Rear Suspension Debate

[Jet Doc]

Next week I'm going to order my Dana from Strange and I am now trying to decide on a Caltrac set up or ladder bars with coil overs. The car has SS springs on it now moved inboard/mini tubbed. The car will see very limited street use. Will be running stroker aluminum headed wedge. Input and personal experiences welcomed.

 

[Budnicks]

Cal-Tracs

Next week I'm going to order my Dana from Strange and I am now trying to decide on a Caltrac set up or ladder bars with coil overs. The car has SS springs on it now moved inboard/mini tubbed. The car will see very limited street use. Will be running stroker aluminum headed wedge. Input and personal experiences welcomed.

Cal-tracs are a great option they "don't recommend" using them with SS springs though, if your going thru all the work of installing ladder bars & coil overs, I would go to the 4 Link & coil overs, it's about the same amount of work to install & infinitely more adjustable than a ladder bar... Just my opinion..

 

[moparpoor]

Cal-tracs are a great option they "don't recommend" using them with SS springs though, if your going thru all the work of installing ladder bars & coil overs, I would go to the 4 Link & coil overs, it's about the same amount of work to install & infinitely more adjustable than a ladder bar... Just my opinion..

I don't know how installing a ladder bar is near the work to install a true 4link.A true 4 link will require a great deal of structure changes to fit the the brkts and set ride height correctly.A ladder bar is nothing more than welding two crossmembers and some brkts.Everything will fit under the factory floors with no problem.Ladder bars are not much more work than a caltracs setup.A ladder bar setup is much easier and forgiving setup.4link is the ultimate setup if done correctly and you are willing to spend some time playing with it.If you travel to many tracks you have to find the right setup for each track in alot of cases.Ladder bar setup;easy install,fit under factory floors,low cost,will carry a big b body well into the eight second range with no problems,and easy to use.4link;high cost for parts,high cost for restructure for install,high cost to maintain on some,and require a great deal of time for proper setup/adjustment.You just have to ask yourself how fast do you want go and how much work you want to put into it.

 

[SUPERSTOCKRACER]

put in a ladder bar setup from the beginning and dont look back. i went from a 1.42 60 foot with cal tracs to 1.36 right outta the box. with no tuning.
after that i sold all my cal trac setups and switched to ladder bars. and get double adjustable strange rear coil overs.
best ladderbar setup is chassis engineering triple asjustable ladder bars. im a dealer if you want a great deal.

 

[ironside]

Would definitely agree with SSR! I put a 4-link in my cuda last year and that is a serious
undertaking. You essentially redo everything behind the seat. You have alot of options yes but time and money!!!
Next one I do will be a ladder bar. They can almost be a weekend or two project and a little less routine maintenance and constant tuning.
Love my strange doubles front and rear too.
Good luck!

 

[moparpoor]

You can still do a 4link and retain the back seat and most if not all the factory floors.You are limited on tire height and positions as for bar adjustment.I have built some a bodies and one 72 b body with this an under chassis 4 link.I don't consider this a true 4link do to the lack of bar positions.In the end the ladder bar is still easier and can be done in a weekend.The biggest problem for any stock frame rail mopar is the length of the rear shocks to get proper ride height.Its not a major problem,but something that needs to be measured and thought out before ordering a shock with a ride height of 14" or so.

 

[SUPERSTOCKRACER]

The biggest problem for any stock frame rail mopar is the length of the rear shocks to get proper ride height.Its not a major problem,but something that needs to be measured and thought out before ordering a shock with a ride height of 14" or so.

this is the smartest thing in this post. i had my 1st ladder bar car done by a nonmopar chassis shop and he put the wrong rear strange double adjustables in and cut my trunk floor and had to add a cover so you dont see the top of the shocks. i was pissed. the shocks were way too long.
my next 3 cars were done by a mopar guy and used the shorter correct strange coil overs and it came out correct.

 

[SUPERSTOCKRACER]

this is how it should be done. shorter shocks with upper shock holding tube under trunk floor. this car hooks in the snow!lol

 

[moparpoor]

Those look like 12 to 13" ride height shocks wich is pretty the standard for mopars.Hey SSR,I see you have moved your IC down a few holes.The top holes a little violent on the launch or the rear bumpers are to expensive to be draggin.:headbang:

 

[SUPERSTOCKRACER]

Those look like 12 to 13" ride height shocks wich is pretty the standard for mopars.Hey SSR,I see you have moved your IC down a few holes.The top holes a little violent on the launch or the rear bumpers are to expensive to be draggin.:headbang:

good eye on the ic move. it was doing crazy wheelstands in the top hole.
bringing the bar down did help a little. not much. this car makes insane torque.
almost torque as hp in old combo for some reason.
got a new engine combo so we will see what happens now.

 

[Budnicks]

Ladders vs Cal-Tracs or 4 link

I don't know how installing a ladder bar is near the work to install a true 4link.A true 4 link will require a great deal of structure changes to fit the the brkts and set ride height correctly.A ladder bar is nothing more than welding two crossmembers and some brkts.Everything will fit under the factory floors with no problem.Ladder bars are not much more work than a caltracs setup.A ladder bar setup is much easier and forgiving setup.4link is the ultimate setup if done correctly and you are willing to spend some time playing with it.If you travel to many tracks you have to find the right setup for each track in alot of cases.Ladder bar setup;easy install,fit under factory floors,low cost,will carry a big b body well into the eight second range with no problems,and easy to use.4link;high cost for parts,high cost for restructure for install,high cost to maintain on some,and require a great deal of time for proper setup/adjustment.You just have to ask yourself how fast do you want go and how much work you want to put into it.

It's just a suggestion, and yes it's more work to install them correctly... I'm not saying ladder bars are bad... I personally prefer the 4 link over Ladder bars myself, even if it means cutting the rear floorboards & more work to be able to install them & yes they are more complicated but well worth it in the long run , when you go to marginal tracks especially.. I would say, If you don't want to cut the floors to install the 4 link go with Cal-Tracs, if it's simplicity that your after, many SS racers use them with great success, I went 8.58 156mph with a 3520lb RR on drag radials & Cal-Tracs, then quickly got booted from the track for only having a roll bar... I really think it depends on what your doing, if it's a pure race car the 4 link is best, if it's a combination mostly street/strip car the Cal-Tracs are the best, the Ladders are really a "middle of the road choice in my opinion", not a bad choice at all, they will work, just no were near the adjustability of a 4 link... ladder bars aren't very good to use on the street either, that is if you plan on any street driving, the heavy side loads have a tendencies to break spherical rod ends, at least with my experiences... I was just trying to help with a difficult decision, good luck with your choice, have fun with your Mopar...

 

[Cranky]

I also vote ladder bars. For the money the CT's cost, you could put a bit more with it and buy the bars, shocks, springs etc and get away from the leafs. It doesn't matter how good the traction system is, you are still saddled with leaf springs and about the only reason Calvert came up with those is because the class he was running dictated leaf springs and he wanted something that was better than what was available. That is the ONLY reason I would use them but if you never plan on running in a class with that rule, then use the bars.

 

[moparpoor]

Here is some food for thought.
The first picture is what I setup and speced out with a 29.5x10.5w series tire.Heres where things get really screwed up.I let the owner order the parts and make decisions.As you can see you can put a four link under the factory floors,but are limited to tire size and adjustment.
The rest of the photos are a rework at the owners expense because he new best.Wheel openings are only 34"and area between rail and qrt is 17.5".So he ordered a 32x13.5 tire because he felt the 29.5 didn't fill the wells enough.A 32x13.5 actually measures 34" tall and a section width of 17.7":angry1:
So we stretched the qrts and moved the axle back to fit the tires.Just to create another problem.The shock crossmember is to low to get the correct ride height:angryfire: So the end result is a complete moly backhalf.All this do to one easily made mistake.I'm sure most of you guys can figure out the adds in cost.Once the car is finished it will be a bad M/F.I have to finish narrowing the rear axle and finalize everything on the rear.Then the next step is a 25.5 spec cage.The owner doesn't ask to many questions any more.Just writes checks now.:icon_cheers:

 

[Budnicks]

That Charger looks like it will be cool ride when it's done, it's nice to have a big check book backing things up, got to love the customers buying or ordering stuff & changing their mind mid stream is also fun to deal with... Happy Moparing

 

[SUPERSTOCKRACER]

MOPARPOOR. you do very nice work. Your an asset to FBBO as well as Budnicks. You two really help this site out. Its nice to have knowledgeable member on here. thanks for sharing. :notworthy:

 

[moparpoor]

Thanks for the compliment.I just hate to see people get roped into something that can be avoided.The amount of hours I have in just the rework is rediculous,due to one simple mistake.Information is everything,Ihope this helps someone from making similar mistakes.

 

[Moose]

64 Sport Fury

I thought about this one for a LONG while. I ordered a Dana From Strange and went with the 4-link from Alston Chassis Works.. Hope this helps..

Moose

 

[Budnicks]

Hey guys there is another option there are some suspension guys making some what "bolt in" type 4 bar set ups (not really bolt in) short top & long bottom bars Riley Motorsports & Magnumforce Racing if my memory serves me correctly, I know they aren't ideal for racing & I have never used any but it's another option with very little modifications to the Floor or Body, I have seen only the Magnumforce Racing 1 in person not too shabby looking, no clue on functionality geometrically they looked sound, I wouldn't put 800hp to them but short of that they maybe a good option... I don't know anyone personally that uses either 1 of the set-ups to base anything on, just comments on appearance & costs "not cheap", but cheaper & easier isn't always better... Thanks for the compliment -S/SRacer- after 35+ years of racing & dabbling in & building cars I think some of the information I have learned over the years, maybe it can help someone avoid doing things over & spending their money on the same types of projects twice, I've made many, many, mistakes over the years & still make a few now & then, I just like to add something sometimes that aren't covered a different perspective & let people do their research & make a educated decision with multiple options... Heck I still learn something new every day, I recently just found out how to post photos, I know it's easy but, I'm not, or have ever been, a big camera or video guy, always had some else doing that stuff, so I won't do it much, but I am learning still... This site has an abundance of knowledgeable people we can all learn from...

 

[moparpoor]

I thought about this one for a LONG while. I ordered a Dana From Strange and went with the 4-link from Alston Chassis Works.. Hope this helps..

Moose

That is exactly what is in the car.Made some mods I wanted to do,but almost exactly the same.Actually I used there brackets.

 

[moparpoor]

Hey guys there is another option there are some suspension guys making some what "bolt in" type 4 bar set ups (not really bolt in) short top & long bottom bars Riley Motorsports & Magnumforce Racing if my memory serves me correctly, I know they aren't ideal for racing & I have never used any but it's another option with very little modifications to the Floor or Body, I have seen only the Magnumforce Racing 1 in person not too shabby looking, no clue on functionality geometrically they looked sound, I wouldn't put 800hp to them but short of that they maybe a good option... I don't know anyone personally that uses either 1 of the set-ups to base anything on, just comments on appearance & costs "not cheap", but cheaper & easier isn't always better... Thanks for the compliment -S/SRacer- after 35+ years of racing & dabbling in & building cars I think some of the information I have learned over the years, maybe it can help someone avoid doing things over & spending their money on the same types of projects twice, I've made many, many, mistakes over the years & still make a few now & then, I just like to add something sometimes that aren't covered a different perspective & let people do their research & make a educated decision with multiple options... Heck I still learn something new every day, I recently just found out how to post photos, I know it's easy but, I'm not, or have ever been, a big camera or video guy, always had some else doing that stuff, so I won't do it much, but I am learning still... This site has an abundance of knowledgeable people we can all learn from...

I know of one guy running it here in mi and he is well in the 700hp range I believe.Never seen it on a track,seen it eat up some well tuned brand x stuff on the street.I believe the stuff to be great comprimise for a S/S type car.