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Reproducing 63-67 b body parts

Brandy

Jack Stand Racer #6..and proud of it!
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I had a conversation with Mike Ross at B/E & A Parts today about making some stuff for 67's. Here is his final answer after three E-mails back and forth in discussion.


Randy,



I haven’t sold 10 sets of tail light bezels in the last 3 years. It is extremely expensive to reproduce parts correctly making them inherently more expensive. Not knocking the guys with the cars, but, they seem to be some of the cheapest in the hobby and will not pay what it takes to get a good part. I can tell you with all certainty, I have no interest in reproducing anymore parts for the 63-67 b-body cars, the parts that have been don’t sell very well at all.



Time to leave for the day, have a nice New Years.



Mike
 
I don't think I like the tone of that email.

Maybe if the prices for Mopar repros weren't double or triple what ford and gm repors sell for....Mopar guys wouldn't be so "cheap".
 
If he thinks 63-67 guys are cheap,,You guys are Bill Gates compaired to us guys that do slant six mopars !:laughing6:
 
Yah...I didn't care for his coments either. He does kinda have a point about the parts not selling. But does he, or anyone for that matter, market to the 67 and down crowd? I don't see it. 68 and up gets all of the attention. There are just as many of us as there are of them. It's a perceived popularity contest, that we are losing. At least Layson's will make the wheel arch trim if they get 50 pre orders.
 
as a 67 owner I feel I must post my annoyance:

1st...Who the hell is this guy? I have owned my car for 3 years and looked for parts the entire time and never once came up with his site, name or whatever....want to sell parts...people have to know you exist.

2nd...$400 is ludacris for a repro tail light bezel...I have bought entire 66/67 4 door sedans with perfect bezels for $6-700.

3rd...I need things like grille surrounds, quarter panels, front fenders, bumpers....I could give a crap about new handles, knobs, etc etc....make the parts we can't find and we'll pay the price we have to to get them...except I am too broke and frugal to pay $1000 for a grille surround....now $250 I would probably do.
 
as a 67 owner I feel I must post my annoyance:

1st...Who the hell is this guy? I have owned my car for 3 years and looked for parts the entire time and never once came up with his site, name or whatever....want to sell parts...people have to know you exist.

2nd...$400 is ludacris for a repro tail light bezel...I have bought entire 66/67 4 door sedans with perfect bezels for $6-700.

3rd...I need things like grille surrounds, quarter panels, front fenders, bumpers....I could give a crap about new handles, knobs, etc etc....make the parts we can't find and we'll pay the price we have to to get them...except I am too broke and frugal to pay $1000 for a grille surround....now $250 I would probably do.

As an owner of a 65 Coronet, there is not a whole lot of anything out there for my car for reproduction parts. Everything available out there for a Coronet is 66 and up. 65 is a one year body style...so if I can find anything out there used and think I may need it in the future...gotta get it.
 
They were making $400 66/67 Coronet instrument bezels and $350 dash pads IIRC.

Nice but just the bezel for 4 bills plus "on the high side" shipping- not in my budget.

I did buy what I believe is one of their "blem" cluster bezels for $200 and free shipping.

Chrome is great but black paint is real thick over the letters.

I don't think I could get one rechromed for 2 bills.

- - - Updated - - -

Isn't some 65 stuff the same as 64 and 63?

Like the quarter panel wheel arch, and floor pans?
 
Well this Just plain sucks after the 68' is done ethier a 66' belvedere or 67' satty convert will be getting restored so I guess I have to count my lucky stars I have a very good 66' parts car but still these cars are still desirable and if their was more repop parts out their more guys would want to fix them up just have a very hard time believing that their is hardly no interest in these b-bodys !! :icon_scratch::icon_scratch:
 
Mike from BE&A sells the Mopar licensed stuff with the original part numbers etc on them. If your doing an all out "original matching numbers restoration", that's the price you pay. If your someone like me, who's just looking to replace these old pitted parts with shiny new stuff, you can get the same exact pieces "unbranded" cheaper from vendors like Vans.
Body parts on the other hand.... keep dream'n
 
parts...

I agree and i'll post what I told him about that. FYI this guy, Mark Ross, owns B/E & A MOPAR resto parts.

"I just saw and read your e-mail about the parts not selling well. I seems that the majority of producers feel the same way. Muscle cars start at 1968 and up. IMHO the reason that they don't sell well is that 67 and down has a bad reputation for scarce parts availability. It's a catch 22. This will never change until the parts supply changes too. Virtually every part is available for 68 and up. What do guys buy? 68 and up. If the supply was not there for 68 and up but was for 67 and down, what would guys be more likely to buy? I know it's not that simple due to many reasons of popularity that have nothing to do with supply of parts. From our end of the equation it seems that the producers and suppliers don't care about the 67 and down owners. If I had, for instance, done my homework ahead of buying my '67 Coronet I might not have made the purchase. It has been a pain in the posterior to get good parts. I have a 70 Charger and a 68 Charger as well and have no issues finding parts for either. So in closing I guess ..thank you for listening and making all of the great parts that you do make. I understand your position completely from a producer standpoint. Lots of money involved. Please understand it from our end too, lots of money involved. Have a safe and blessed New Year and a successful one too!!"

Well this Just plain sucks after the 68' is done ethier a 66' belvedere or 67' satty convert will be getting restored so I guess I have to count my lucky stars I have a very good 66' parts car but still these cars are still desirable and if their was more repop parts out their more guys would want to fix them up just have a very hard time believing that their is hardly no interest in these b-bodys !! :icon_scratch::icon_scratch:
 
I've never purchased from that vender, But
I have heard some good & some bad about every vender that deals with Mopar stuff too,
usually always price related too...
I imagine being a business owner doing especially "lessor purchased" Reproduction parts,
no doubt is probably hard & a tough business, kind of a double edged sward...

There's not millions of these cars out there, there never was, like GM & Ford

You have to have a big enough market & interest, at your price point/demographics,
just to be "at all profitable" or get stuck with the parts

You need to advertise to sell, very little advertisements I've seen...
Probably need to sell for enough $$$ to make a profit {or why do it ?}...
You need to probably make a run of 50-100 of each "single items"
to be anywhere near cost effective {not sure if it would even be cost effective then}
or you will probably lose $$$ on the parts...

IMHFO no-one's in business to lose money,
But at-least we have far more stuff for Mopars now than ever before...

I'm pretty sure, the labor costs is probably the worst factor, especially anything with Chrome on it...
I've always spent what ever I needed to, to get what I wanted/needed, It's part of the hobby,
no-one likes to spend more than they have too, no-one likes to be gouged either...
But if you need it & it cost more, you can't find any, anywhere else,
what are you going to do ? {your stuck}...
Supply & demand issues, drives prices too...
Less demand higher $$$ costs on both ends buyer & sellers/manufacturers costs...

Sorry don't take this the wrong way, BUT
I actually don't think he's too far off about allot of Mopar guys being cheap,
{these aren't a dime a dozen GM's or Fords, parts available everwhere},
way too many times, I've personally experience allot Mopar people trying to
"lowball me constantly, on everything Mopar parts related"...
When the stuff was listed way cheap already, make no sense to me...
It's a bad perception mostly {Maybe ?}

Or the other side is,
some people think their old rusted & worn out, especially rarer stuff
& especially Mopar parts, are worth their weight in gold too...
These types of people, add to the problems/perceptions...

People gouging other people in the same end of the Mopar collector car hobby,
that's really sad...

How many times have you heard that complaint, just here on FBBO ??

These parts are NOT being mass produced, or very rarely even made,
or are some cheap Chinese Re-Pop crap, like the millions of GM/Ford stuff is &/or
are far more expensive to make, because of it's/their rarity,
especially if not in larger batch/run #'s,
like most all the GM & Ford reproduction stuff is, because it's much more popular,
hence way cheaper to make & sell, it's just a #'s game...

Or because unfortunately, a certain select era is more popular, than another,
that makes the parts, more available...

Hey Mopar is my 1st love too, I've spent far more on Mopar cars
than any other brand, I could/have build at-least 2 to 1 {cost related}
if it was the other brands, it's par for the course...

I do feel for empathetic those commenting here,
that can't find what they need for their cars, at a reasonable price too...


It's the nature of the beast, some/most don't support the companies,
especially after all the complaints, about there's no Mopar parts,
but then when they do finally make the parts, people complain about the costs...
IMO some justified, some just being cheap, want their cake & eat it too...LOL

Sorry fellow FBBO members,
I'm not trying to ruffle any feathers, not meant to offend anyone,
especially the original poster Ghostrider 67, I feel for you guy...


My $0.02 cents, my take on the supply & demand issue

Have a nice day everyone,
lets keep supporting them companies, that help to support us....
 
There's never going to be a parts stream for the earlier Bs like there is for the 68s on up. It doesn't make any business sense to go through all the BS it takes to crank out repro parts for such a limited market. That said, Mike shouldn't have made the general statement that guy that own pre 68 Bs are "cheap' just because they don't want to pay $400 for taillight bezels. I get the feeling that he overestimated the demand for the parts he produced and what the price point might be, so now he's pissed because he can't sell them for what he thought they would go for. Simple marketing mistake IMHO. Part of the reason I bought the 64 Belvedere that I have now is that I love the body style, but also because the car was complete and unrestored. I knew that if stuff was missing it would be expensive and a bitch to find. Just the way it is.
 
Hey there Budnicks, no feathers ruffled here. As I said in my e-mail to Mark, it's not a simple thing and yes, I think he overestimated the market for the tail lights for the 67's. He SHOULD have done his research because he would have found that other parts, less intricate parts, are also in demand and his start up tooling etc would have cost him less and the price per unit would have been lower. And hey, has he never heard of demographic advertising? Or having a sale? How about all of the exterior trim for a '67 R/T? A rocker panel HAS to be less costly to produce than the intricate '67 500 tail light bezels. Thanks everyone for your comments and please, don't avoid this supplier because of this thread. He DOES have many '67 and down parts for sale that I have not seen elsewhere. Just not the ones THAT I WANT!! lol.
 
The mopar bunch are a weird crowd...this goes for performance parts as well.
I would think that at least sheet metal would sell like quarters, fenders etc...Perhaps not all the little chrome pieces are in demand but the bare bones would be nice. You can always have the old chrome re-done if you had too.
 
Hey there Budnicks, no feathers ruffled here. As I said in my e-mail to Mark, it's not a simple thing and yes, I think he overestimated the market for the tail lights for the 67's. He SHOULD have done his research because he would have found that other parts, less intricate parts, are also in demand and his start up tooling etc would have cost him less and the price per unit would have been lower. And hey, has he never heard of demographic advertising? Or having a sale? How about all of the exterior trim for a '67 R/T? A rocker panel HAS to be less costly to produce than the intricate '67 500 tail light bezels. Thanks everyone for your comments and please, don't avoid this supplier because of this thread. He DOES have many '67 and down parts for sale that I have not seen elsewhere. Just not the ones THAT I WANT!! lol.

I think I completely understood what your meaning was,
I just didn't want to come across like an A--Hole, after a few of my comments...
OR
Insult someone needlessly, is why I added that, part...
Also I wanted to give some insight & my opinions...

I was recommended to them B/E &A parts by a few people,
but I actually found OE parts closer/locally,
so I didn't buy from them...
 
Let's put it this way... If I want to replace the tail light assembly on my 67 Charger, it's going to cost me $1205.00... and that's just for the exterior Trim and the Plastic Lens. That price does not include the rubber or the foam gaskets also required to do the job, let alone the actual tail light housing itself... !!!OUCH!!! I got my parts elsewhere for a considerably less, but it still wasn't cheap.
At times like this, I usually do a reality check... To justify my costs in these situations, I simply look out the window at a new car, and ask myself, what would it cost to replace the tail light assembly on that brand shiny new Charger over there.... At least it makes me feel a little better. :rolling:

$1205... I didn't pay that much for my 97 Grand Cherokee 4X4, or my 03 Dakota 4X4, but then again, they're just tools... The Charger is a different story altogether... The Charger is my actual vehicle, and is used strictly for pleasure.
 
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