Overheating problem do I need a better Electric Fans

[CRAIGXLH1]

hi group I have a 1969 GTX 440 727 transmission since I bought this car about 4 years ago the been running hot up to last year the car been running between 200-215 degree the radiator was 26 inch 3 row i think it out 67 mopar I took to the radiator shop and had it boil out the radiator shop guy said was fine. this year I put in 26 inch 4 row aluminium champion radiator with there aluminium shroud with 2 12" Electric Fans also put on a Summit Racing SUM-312317 - Water Pump, Mechanical, High-Volume, Iron, also I put on Doug's Headers DOU-D452 Primary Tube Diameter (in): 2 in.,Silver ceramic coated, Collector Diameter: 3.500 in which I think is part of problem
from the heat from them. also 50/50 mix of antifreeze also 3 bottle of water wetter.
yesterday I took the car out to a car show for the first time this year and after changing radiator with the aluminium shroud with 2 12" Electric Fans and new headers It was about 85 degrees outside I want 5 miles the temp went 235 degrees I had to pull over and let the engine cool down with the fans on after 10 minutes it went down to 180 degrees so I finshed going to car show which it was about 1 more mile
down the road the went back to 235 degrees before I got it park. on the way home it was about 70 degrees the temp went to 200-210 degrees today I changed to pull with the Electric Fans it was pushing the day before the temp today around about 70 the temp was about 210 after 3 miles a little better any I think I have cheap Electric Fans I think there were about $25. 00 a piece the
champion radiator with there aluminium shroud with 2 12" Electric Fans was bought together anyway that all I think is wrong I don't what to fix. can anybody help me. also anybody know of good brand of 12" Electric Fans the one that came with the radiator said they were 1500 CFM I don't beleved it thanks it advance
craig

 

[benno440]

whats the flow cfm on those fans? is your gauge possibly faulty? or sending unit faulty? or faulty thermostat? sounds unusual and shouldnt be doing this, it defiently sounds like a fault somewhere or the fans are not powerful enough.

as an example my charger has be cool radiator and twin 1200 cfm something thermo fans i think cooling a 505 stroker in extremely hot weather like 48 degrees celsius (not sure what that is in fahrenhite) and it gets upto 200 then the fans turn on and the temp drops to like 160 in 5 secs

 

[Propwash]

A 4 core aluminum rad, with a shroud and just a factory fan would have no issue cooling that car.......at all. Few things to check..What temp thermostat and is it opening/operating? Is your timing set right and what is your advance? Bottom Radiator Hose, does it have the coil spring inside it, if not-does the hose collapse easy? Checked for a bad head gasket(s)? Did you burp any possible air pockets out of your cooling system either by a overflow/recovery tank, drilled hole in the thermostat or letting the sytem cycle with the cap off? Checked for Vacuum leaks-especially around carb base and intake (engine lean burn condition)? If you haven't done so yet, I would take a look at checking those items before throwing anymore money at beefing up an already beefy cooling system. Lotta money/time can be spent over-engineering a cooling system to fix a symptom, but the underlying problem never gets fixed. Ceramic coated headers would cool down your engine compartment vs. a big heavy old cast iron manifolds. Good luck.

 

[Dennis H]

Napa Superstat. 180. Green coolant. Shroud. Use a laser thermometer to be sure. Ma Mopars 26" copper and clutch fan work good for me. If you change the thermostat, use a good housing like Mancini, not the cheap Chinese chrome.

 

[CRAIGXLH1]

hi group
the fans are supposed to be. 1500 CFM. Two years ago I changed the mechanical temperature gauge to electrical gauge and a run about the same. So there's nothing wrong with the gauges Also I tried a 160 195 thermostat and no thermostat. I still think the fans are junk, can anybody tell me a good brand of 12 inch electric fans that I could buy. Also the radiator is boiling over and the overflow tank this year and not previous before I made all these changes this year. I can check the timing and vacuum leaks this weekend I have a coolant book on Mopar's here and it says that the timings to retarded it'll make it overheat. Also I'll try one of those Napa thermostats. But I could use for suggestions because I'm running on ideas and you seems to run fine but is just getting too hot. can anybody tell me a good brand of 12 inch electric fans that I could buy

 

[Jasoncoronet]

Put a stock seven blade fan with a factory style shroud and a fan clutch it will cool just fine. The electrics in the smaller sizes just dont pull enough. I promiss the fans you have dont pull 1500 cfm each eaither. To pull those cfms it will draw some seriuos power (amps) and you would have already had other problems with your charging system. From my experience the balance with electrics fans and radiator size can be tricky to figure out. Dont forget when your electrics are not on you have no airflow at all. A standard fan will allways direct air becasue it is always running pullling air through the radiator and also drawing air over the engine which also helps cool quite a bit.

 

[CRAIGXLH1]

hi group as far is electric fans go I have set to run as soon as the key is on. I have no problem with the electrical running the fans. The wiring kit I have for the electric fans Ron Francis Wiring AR77 - Ron Francis Wiring Dual Electric Fan Relay Systems runs on 2 30 amp fuses.already had seven blade fan with a factory style shroud and a fan clutch and a stock 26 inch radiator before this and it was still running 210 degrees that's why I changed to the 4 core radiator and two electric fans. I don't think I have blown head gaskets there's no water in the oil or oil in the water and all the coolant that goes in the overflow tank goes back in a radiator when it cool down and there's no water loss. Also bought a laser thermometer today I went down the Napa in order their premium 180 thermostat. No there was no listing Napa Superstat. can somebody tell me what green coolant is, I asked the Napa guy and he thinks it's regular coolant. Also I went out and I checked the timing at thousand RPM vacuum line plug it was 5°. At 2000 RPM vacuum line on it was about 45°. I checked for vacuum leak's with carburetor cleaner around the carburetor and intake ports no change in RPM. And I still want to know a good brand I can get in 12 inch electric fans. I still think they're not pulling enough air through the radiator. Any more help will be appreciated thank you craig

 

[dryheat]

40 degrees of additional advance with only a 1000 rpm increase seems WAY excessive to me ...

 

[CRAIGXLH1]

it a Mopar Performance electronic distributor

 

[dryheat]

I hope your numbers are just off ... 36 to 38 all-in total advance at 3500ish would be more appropriate. If you are truly at 45 degrees at 2000 rpm that would explain the overheating.

Please check to make sure your mechanical advance springs are still on.

 

[CRAIGXLH1]

Instruction Sheet DCF-194CC MOPAR PERFORMANCE ELECTRONIC IGNITION KIT
with
VACUUM ADVANCE DISTRIBUTOR
Part Numbers P3690426, P3690427 & P3690428
After the basic timing has been set for total mechanical spark advance, disconnect
the vacuum advance hose at the
carburetor. Connect a vacuum gauge to the carburetor's vacuum advance port and
route the gauge and hose in to the
passenger compartment. Place the gauge in a location where an assistant can read
the gauge while the vehicle is
being operated.
b. With the vehicle in operation, note the maximum amount of vacuum generated by
the engine while in gear and being
held at a steady speed between 2000 and 4000 RPM.
C. Stop the vehicle, turn off the engine and connect a timing light to the battery and
number 1 spark plug wire.
d. Start the engine and raise the idle speed to 2600 RPM. Connect a vacuum source
(Mighty Vac) to the distributor's
vacuum canister and draw vacuum up to the reading noted in step b.
f. Note the total advance shown on the harmonic balancer.
g. Total Advance, mechanical plus vacuum, should be set according to the following
chart:
Engine
A
B/RB
Hemi
Total Advance
. Total Advance, mechanical plus vacuum, should be set according to the following
chart:
Engine
A
B/RB
Hemi
Total Advance
50° BTDC
56° BTDC
53° BTDC

 

[dryheat]

I'll be very very quiet now ...

 

[benno440]

be cool make exceptional fans but are pricey, im sure most of the fans from summit will be good enough, could it be possible your waterpump is blocked? timing definetly sounds high and could be causing some heat issues, maybe change the type of collant also, wheres your temp sender unit going to? inlet flow of coolant or outlet back to radiator, it must be on the inlet the cool side.

 

[Jasoncoronet]

If you really want more electric fans spal fans are the best. Make sure you check the amps they pull. Mopar alternators are week if that is what you have.

 

[Propwash]

Sounds like you're going about it right and covering your bases Craig....Still a stumper, being a 3 core (let alone a 4 core) with a shroud/fan should not have any issue cooling your car. There's a bunch of 500+ strokers pumping out serious horse around this site that have no issues cooling with a 3 core, shroud and mechanical fan. By chance did you check your bottom radiator hose? Slowly bring it to full throttle and see if it starts to collapse. Plenty of other folks running electric fans around here. Hopefully they chime in and can cue you towards a decent fan set up, if an underlying problem isn't found. I'd be pretty hesitant to agree those fans are moving 1500cfm as well. Sorry I don't have any to recommend. Those puppies are Amp suckers.

 

[twinscrew698]

I agree with Propwash on the bottom Hose sucking in!
If no spring in bottom hose,get a piece of stainless welding rod and put in it!(Wrap it around some pvc first)
Also you are running a stone guard on the bottom of radiator between bumper and Rad?
We used to throw these away in the past never to bother putting them back on.This helps keep airflow to radiator.
And what kind of water pump housing are you using?
I think some had problems in the past with poorly designed pieces.
And Jasoncoronet is right..Double check amps on fans..

 

[CRAIGXLH1]

Hi group you guys are great for helping me I checked the bottom radiator hose it does not have a spring in I have to find one may be at Napa when I go pick up my other parts before I buy new fans of trying a Napa thermostat and change the radiator hose with the spring and it. The water pump housing is a stock one.temp sender is in the top the water pump stock location. Also I want to know These electric fans which way they should be working by the supposed to be pulling or pushing they sit on the backside of the radiator right now I have him pull in and had and pushing before they seem better pulling but I'm not sure. Anybody running these electric fans can you tell me which way you're running these fans And I want to thank you guys again for all the help you've given me and anymore will be appreciated . Thank you again Craig

 

[dryheat]

If the electric fans are on the inside of the radiator by the engine then they need to pull in air to the engine compartment just like the factory fixed blade fans do. If you had them pushing out it will limit/block the normal air flow across the radiator while you are driving.

 

[Nsane]

If thoose are the fans that come with the champion radiator i have seen a lot of post on other forums stating that the fans that come with are not pushing what they claim. There are some nice 12" fans B cool, Flex a lite, Zirgo, Ect that will push a true 1500 or more. Alot of the posters said as soon as they switched to a quality fan no problem. The price for the radiator and shroud from champion is the same as if you get it with the fans obviously cheep. I was dooing a lot of reading on them as that is the setup i wanted to put in my car.

If the electric fans are on the inside of the radiator by the engine then they need to pull in air to the engine compartment just like the factory fixed blade fans do. If you had them pushing out it will limit/block the normal air flow across the radiator while you are driving.

 

[CRAIGXLH1]

Has anybody heard of this company or of the electric fans are they any good or are they juck
Perma-Cool Standard Electric Fans 19122 from Summit $81.92 Electric Fan, Single, 12 in. Diameter, Reversible, 2,300 cfm, Black, Plastic, Kit Amp Draw: 6.00 amps Maximum Fan RPM: 3,000 rpm
With their straight, high-flow blades, low-profile Perma-Cool standard electric fans are great for use as auxiliary fans to help your engine keep its cool. These fans are available in several sizes, with capacities as high as 2,000 cfm, and mount via a special patented nylon system. Their blades and shroud are made from high-strength fiberglass/polypropylene, and they are reversible for mounting in either side of the radiator, for "push" or "pull" airflow. Thanks again Craig