440 Budget Build - Dyno results

[Hemirunner]

I mentioned in another thread that I had a budget 440 build about ready for the dyno. We finished it today. I'll go through the whole build. The build was loosely based on this but we cut costs even more. There are still quite a few more pennies to pinch here:

http://www.hotrod.com/how-to/engine/1412-how-you-can-build-a-stout-537hp-street-440/

Stock 440 block, bored .030" over and decked to 10.700 (zero deck)
Stock Forged 440 crank .010/.010 (rotating assembly balanced)
440 Source factory replacement rods for press fit pins
TRW Forged L2355-030 pistons
Sealed Power E-424K30 Pre-gapped rings (the big 5/64" kind)
Mopar performance P4120998 Windage Tray
Summit G-3511 Oil Pan
Stock 3/8 Oil Pickup
Sealed power 224-4174 Standard volume oil pump
Durabond PD-17 Cam Bearings
Calico Coated 1B527HD10 Rod Bearings
Calico Coated 5M877P10 Main Bearings (just because I had them. You can use regular uncoated P-bearings)
Wix 51515 oil filter
Stock Distributor Gear
JP5606T Timing Set
Summit C4279 Damper
Comp Cams 23-228-4 Cam XE285HL-10
Comp Hyd Lifters
Comp 7442-16 Pushrods
Edelbrock 60929 Performer Heads
Fel-Pro 1009 Head gaskets
ARP145-3606 Head bolt set
Edelbrock 7193 Performer RPM Intake
ARP 444-2001 Intake manifold bolts (you could use hardware store stuff)
440 Source 1.6 Adjustable Aluminum Rocker arms and hold down set
Summit 440350 Valve covers powder coated black wrinkle
Edelbrock 4403 breathers
Edelbrock 1813 800cfm Thunder series carb
MSD 32733 Spark Plug wires
MSD 8546 Pro-billet distributor
Edelbrock 1215 Intake valley pan gasket
Champion RC12YC plugs
6 quarts of Comp 15w50 break in oil
1 bottle of comp break in additive
92 octane crap gas from the local metro mart

Here's the machine shop portion to consider for those of you want to cost this out:
Bake/blast and mag
Bore and hone
Deck to 10.700
Align Hone Mains
Jet Wash
Balance rotating assembly
Mount Pistons on Rods
And for those of you that cannot build it yourself (or don't want to) take into consideration all of the cleaning, mockup, fitting lifters to bores (after you bake and blast these blocks can move or develop lips on the lifter bores) more cleaning, painting, powdercoating, assembly lube, misc nuts bolts washers, etc, lol



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Video link:

http://vid701.photobucket.com/albums/ww16/CRE2004/Mobile%20Uploads/2015-05/E7080049-DC25-4D36-A7C2-9FC551597D39_zpssddqce2s.mp4

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This is the first time I've ever used the XE285HL Cam and it's a loper at idle. I had the black advance bushing and lightest advance spring in the distributor but I think I should've just locked it out as the additional advance at idle would smooth that out a bunch. We made maximum power at 35degrees total advance.

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You can see that we out performed the Hot Rod guys in the torque deparment and we didn't leave all that much HP on the table. With our heavy forged pistons, we didn't plan to rev it to the moon so the dual plane performer was the better choice of intakes.

 

[Hemirunner]

We had big 2-1/8 tube dyno headers with big 3-1/2" collectors that really didn't help with low end torque, and the performer RPM intake really killed plenum volume vs the Victor, so our average torque numbers aren't inline with the HR engine, but for what it is, we're thrilled. I'm second guessing my 1.6 rocker ratio choice given the low 9.98:1 CR (the HR boys had 10.5 in theirs which helped with TQ as well.) but I didn't have any 1.5's to put on it for testing. If it was a solid, I could've added some lash and that would tell.

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Here are the averages for ours compared with the Hot Rod engine throughout the range where we both have data:
HR AVG TQ 528
Our AVG TQ 518
HR AVG HP 457
Our AVG HP 449

Not too bad, and our carb/intake combo should better fit under the hood.

 

[dieseldazzle]

Im not seeing your peak numbers? Was just curious about what the peak tq/hp were and where at.

 

[Hemirunner]

Our Peaks 549tq 4500rpm/516hp 5300rpm
HR Peaks 538TQ 4500 rpm/537hp 5700rpm

 

[Derwud]

1: This is what I am looking to do.
2: Total MSRP of build?
3: I would love to see a HP comparison between the different Alum heads out there..
4: What about a Hyd Roller cam?

 

[kiwigtx]

Looks impressive to me....the only thing I would have installed different is a 1/2" oil pickup. :icon_thumright:

 

[Hemirunner]

Looks impressive to me....the only thing I would have installed different is a 1/2" oil pickup. :icon_thumright:

No need, that's just the magazine guys getting in your head!

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1: This is what I am looking to do.
2: Total MSRP of build?
3: I would love to see a HP comparison between the different Alum heads out there..
4: What about a Hyd Roller cam?

I listed all the parts, you could go through summit's website and total an MSRP pretty quick.
There's only so many aluminum heads out there that are "budget bolt on's" and of those, I doubt you'll see 5hp difference. You might consider the new "trick flow head" a budget bolt on and that might make more power. The Eddy heads are OOTB and can't be beat for $/HP or is that HP/$??
A Hydraulic roller cam just adds that much more cost in the cam and lifters and that's headed in the opposite direction of what we were looking to do.

 

[747mopar]

Thanks for posting, Impressive numbers if you ask me.

 

[Hemirunner]

Thanks for posting, Impressive numbers if you ask me.

Thanks, as I said in the 906 head thread, anything over 500hp was a bonus. Our goal was gobs of low end torque and relatively low cost. I think we nailed both. I haven't used these pistons since 1984 or so and didn't remember them being this heavy, lol. As far as cost, we could have skipped the powder coating and fancy bolts, used a parts store remanned distributor, some cheaper plug wires, reused a stock pan, rounded up a good used pump, bought a used intake/carb and stuck with stock rockers and pushrods and really gone nuts with cheapness. However, that would've sacrificed notable horsepower. I was building this for someone else, and he didn't really want a swap meet mess, so that also wasn't really an option.

 

[mentor70]

as i recall, HR ran a 950 car, IMO kinda unrealistic for mostly street car.

i was going doing a similar recipe, but i decided to CNC port my heads, and go hydraulic roller, with 850 carb.

id like to dyno with an M1 and a ported RPM to see which comb makes the best over all power and torque.

 

[Hemirunner]

If you're going to the extent of CNC porting the heads and add the roller cam, the holley carb and Victor intake start to fit the puzzle better. With this combo, I can't change anything without changing other things. More cam means more induction and preferably more compression, more cylinder head means more cam/induction and compression..... it never ends, lol.

 

[mentor70]

If you're going to the extent of CNC porting the heads and add the roller cam, the holley carb and Victor intake start to fit the puzzle better. With this combo, I can't change anything without changing other things. More cam means more induction and preferably more compression, more cylinder head means more cam/induction and compression..... it never ends, lol.

agreed, it never ends...lol

i dig the Victor, but its massive dimensions require major hood clearance and air cleaner contemplation, thats no fun.

 

[747mopar]

Just how much difference do the aluminum heads with the better compression chambers make? The reason I ask is because at some point in time I'm going to open my motor back up in an attempt to milk a few more ponies out of it with a cam swap and the 906's I have will support the larger cam so the only real advantage would be the fact that they are aluminum and the quench so I'm wondering if I should even change them.

 

[mentor70]

Just how much difference do the aluminum heads with the better compression chambers make? The reason I ask is because at some point in time I'm going to open my motor back up in an attempt to milk a few more ponies out of it with a cam swap and the 906's I have will support the larger cam so the only real advantage would be the fact that they are aluminum and the quench so I'm wondering if I should even change them.

well, IF you prep the heads with CNC porting or hand port job the heads will be in the 320 CFM range, far above the flow of Iron heads, to me thats the big advantage.

 

[Hemirunner]

Comparing the Eddy heads to a 906, the aluminum head has a smaller, more efficient chamber, a better plug location for a more complete burn and much better ports. If you're running a zero deck combo, you also get the quench. 747, I'm not familiar with your combo, so I'll brush up on that so I can sound reasonably intelligent when commenting on it.

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agreed, it never ends...lol

i dig the Victor, but its massive dimensions require major hood clearance and air cleaner contemplation, thats no fun.

True, but with the RPM, we had half the plugs showing right on and half showing they could be leaned out a tad. We took fuel out and the whole thing lost power which just proved the better fuel distribution of a single plane. The RPM intake also has very little plenum volume, I would love to have had a Victor to throw on and see what the gains were.

 

[Cranky]

The RPM intake also has very little plenum volume, I would love to have had a Victor to throw on and see what the gains were.

I would assume you will be going to the track with this at some point? You can always try the Victor out in the real world. A dyno is a great tool but it's never the same as being in the car and out on the track pushing a hunk of metal to a 10 second pass.

 

[HYRDGOON]

Really nice numbers and more great info! Your posts are very helpful Hemirunner, Not to mention building arguably the most baddass car on the site is pretty damn inspirational!

Thanks!

 

[Hemirunner]

I would assume you will be going to the track with this at some point? You can always try the Victor out in the real world. A dyno is a great tool but it's never the same as being in the car and out on the track pushing a hunk of metal to a 10 second pass.

This car will most likely never see the track. It was built for a street car. I think we have a great combo and I'm very pleased with the results. I would like to have tested a victor back to back just to confirm my theory.

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Really nice numbers and more great info! Your posts are very helpful Hemirunner, Not to mention building arguably the most baddass car on the site is pretty damn inspirational!

Thanks!

thanks! We are very happy with the numbers. The dyno is great fun and I learn something new every time I have an engine on it.

 

[Cranky]

Yup, nice numbers. No way could I have something like that without making a few passes just to see what I could get out of it. In fact, there's only been a couple of cars in my life that didn't make any passes at the track. lol

 

[fratzog lover]

I remember reading about the upgrade to 1/2 inch pickup. Matt Maund used to do it to all his ebay engines. 3/8 supplies plenty of oil for almost any build unless there is an obstruction.