MOPAR 383 TICKING :( HELP PLEASE

dcoland70RR · Sep 4, 2018

So while I have a day off and kids at school went to take my 1970 RR 383 4 speed out to visit dad at the cemetery. I have not driven it in a few weeks due to schedule. So after a few minute warm up I go to close the hood and hear a ticking I never heard before. You can quickly hear it coming from the top of the motor passenger side towards the front, hoped just a loose rocker arm assembly.

Then I took off the valve cover and look at this:

So I found out the factory torque specs for the rocker arm rod bolts is 25, they all were properly set at 25 already. So I am guessing time to replace the rockers due to likely having wear, and I assume I should replace the push rods too incase they might be warn or slightly bent, but I do not see bends in the push rods by eye view.

Can anyone please tell me if that is the best option or anything else I need to check beside the rocker arms?

Good factory quality brand recommendations?

Should I replace the rocker arm rod also or just the rocker arms and push rods?

Thanks for any input,

Dave

scot · Sep 4, 2018

I'm gonna say you have a lifter issue. Not pumping up.

Don Frelier · Sep 4, 2018

Collapsed lifter or god forbid a bad cam lobe. The stamped steel rockers really don't wear if they get oil and it would not just show up one day, it would take time.

khryslerkid · Sep 4, 2018

Check your oil, see how much oil you have going to the rockers. (Looks a little dry) Is the gauge showing good pressure?

You have to check rocker play at each cylinder when both valves are closed. They are at different positions when you were checking them. Sounds like it's just one rocker or lifter. Sometimes when they sit for awhile, a lifter sitting at the bottom, will stick and not build up pressure. Start it again and it will pump up.

When you hear a sound as you did, please don't rev it up! Also please hold your phone horizontal when taking videos.

WP29440SE · Sep 4, 2018

if you are showing good oil pressure with a manual gauge, it's a lifter. usually upon start- up they fail to pump up.

dcoland70RR · Sep 4, 2018

Thanks for replies and suggestions. I have never heard any noises in the engine before. Oil pressure showed great and oil is full. I was recommended by some to change all the push rods and rockers. How do I check each rocker individually? Any way to check if its a lifter?

69B7RR · Sep 4, 2018

Good advice from Don, Scot, Khryslerkid, & WP. It does sound metallic like a lifter. If it was me, and I’m no expert, before tearing things apart & replacing stuff, I’d first try to isolate & confirm it, or rule out other things, like possibly an exhaust leak etc, with maybe a stethoscope........just sayin.....Jim

tonysrt · Sep 4, 2018

If you can lift rocker arm on valve side and push down on push rod side maybe that's the bad lifter. I had bent push rods on a small block and it never made any lifter noise, and some of the rods were pretty bent. So I would look into the bad lifter as the culprit.

FrnkNsteen · Sep 4, 2018

Well,....

Quick question,... how many miles on the motor? Was it rebuilt at some point by you or anyone else? If so,.. how long since the rebuild?

Reason I ask is I just went through this on the 400 in my Barracuda. The previous owner said he had the motor rebuilt before I purchased it, but couldn't tell me anything about it. Said he couldn't find the folder of receipts and could only tell me it had a Competition Cam in it. :blah:

I had rockers start making the same noise as yours is making. I pulled it apart to confirm no bad spots on the cam. The wear pattern looked fine. A few of my rockers were loose like you are seeing. I started to pull the rocker shafts off so I could inspect the lifters for wear. I immediately noticed there was almost no preload on the lifters, yet the lifters were pumped up solid.

I put everything back in and watched as I tightened the rocker shafts back down and was able to confirm that there was only about .005" - .008" preload on the pushrods and lifters when everything was torqued down.

Assumption is the previous owner (or whoever built his engine) went with stock 8.575" pushrods (for a 400) and didn't measure to see if that was what was needed. The pushrods lengths in the motor ranged from 8.576 - 8.580". I ended up ordering slightly longer pushrods and put it back together. Haven't had an issue since and it is running good with little to no rocker noise.

Link to my thread:
https://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/threads/developed-a-tick.413149/#post-1972174723

dcoland70RR · Sep 4, 2018

Thanks for all the info. I bought the car online from Hanksters motors in PA, 2 years ago. Was a risk because I never inspected it. Original odometer read 21,750 but could not be confirmed at all. Videos of the car running at the dealer before buying it, sound showed it had a non stock slight lumpy cam. So on that note I have NO IDEA at all if the motor was ever touched up or rebuilt in any manner. No history at all on the motor. Serial number does not match the car, comes back to a factory replacement block. So I have had it 2 years and put around 400 miles on it. Never a drop of smoke every out of exhaust from any burning oil or other obvious problems.

So I took the rockers off and push rods out. Nothing major I saw but I AM NOT A ENGINE MECHANIC AT ALL. I have my own experience around cars over 20 years but nothing major. I cleaned everything, double checked the oil which I know to be slightly over filled, maybe a 1/4 of a quart or so over filled at most. I have been running Mobil 1 full synthetic so not sure if thats a bad idea on a 1970's motor. But had no problem since using this oil for 2 years, but only driven like 400 miles. GREAT NEWS is I put it all back together and NO MORE TICK. Hopefully it stays that way but my guess is that my be a early sign of something maybe going bad. I would guess to that it was a lifter noise.

WHATS Best way to check lifters

Don Frelier · Sep 4, 2018

For a flat tappet cam you should run an oil with zinc in it.

beanhead · Sep 4, 2018

A quick lifter check is, with the rocker shafts removed, push on the lifter with the pushrod. It shoud be hard. If it compresses easily by hand the lifter is weak and/or failing. I'm sure there are other ways too maybe the engine Pros will weigh in but that can point you in the right direction if one of them has a broken spring or something

moparedtn · Sep 4, 2018

Don Frelier said:
For a flat tappet cam you should run an oil with zinc in it.

^^^^THIS!!!!!^^^^^^
Get that synthetic outta there pronto and get some oil with proper amounts of ZDDP (zinc) and phosphorus in it.
I went down your road a few years ago because I've run Mobil1 in everything late model I've owned from '85-up.
Problem is, all those engines had roller type cams in them. Synthetic is fine in those, but NOT in flat tappet cammed engines!
I wiped a cam in the last engine in my GTX and it didn't even take as long as you say you've got on yours.
Don't go there.

burntorng70 · Sep 4, 2018

I run amsoil synthetic with zddp for flat tappets in mine. Valvoline vr1 also has the required stuff. A car that sits a lot can have a lifter tick show up now and again. Back in the day, I added oil to my 318 when the lifters got loud. It was about 2 quarts low at that point.It ran for years that way.

PurpleBeeper · Sep 4, 2018

My 2-cents? Run a bottle of Motor Flush in it (follow directions EXACTLY) & change the oil filter before changing any parts. While you've got the valve covers off, go ahead and check for any noticeable "slop" in any of the rockers/pushrods/lifters....one at a time....by turning the motor over by hand with a 15/16" socket on the big crankshaft bolt in front. Turn a little, wiggle all the rocker arm....repeat, repeat, repeat. You should be able to determine which rocker/pushrod/lifter is "sloppy" and I would change that whole set for just that one cylinder if it were me (even the lifter, which many people wouldn't do)….assuming you find one that's not right. It could be as simple as some engine oil sludge in one lifter's oil bleed hole (Motor Flush would fix this as noted above).

dcoland70RR · Sep 4, 2018

Truly THANKS TO EVERYONE. I appreciate your help. No more lifter tick but tmrw I am off again and changing the oil in the morning back to valvoline 10W30 oil I have cases of because I am not a motor guy at all but thought maybe synthetic Mobil 1 is not right for a 1970 engine.

beanhead · Sep 4, 2018

dcoland70RR said:
Truly THANKS TO EVERYONE. I appreciate your help. No more lifter tick but tmrw I am off again and changing the oil in the morning back to valvoline 10W30 oil I have cases of because I am not a motor guy at all but thought maybe synthetic Mobil 1 is not right for a 1970 engine.

You need to use the VR-1valvoline at the very least...regular valvoline(or any standard oil) no longer has the required levels of slippy required for flat-tappet cams! A synthetic will work IF it contains high enough levels of zinc/phosphate/zddp(AKA slippy!)

moparedtn · Sep 5, 2018

PurpleBeeper said:
My 2-cents? Run a bottle of Motor Flush in it (follow directions EXACTLY) & change the oil filter before changing any parts. While you've got the valve covers off, go ahead and check for any noticeable "slop" in any of the rockers/pushrods/lifters....one at a time....by turning the motor over by hand with a 15/16" socket on the big crankshaft bolt in front. Turn a little, wiggle all the rocker arm....repeat, repeat, repeat. You should be able to determine which rocker/pushrod/lifter is "sloppy" and I would change that whole set for just that one cylinder if it were me (even the lifter, which many people wouldn't do)….assuming you find one that's not right. It could be as simple as some engine oil sludge in one lifter's oil bleed hole (Motor Flush would fix this as noted above).

I've seen ol' Marvel Mystery oil get 'em pumping back up again too.

moparedtn · Sep 5, 2018

beanhead said:
You need to use the VR-1valvoline at the very least...regular valvoline(or any standard oil) no longer has the required levels of slippy required for flat-tappet cams! A synthetic will work IF it contains high enough levels of zinc/phosphate/zddp(AKA slippy!)

Yep. Check specifically for ZDDP levels in ANY oil you choose to use.
"Conventional" doesn't mean what it used to in oils.

71Beeper · Sep 5, 2018

The Amsoil ZRod oil has the most amount of zinc in it.
Made for engines with solid cams.
It has more zinc than Shell Rotella.

MOPAR 383 TICKING :( HELP PLEASE

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