Street strip camshaft question

[mcv]

My friend has a 1965 383 block bored .30 over, zero deck, kb flat top pistons with 8 cc valve reliefs, Edelbrock estreet 75 cc heads, will have either a tunnel ram or tall single plane intake. Has all msd ignition.
He settled on a comp xe285hl cam, .545 lift, with intake 241/exhaust 247 duration at .50, it is ground on a 110° centerline with 4 degrees of advance ground in.. equaling a 106° per comp cams tech line and cam card.
Everyone is telling him to advance the camshaft 4° more for a 102° installed centerline. Has anyone else done this? Seems like a lot of advance to me for a street driven race car. Any advice or experience would be very helpful.

 

[496 polara]

I would want to know what gear,converter stall,and vehicle weight before I comment.

My guess would be trying to get the cam to come in sooner in a heavier car with a motor that is not known for bottom end torque.

 

[mcv]

3500 hundred pound b-body, tubbed 14x32 slicks, or 15.5 x 29 street tires, 3.91 gear or 4.30 spool, 727 reverse manual valve body, 3600 stall converter. Full 14 point cage (I think) subframe connectors.

 

[RemCharger]

I would want to know what gear,converter stall,and vehicle weight before I comment.

My guess would be trying to get the cam to come in sooner in a heavier car with a motor that is not known for bottom end torque.

Exactly. A fast 383 just doesn't live in the " down low torque" dept. Make it all jive where it's supposed to, 4000-7000.( and 4000 might be light)
Also, the instructions for the edelbrock heads should be digested. Mainly the part about not designed to run over 5500.

 

[coloradodave]

I wonder if your friend gave all that information to Comp before buying that cam, and, if so, what were their recommendations? In a way, he was paying for their expertise. I guess I don't understand why folks will buy stuff and then ask everybody on their block for recommendations...

 

[mcv]

Edelbrock e Street heads aren't recommended for roller cams either ... But a bunch of people run rollers and shift a lot higher 5500

I am just trying to help the the guy get his car off jack stands. He bought that comp cam years ago to replicate hotrod magazine 383 build. The E Street heads came with the car when he bought it awhile back. This is what he has to work with. We couldn't find the lunati voodoo cam that I run in my 383 since lunati is out of the Mopar cam business now.

Hotrod magazine advanced it 4 degrees, nicks garage on youtube advanced it 4 degrees (both dyno motors) some of the local Mopar guys say advance .... Others say Don't advance. I was just asking if anyone had experience with this particular cam if it is worth advancing.

 

[RJRENTON]

I wonder if your friend gave all that information to Comp before buying that cam, and, if so, what were their recommendations? In a way, he was paying for their expertise. I guess I don't understand why folks will buy stuff and then ask everybody on their block for recommendations...

Because "my buddy knows best" factor prevails. Congrats to the OP as, thus far, this same question has been asked and answered 3875 times, with differing answers each time. How about what ignition system, (MSD, Pertronix, points), how much ignition advance to use, what spark plugs (NGK #??), which oil to use, how many amps for the alternator, what beer is being consumed, 93 octane fuel is best, best wax to use, air or nitrogen gas in the tires, which Hayden fan clutch, fuel pressure is best, etc.......just a casual (with a little sarcasm thrown in) observation.......
BOB RENTON

 

[Budnicks]

advanced for bottom end & retarded for top end,
the cam having that spec already ground in it at 4* advanced
I'd think Comp Cams had that already figured in the equation...

there's a great episode on Engine Masters on MotorTrend or Tubi
that dives into that very subject, what happens when it's retarded or advances
they even use a 440 Steve Dulcich built

The Edelbrocks 'E-street' head have a decent port, same size shape as the 'RPMs'
but cheap-er springs & retainers & locks, no deep fly cut in the seats,
w/heavy stainless steel 11/32" valves, 2.18"int & 1.81"exh
w/no back-cut high flow valves either
asking for trouble turning them over 6,200 max, (I'd say even less)
those specific valvetrain parts aren't designed for it
like someone said recommended to 5,500 RPM

That a huge part of why they sell them 'E-Streets' cheaper
than the 'RPMs' versions
with springs (even multiple), locks retainers or valves
you can order for the specific type of cam design, intended use

(the E-street are not meant for really high RPMs, like 5,500 max,
it's not where the 383 needs 'if you want real power out of it')

at a min you'll want chromoly/tool steel at a min. retainers/locks
& better springs 'to match the specific cam design' it's specific 'engine RPM' designed levels
it needs to live, not fail or valve float
it's a smaller stroke & large bore combo, It needs 'engine RPM' to make power
I'd suggest you talk to them again & get the proper parts
& advice from them, if you want to get the most out of their cams... (Comp Cams)

good luck

 

[RemCharger]

Edelbrock e Street heads aren't recommended for roller cams either ... But a bunch of people run rollers and shift a lot higher 5500

There is a difference that makes the street heads cheaper and therefore more desirable than the RPMs.. but why the heck would edelbrock wash their hands of liability by saying 5500? Use at your own discretion. Maybe buy performance valves...

I am just trying to help the the guy get his car off jack stands. He bought that comp cam years ago to replicate hotrod magazine 383 build. The E Street heads came with the car when he bought it awhile back. This is what he has to work with. We couldn't find the lunati voodoo cam that I run in my 383 since lunati is out of the Mopar cam business now.

Understandable

Hotrod magazine advanced it 4 degrees, nicks garage on youtube advanced it 4 degrees (both dyno motors) some of the local Mopar guys say advance .... Others say Don't advance. I was just asking if anyone had experience with this particular cam if it is worth advancing.

I've never used that particular cam. But if it was me, I'd install it as they've designed, and dyno tested it. Can always advance it later.

 

[33 IMP]

It's got advance ground into it.
More advance will supposedly help the low end torque.
Does a track car with loads of track stuff, including a decent converter, and race grade rear gearing NEED more LOW end torque???



I don't think so. Put it in where it's supposed to be.

 

[mcv]

Thanks for some of the legit info...now I remember why I don't come over to this forum much anymore...I Don't want to ask the same question for the 3876 time... Didn't know it offended some people so badly asking questions on a public forum about a camshaft I have no experience with. I will just tell him to go 106° and forget it.

 

[fishmens67]

The combo would work much better with a 4800 stall convertor, at the very least 4500

 

[padam]

There was a guy did a YouTube video about one of the XE cams in a sbc 383 iirc.
He dynoed it at 106, then at 102. There was almost no difference.
I may be wrong about some of the details but the gist was advancing it 4 didn’t do anything.
I was looking for info too since I was installing a xe268 solid that was smaller than my old Lunati. Since I was afraid of it running out of rpm I installed it 4 retarded and I’m pretty happy with it. 4-speed though.

 

[mcv]

I talked to my buddy , he is gonna run it at 106°. Once it's broke in we will put my draggy on it and see if it's "good enough" for street work.
I will definitely try to talk him into better parts once things settle down for him.

I have personally seen e street heads hold up to some serious abuse on Ford , Chevy, Mopar "street" motors with power adders. I wouldn't be afraid for him to shift at 6100-6300 rpm with them. With the xe285hl it is supposedly good to 6100rpm. I will pass on the 5500 warning though.


Padam, I have a lunati 533/552 in my "383" that made zero difference advancing it. The 1/8 mile times weren't worth the hassle I went to changing it. When I pulled the motor to refresh it, I went back to 106°.

 

[33 IMP]

For what it's worth....
I have a purple .557 in my 440. It will rev clean to 6500, I shifted it at 6200, then experimented with a 5900 shift point, and it ran the same. So, 5900 it is.
Your 383 might like more rpm than a 440..... but if you take it to a track, I'd start with a conservative shift point, then experiment with more rpm, to see if it likes it. You might be surprised.

 

[Geoff 2]

The only way to reallllllly answer the question is.......to try it. Valve to piston clearance should be checked. It is very easy to change cam timing with a multi slot timing chain set. Remove rad, water pump etc & timing chain cover & voila! Reset the dist accordingly. If you are worried about timing chain set accuracy, very east to do on the bench with some paper & protractor.

 

[PRHeads]

My .02…….
A 383 with Ede heads should be fairly rev-happy.

A fast rate Hyd cam is not rev happy.
So when the engine and heads really start coming into their own, the lifters start giving up.

My solution would be at a minimum use a Hyd cam with smoother lobes……. But if you really wanna do it right, put a solid cam in it.

As for the current differences in the hardware on RPM/E street BBM heads……. It’s only the valves(everything else is the same)…….which wouldn’t worry me a bit as long as you keep the valvetrain from getting unhappy.

As for using the current cam, I’d shoot for an int CL of 104-106.

 

[451Mopar]

Try it at the recommended 106 degrees, you have the gear and converter for it.

 

[gtxrt]

the more advanced the more detonation could happen.

 

[Rusty knuckles]

Thanks for some of the legit info...now I remember why I don't come over to this forum much anymore...I Don't want to ask the same question for the 3876 time... Didn't know it offended some people so badly asking questions on a public forum about a camshaft I have no experience with. I will just tell him to go 106° and forget it.

Im glad you asked it because I'm shopping cams for a similar build now and appreciate the advice of most. Just ignore the snide remark. Some people can't help but feel the need to have a superiority complex over strangers on the internet every time they post.