 Sat tranny on the kitchen table-

 

[NJRR]

396- Thanks for those suggestions. Some good ideas.

My recommendation is to not buy a kit to start, rather disassemble & see what you have. The Brewer’s kits do use Chinese bearings, they have no problem with them & I’ve used them before but there are better ones out there. Based on work experience (power plant) the SKF’s are the best followed by Timken. You can even get the SKF’s with extra ball (9 vs. 7?) which makes them much stronger. You don’t want to buy the ball bearings from a trans shop. Find out what the SKF or Timken part #’s are & then buy on e-bay- they are actually just standard metric bearings used on stuff not limited to transmissions. I got some smoking deals on SKF’s which retail for over $100 for $20-30. Rebuild is not hard at all but there are lots of little things you need to get right to do a first rate job- get a factory service manual & careful to keep all your parts in exact order. Only really special tools you need are good snap-ring pliers, a caliper (if you replace the select fit snap-rings), & some sort of dowel for replacing the countershaft/ needle bearings (I use an old 3-speed countershaft for this). You also need a press for removing/ installing the bearings but any trans or machine shop should be able to do this. Also, if you replace the front bearing, make sure you re-use the original bearing snap-ring which is thinner than the those on the replacement bearing or you will crack the cast bearing retainer (ask me how I know). Here’s my 65 Sat tranny on the kitchen table-

 

[aldal]

I vote go for it, you and your son can have a great experience doing it. If you listen to guys on his site like 396 Signet you should be fine. I rebuilt mine out of my 1969 Roadrunner when I was 20 years old and it was challenging but went good and I didn't have B Bodies Only members for information and support. Good Luck, :headbang:

 

[dvw]

If it doesn't make noise and shifts well I would replace seals only. You will need to press some bearings off the shafts.The most wear i've seen is the clutching teeth. These are the ones that look like the little house roofs on the ends of the gear. I repoint the ends of clutching gear teeth with a worn (small) cut off wheel. Also hand file all the slider teeth to remove burrs. It doesn't matter if the sliders end up thinner due to wear, they actually shift better. Cut off a old broom handle just shorter than the inside of the case to use as a dummy to load the counter shaft roller bearings. Good luck.
Doug