barring ware with 2 different oil

[vance.dykes]

 

[vance.dykes]

the point I'm trying to make is if you want an engine to live the oil you use matters

 

[pnora]

Kind of a crock of poop. Two different engines, Two different builds, No reference to clearances, two different bearing manufactures,. No mention of oil pressures, oil temperatures. The list goes on. Comparing apples to oranges in my opinion.

 

[Cranky]

Well, he sucks as far as making a vid......but I've had my fill with the GTX 20-50 oil of the 70's and 80's. Imo and some others too said there was too much detergent in the oil and not enough lubricity. The two stock automotive engines were VERY clean inside but the bearings were showing the copper backing through what little babbit that was left with one engine worse than the other. One engine had a cast crank (worse looking one) and the other had a forged crank. One was a motorcycle and every time I cleaned the filter (centripetal), there was really fine aluminum deposits in it but just figured that was normal and then after seeing what the automotive engines looked like, I stopped using that oil. Both engines had aluminum deposits in the lifter valley. A buddy of mine told not to use it but never had a reason as to why....but found out why.

 

[moparedtn]

Well, he sucks as far as making a vid......but I've had my fill with the GTX 20-50 oil of the 70's and 80's. Imo and some others too said there was too much detergent in the oil and not enough lubricity. The two stock automotive engines were VERY clean inside but the bearings were showing the copper backing through what little babbit that was left with one engine worse than the other. One engine had a cast crank (worse looking one) and the other had a forged crank. One was a motorcycle and every time I cleaned the filter (centripetal), there was really fine aluminum deposits in it but just figured that was normal and then after seeing what the automotive engines looked like, I stopped using that oil. Both engines had aluminum deposits in the lifter valley. A buddy of mine told not to use it but never had a reason as to why....but found out why.

Agree. Two brands I'll never use in this life again:
Castrol GTX and Quaker State.
Don't care what they've developed, I've seen too much in the past to trust them.

 

[RemCharger]

Copper rod bearing tops are from over advanced or low rpm lugging or a combination.
Ran Castrol 20 50 for 25 years racing and counting. Never 1 bearing or oiling issue. They all looked like new

 

[Cranky]

Agree. Two brands I'll never use in this life again:
Castrol GTX and Quaker State.
Don't care what they've developed, I've seen too much in the past to trust them.

That buddy of mine....all he used was Quaker State LOL and I'm with you on oils. Do me wrong 40-50 years ago and well, I'm out.

Copper rod bearing tops are from over advanced or low rpm lugging or a combination.
Ran Castrol 20 50 for 25 years racing and counting. Never 1 bearing or oiling issue. They all looked like new

My regular transportation vehicles were usually hot rods but they never got lugged nor too much timing. And the bike was always in the mid to higher rpm ranges. And I don't understand what you mean about 'bearing tops'.....

 

[RemCharger]

That buddy of mine....all he used was Quaker State LOL and I'm with you on oils. Do me wrong 40-50 years ago and well, I'm out.

My regular transportation vehicles were usually hot rods but they never got lugged nor too much timing. And the bike was always in the mid to higher rpm ranges. And I don't understand what you mean about 'bearing tops'.....

Meaning the upper bearing shells.
They give you the real story on the tune up in the engine.
Top fuel cars adjust their combination based on the look of the bearings.

 

[Cranky]

Meaning the upper bearing shells.
They give you the real story on the tune up in the engine.
Top fuel cars adjust their combination based on the look of the bearings.

Ah ok.....my bearings from a 360 with 75k miles (iirc) on it was showing copper all the way around. There was still just enough babbit to keep the crank in good shape. Didn't even have to turn it. Also didn't even have to vat the block....just wiped down the insides and then took some soap and high pressure water to get all the road grime off of the outside etc.

 

[RemCharger]

Here's an example, a 76 400 truck motor. Unsure of mileage, but well used.
Probably over advanced with trailer towing. The 4 burnt exhaust valves also prove it wasn't happy

 

[pnora]

Back in the day a lot of bearing wear was from diluted oils primarily fuel dilution.

 

[Cranky]

Here's an example, a 76 400 truck motor. Unsure of mileage, but well used.
Probably over advanced with trailer towing. The 4 burnt exhaust valves also prove it wasn't happyView attachment 1531803

I tore my 360 down somewhere in the middle to late 80's and the bearings showed that copper look all across the bearing and all the way around. And yup, I would say that engine that you showed was being hammered. The valves in mine were all good to the point it they really didn't need it but since the mileage was a bit high and they were off, why not at least dress them. The guides also were ok which was a surprise.

 

[69Bee]

Clevite bearings Standard Automotive "P" series Tri-Metal (TM-77), as stock as you can get, so I would expect to see that level of "Flash Plating" wiping off. As far as the King bearings, Aluminum SI (K788) bearing with 2.5% to 3.0% of silicon for extra strength and durability. While the King bearing is one step above stock, they are not HP bearings either. Bottom line, this is NOT a fair comparison between oils because of two completely different types of bearings were used. To compare two different oils, the bearings should be identical obviously.

That being said, I still stand behind Joe Gibbs Drives oils and lubricants and break-in products completely...

 

[lewtot184]

Pretty sure there isn't any babbitt on a tri-metal bearing. If I remember correctly there's only a half thousandth of tin plating on top of the copper plate. Many factors damage that thin tin plating.

 

[Cranky]

Pretty sure there isn't any babbitt on a tri-metal bearing. If I remember correctly there's only a half thousandth of tin plating on top of the copper plate. Many factors damage that thin tin plating.

Well, aluminum bearing alloy is commonly called babbit with us old farts lol

 

[RJRENTON]

Kind of a crock of poop. Two different engines, Two different builds, No reference to clearances, two different bearing manufactures,. No mention of oil pressures, oil temperatures. The list goes on. Comparing apples to oranges in my opinion.

Maybe the OP should ask good old "Uncle Tony" as he has a reputation of knowing everything, a self proclaimed expert ......
BOB RENTON

 

[lewtot184]

Well, aluminum bearing alloy is commonly called babbit with us old farts lol

I don't know how old a fart you are but "micro" bearings were the true babbitt bearings. Alum bearings were considered in between the micro and tri-metal. Bearings back in the day had a pressure rating. Micro was 2200psi, alum 5500, tri-metal 7700 (clevite 77). I used to keep info on this but some of it has disappeared in my 75yrs. Anyhow, they all had a place and folks always had their favorites.

 

[Cranky]

I don't know how old a fart you are but "micro" bearings were the true babbitt bearings. Alum bearings were considered in between the micro and tri-metal. Bearings back in the day had a pressure rating. Micro was 2200psi, alum 5500, tri-metal 7700 (clevite 77). I used to keep info on this but some of it has disappeared in my 75yrs. Anyhow, they all had a place and folks always had their favorites.

I'm 72....qualifies me as an old fart lol

 

[vance.dykes]

Maybe the OP should ask good old "Uncle Tony" as he has a reputation of knowing everything, a self proclaimed expert ......
BOB RENTON

oh i truly trust uncle tony

 

[RJRENTON]

oh i truly trust uncle tony

Truely......if an Olympic gold metal were issued for unsubstantiated information...aka "slinging ****", he would be a hands down recipient......
BOB RENTON