I am going to buy my first Mopar

[Ashy22]

Hi Guys

I have sold my 71 454 Corvette this weekend to make way for a Mopar.

The only 2 around at the moment in the UK are these below just imported from the your side of the pond.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1970-PLYM...7675.l2557&clk_rvr_id=776115117398&rmvSB=true

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1968-Plymou...aGa0jgzee6oYd5312%2FA%3D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc

Even though they the listings have finished they are still available

What do you detectives think of these?

What makes the Roadrunner a clone? The back trunk trim looks wrong???

Does the GTX look genuine - I noticed that there was no GTX badge on the rear right trunk lid.

I have attached a photo of the broadcast sheet for the GTX that the seller has sent to me. He says that there is no fender tag??

Apart from the colour which is not FK5 (i think?) does anything else stand out as being wrong?

Does it matter if the numbers don't match up as long as its a solid car?

It would be good to have the knowledge so that I get the right car.

Thanks in advance guys

Cheers

Ashy22 :happy7: ​

 

[super-bee_ski]

The GTX has it's own VIN
The fender tag is missing as is mine..
But the VIN will determine if it is a GTX

Welcome aboard!
Thanks for joining the Forum.

More to come on the GTX vin:

For a 440 based GTX:
RS23U First charachters of the VIN

For a Hemi based GTX:
RS23J First charachters of VIN

 

[Propwash]

I'd jump on the GTX long before the 1968 Clone....

"Clone" meaning it is not a real roadrunner. It is a Plymouth Satellite made to look like a Roadrunner. That is why the trunk finish panel is wrong. Satellite's & GTX's had that style of finish panel for an option, a Plymouth Roadrunner did not. Plus, a real Plymouth roadrunner never came with a 440 in 1968.

The 1970 GTX seems like a much better buy. More revered car, disk brakes, subframe connector's, sure grip rear.....Right off the bat the car's going to brake, handle and grab traction better than the clone car. Plus it's a real GTX.....not something made to look/act like something it's not.

Welcome aboard and good luck which ever route you go.

 

[Coyoteduster]

The guys are spot on with their comments above, the only thing I would add is congratulations on switching over to the dark side!

Welcome aboard! :headbang:

 

[Grancuda]

They both look good & would be nice to have.
Couple of things i see:

GTX
It is a GTX / 440 per that build sheet
Missing its lower grille
Missing its deluxe steering wheel
missing its delux door panels
Chrome/stainless all missing on tail panel
Dash should be wood grain, not black & A/C vents in lower dash pad are blocked
Has rear arm rests w/ash tray on the front passenger side, needs put to the rear
Im not a fan of the radiator in it, they have small tubes that clog easily
Looks to be an original AC car, has A/C controls & dash

Road Runner Clone
It probably isnt a real road runner, probably a Sport Satellite, the VIN should start RM23 if it is a Road Runner
Side marker lights have been filled in
Color is a late '69 & up color, not avaliable on '68 models
It has a delux tail panel - not avaliable on road runner
It has delux door panels, not avaliable on road runner
Under the hood is blacked out, not suppose to be
It does have electronic ignition, thats a plus

 

[Car Nut]

aboard!

 

[moparsteve636]

One thing I noticed on the GTX is it missing all of the trim on the deck lid and tail panel! Non matching numbers only hurt is if you decide to sell it down the road!Some purist have to have all numbers matching! So that is up to you if it bothers you!

 

[Dreadl0ck]

Question to the gurus here: What are the wheels on the "roadrunner" - I'm looking for something like that for the more aggressive driving days

Question to OP: How much are they? Given that the Roadrunner is a clone you could score a lot cheaper and for a guy like me who don't care about number matching cars or being clone or not - just love to drive the **** out of them - I'd go with the clone. But that's just my personal view. Mine is a real RM-number roadrunner, but not # matching, and got brake conversion and now switching to EFI... something I'd never do to a # matching car..

 

[HawkRod]

Welcome and glad you are looking at B-Bodies! These are really cool cars, have great character, great lines and are much more unique that most Chevy's and Fords.

Some great comments and suggestions above, so I won't repeat those. For any car you find, the first 6 digits of the VIN are key. They are generally:
1st digit: Car line. For example R= Plymouth Belvedere - Satellite (and Road Runner).
2nd Digit: Price Class. For example, a Road runner is M=Medium. So RM=Road Runner. RH = Satellite
3rd and 4th Digit: Body Type: For example, a Road Runner is 21 for a coupe (has a post and a fixed back window) or 23 for a hardtop (no post and back window rolls down)
5th digit: Engine. For example N=383 HP, U=440 HP
6th Digit: Year/ For example 8=1968, 9=1969 and 0=1970

Of course, there are many other considerations, but this will help you determine at least what car (clone or real) that you are looking at.

Good luck in your search!

 

[440+6]

Both are decent cars, I like the GTX better, bunch of little things wrong as mentioned (also all the seat upholstery is wrong for that car). Everything can be taken care of while you enjoy the car if you choose to correct things.
Welcome and good luck!

 

[Michael789]

I'd go with the GTX the price on the clone is way out there 30k,too bad you couldn't come across the pond and take one back with you.Welcome aboard it's nice to see you have been turned from the dark side!

 

[Ashy22]

Thanks guys for all the replies.

Your comments are invaluable.

I would love to bring one back from the states but the shipping and the import duties makes it an expensive venture.

I really wanted a 69 Roadrunner at first but the GTX is also a favourite of mine. Lovely shape.

Are the bits that are missing easy to find like the trim and the door panels? The vette was easy to get parts for (Ecklers and Mid-America). Is it the same for Mopars.

Is there a reason why the battery has been mounted in the trunk?

Cheers
Ashy22

 

[Runner 68]

Thanks guys for all the replies.

Your comments are invaluable.

I would love to bring one back from the states but the shipping and the import duties makes it an expensive venture.

I really wanted a 69 Roadrunner at first but the GTX is also a favourite of mine. Lovely shape.

Are the bits that are missing easy to find like the trim and the door panels? The vette was easy to get parts for (Ecklers and Mid-America). Is it the same for Mopars.

Is there a reason why the battery has been mounted in the trunk?

Cheers
Ashy22

Welcome and you've come to the right place for advice from these guys as you have seen above.

The mounting of the battery in the trunk is a drag racing specification for some classes, or at least it used to be, for safety issues and weight transfer during the launch of the car. More weight over the rear axle for better bite. (I'm sure other guys will chime in).

Many guys used to relocate the battery for the "cool" factor, whether they raced or not. Easy fix regardless.

 

[HawkRod]

Thanks guys for all the replies.

Are the bits that are missing easy to find like the trim and the door panels? The vette was easy to get parts for (Ecklers and Mid-America). Is it the same for Mopars.
Ashy22

Parts for 68-70 B-Bodies are readily available. There might be a few trim pieces here and there that are harder, but all in all, these cars are fairly popular, so the parts can be obtained.

Price wise, parts are not cheap like they might be for a Mustang or Camaro, but I have a Corvette, and parts for that %$#@! car cost an arm and a leg! Bottom line is they won't be any more expensive than Corvette parts!

 

[70runner]

Given that it's a legit GTX, the 70 would be a better option. Having said that...

As someone mentioned, it's likely an AC car or at least the dash is AC and it has the AC dash control. No radio. Besides missing the rear trim around the blackened portion, it's also missing several front trim pieces along with the lower grille - the lower grille stainless, hood stainless, and the fender tip "C" chrome trim. I included a pic of my 70RR for comparison. GTX and RR have identical front trim, different upper grilles. Nice, original trim pieces would be difficult to find, not sure if any of these are reproduced.

If you inspect it, look closely at the trunk, lower rear window/trim area, lower qtr panels for signs of rust, rust repair, bondo. Also check the firewall to see what was done with the AC holes (can't see it from the pic). Good luck.

 

[Dreadl0ck]

I can help you with the import without you paying 1/3 of the price to the government

I sent you a PM about a car that's available in Europe already - and if that's not of interest I'd be happy to help you out.

Another reason for rear mounted battery gives more space under the hood for different reasons.

 

[Ashy22]

Thanks guys for all the info.

And thanks Dreadlock for the offer. Still thinking about it.

 

[tallhair]

some additional info for your education ;)

As was said the finish panel is wrong for a 68 RR

Finish panel was an option with the RR decor group option which came with other trim and upgraded interior also

Here's one with

and without .. I really haven't see many w/o but think it's a really cool look for the rear

both look good IMHO

The finish panel on the 68 car you are looking at is a GTX or Sport Satellite trim (the car is probably originally a sport sat) and it's not finished like the factory did it. However it does look good to me.

Also as others have said the GTX is missing the rear trim pieces which were also on a sport sat .. and the tail lights had chrome accents like this

On the interior the 68 car has 69 deluxe bucket seat interior and door cards like sport sats and GTXs. The one you are looking at is a hard top also vs coupe. There were much less 68 hard top RR's made and they were a later year addition.

this is a 68 deluxe interior like in 68 GTX

this is the 69 deluxe bucket interior like is in that 68 sport sat .. which was a standard interior trim level for GTX and sport satt. .. door cards are 69 as well as seat pattern in the 68 you are looking at and appear to be either repro from legendary or very good condition

The GTX also has incorrect seat inserts and door cards and is missing woodgrain dash treatment ... looks like some one reupholstered the original seats though .... and it does have the GTX upper door trim but has a RR dash treatment .. ie black plastic

This is the correct seat insert design and door cards for 70 deluxe bucket interior with the correct for GTX wood grain dash treatment. RR didn't get woodgrain

the GTX you are looking at says its a RS23U0G VIN which would be correct for a 70 GTX built in STL .. I'd check the against the serial number on the rad support and rear trunk weather strip rail which is on drivers side near rear window corner under the weather strip .. you should be able to see it from bottom side. It is missing almost all the GTX trim except the door trim accent pieces and the grill I'd verify the body matches the VIN. If it does I'd buy the GTX like many others have said.

- - - Updated - - -

Now to take another look at the B.S. which frequently is wrong for the car it's in even in original cars .. but it's there so



The B.S. is for a 70 GTX. RS23U0G .. and the serial 199277 should match the VIN and rad support and weather strip rail

Paint code is not lime light as you had already realized ... FK5 (burnt orange metallic) and P6K4 Burnt Orange bucket interior which would be really cool too but not a deal breaker if you like it green

I'll let someone else decode the rest ;)

 

[Ashy22]

Thanks for all that work TallHair. Much appreciated.

I have also found some more info on the GTX for sale over here. It looks like the seller bought it from another guy first as I found these pictures from the original sale when it was shipped over to the UK at the end of last year.

Its got the VIN number written on the windscreen (do you guys call it wind shield?) and it shows the dash as having the woodgrain type!!

It looks like it has been covered over with plastic by the guy that bought it as it doesn't look like that now. It is definitely the same car though. (the time is the same on the clock!) Obviously it doesn't work.

Wonder why he covered it up?

I have asked the seller to provide some pictures of the underside. I will post if I get them.

Ashy22

 

[6pktgo]

Hi, Welcome to FBBO & Mopars. I see you`re looking real hard at the 70. I`d be real careful & take a good look at the rear of the lower quarters ,around the wheel wells , across the tail panel ,the trunk floor & rear frame rails! The body lines look way out of whack to me! The rear side markers don`t fit right. Looks as though it`s been "Kissed" square in the back & or rotted. :eusa_think: If you can , have someone qualified ,that you trust, look at it before you pull the trigger. Often when buying, we don`t stand back & look at things as closely as we should. Just my two cents.