Improving high speed drive ability

[Sonny]

I have a ‘70 Belvedere. I’ve replaced all upper control arm bushings, tie rods, ball joints, and idler arm but still get the floating play side to side when the car is 60mph and over. I know that’s a “trait” but how can I improve that? Is it all in the original steering gear box?

 

[69 GTX]

Do you run radials? If so did you have it aligned using the OEM settings? I've read that you need more caster with radials.

 

[69b3rt]

When you align the front suspension you want to have positive caster. Try to get at least 2 degrees positive caster.
Having the car jacked up in rear doesn't help either. It makes so you need to find more adjustment than original upper control arms can allow, to get that positive caster

 

[Bill Monk]

Yep, this is old but good stuff
https://www.allpar.com/history/mopar/front-end-alignment.html

 

[moes]

it's to bad you have replace your upper control arm bushings already. You should have used K7103 Moog Offset Bushing that allow for more positive caster.

If you installed them like the instructions in the package they might not help you much. The Moog intention of the bushings are for rusty cars that have sagging frames that bend inward over time.

The "trick" is to install them like this diagram below and ignore the Moog instructions. The arrows will be pointing opposite directions front bushing to rear bushing.

First make sure you set the ride height first to what you want. Factory manual alignment specs are no good for radial tires, they only work if you use bias-ply tires. For Radial tires, Camber -.50 to 0 degrees, Caster as much positive as you can get up to 3 degrees and toe in 1/16th to 1/8th inch. Car runs down the road straight as an arrow now. You will be limited to what you can do with stock A arm bushings, but if you have the Moog off set A arm bushing you can tweek it a little more.
You can also adjust your steering box too. Put the car on jack stands to take the weight off the wheels. Take a piece of masking tape and mark where the screw is pointing for a reference on the steering box, so you can see that you have not turn it to much. Take a flat headed screw driver put it in the slot and lossen the jam nut off. Take one hand and place it on the steering column and twist it back and forth while adjusting the screw clockwise JUST ABIT, tigthen the jam nut up and check your steering to see if the slop is gone. If not tigthen the screw some more and check it again. You don't want the screw too TIGHT. Usually it will only take an 1/8 or so of an inch of the screw turn. It will really help with the steering.

 

[Canada440]

The original boxes left a lot to be desired. There are a few options, there are a couple places that will rebuild to a much higher standard than the factory did such as Firm Feel, Steer and Gear. Or Borgeson makes a replacement more modern box.

 

[Don Frelier]

Check the coupler on the shaft to the steering box as well. The little rebuild kit helps quite a bit.

 

[Billccm]

Check the coupler on the shaft to the steering box as well. The little rebuild kit helps quite a bit.

Can this be rebuilt in the car?

 

[69 GTX]

yes

 

[mopar 3 B]

I have a ‘70 Belvedere. I’ve replaced all upper control arm bushings, tie rods, ball joints, and idler arm but still get the floating play side to side when the car is 60mph and over. I know that’s a “trait” but how can I improve that? Is it all in the original steering gear box?

Tires tires tires what a difference tires can make. No matter how crappy the suspension there is no reason for side to side float with a factory supension on that year of car. After all the speed limit was still 70 mph and above in 1970.

 

[Dennis H]

Firm Feel. Stage 2. Mine is straight at all speeds.

 

[moes]

About $25 cost, well worth it. You will have to drop the steering column and pull it up a bit to seperate the column from the coupler. It's an easy job.

 

[Cranky]

Negative caster or even 0 caster can make the car wander around at speed but you will feel it even more if it's negative. Does your steering wheel return all the way to center after a making a turn? I've always deviated from the factory specs on my cars adding in more caster and camber and depending on how much negative camber it gets will depend on how much more toe it might need. A car is a complex machine and most will respond differently to alignment settings so it's never a bad thing to experiment to see what it and what you like with the combination your car has. Wider wheels...different backspacing, tire width and many other things will all play a part in how your car will react to it's alignment. Factory settings worked well with the old style bias ply tires of the day but tires today are MUCH better and factory settings.....weeell.....eh lol

 

[Sonny]

Now that I’m watching it, seems to be more from steering slop (less responsiveness) than actual wandering. I’ll start with the screw adjustment and coupler kit. I needed to replace the leaking input seal anyway so might as well do both while the steering wheel is out!

 

[moes]

Sonny or any body else, if you have a manual steering box and seeing your taking it out of the car, check this out it's good reading it should help you it's by Richard Ehrenberg,

http://www.firmfeel.com/articles/MAarticle2014dec.pdf

 

[Don Frelier]

Can this be rebuilt in the car?

Have someone in the car turn the wheel a bit each way, see if the shaft turns a bit but not the coupler.
You have to unbolt the supports from within the car, then pull the column back a bit.
Then replace the guts in the steering coupler, note the way the two shoes are set in when you pull it apart. The cover is tricky to get the tabs bent over to stay on.
Someone does make a wire retainer for the cover I believe.

 

[Billccm]

Detroit muscle sells the wire hold down. It's 13.95 free shipping on eBay. I have this on my road runner.
Seller of my car claims steering box was rebuilt 9 years ago. I don't see a receipt for this, but the box has some paint marks and looks like 2006 and initials.
My alignment was negative 1.4 and 1.1 degrees. The front will wonder a bit at high speeds and uneven roads.

 

[moes]

here is something else that will help with steering I've use on another Mopar I had. check this out

http://www.firmfeel.com/articles/MAarticle2011dec.pdf

 

[Cranky]

here is something else that will help with steering I've use on another Mopar I had. check this out

http://www.firmfeel.com/articles/MAarticle2011dec.pdf

Another way to help strengthen the K frame is to solid weld it. I've done a few and get rid of the pinch weld flange entirely and solid weld the top half of the K to the bottom half. It gets rid of some weight too.

 

[AR67GTX]

Recirculating steering boxes have their tightest lash when they are perfectly centered. Anywhere off of center and the lash increases. If your lash is not adjusted tight enough it will be even sloppier than usual. So it's tedious but important to verify that your steering column/coupler/steering box input shaft are all properly aligned and indexed. Then the tie rods have to be adjusted so that tires straight ahead is accurately indexed to the dead center position in the steering box and steering column/wheel.

If uncertain where dead center is on the steering box input, the pitman arm can be disconnected and the box turned all the way in one direction and then the number of turns counted to turn it all the way to the other stop. Then divide the number of turns lock to lock, by two and turn back that amount to center the box. Then index the steering column and coupler to be straight ahead with the box in the centered position.

But if the car is aligned such that straight ahead places the steering box in an off-center position, the additional lash will definitely increase slop and wandering.