Firm Feel Suspension + Wilwood 6 Piston Disc Brake Project

[1970DCH]

My Tremec swap was one of the last TKO transmissions that Silver Sport had. I got the whole kit with drive shaft for under $6000.
The improved TKX model was brought in to replace it.
The manual transmission swap was responsible for making the car so much more fun to drive.
For drag racing, the automatic is the way to go. It was faster with the automatic but more fun with the manual.

Whoops, I said TKX only because it’s the existing option. I’m definitely itching to have a manual transmission again; hard to beat the experience.

 

[j-c-c-62]

In theory, the soft spring/big sway bar principle seems smart but.....
I had stock torsion bars and leaf springs in Jigsaw....



With 1 1/4" front sway bar and a 3/4" rear bar. It corners okay but I didn't like the brake dive or the overall "floaty" feel. I put in 1.03" torsion bars I got in a collection of parts I got last year. What a huge improvement. It feels more solid and stable with the bigger bars.
This car has 1.15" bars...



It feels as rock solid as any car that I have driven. I shake my head at the people that would say You'll rattle your fillings out with bars that stiff.

For over two decades the online discussion has been starting with whether going with .93" TB's vs .88" Tb's will make one's car ride like a "dump truck" and so on.


One comment I share regularly and has yet to be "proven wrong", everybody likes bigger TB's, and nobody has ever commented they went too big.

Meaning at the least, if you aren't 1" or bigger, stay on the porch.

 

[icetech]

For over two decades the online discussion has been starting with whether going with .93" TB's vs .88" Tb's will make one's car ride like a "dump truck" and so on.


One comment I share regularly and has yet to be "proven wrong", everybody likes bigger TB's, and nobody has ever commented they went too big.

1.03s here and i 100% love them.. i was afraid they would be stiff but the car rides pretty much perfect, and i have a alum head small block, so not a ton of weight up front

 

[Some Car Guy]

In theory, the soft spring/big sway bar principle seems smart but.....
I had stock torsion bars and leaf springs in Jigsaw....

View attachment 1920360

With 1 1/4" front sway bar and a 3/4" rear bar. It corners okay but I didn't like the brake dive or the overall "floaty" feel. I put in 1.03" torsion bars I got in a collection of parts I got last year. What a huge improvement. It feels more solid and stable with the bigger bars.
This car has 1.15" bars...

View attachment 1920361

It feels as rock solid as any car that I have driven. I shake my head at the people that would say You'll rattle your fillings out with bars that stiff.

I had a 70 challenger with a 440. Road race size bars. I forget the exact size. Ride really good until I put on kyb shocks.

 

[j-c-c-62]

KYB
Here is my custom 1.38" "C" Hex alongside a "B" hex 1.24" bar.
The hollow bar has approx 20% higher rate and weighs 8lbs less.
WR rate however is nearly the same as I'm using longer LCA's.
I like big bars.

 

[icetech]

i don't know if KYB has changed but i have 4 on my car right now and they ride really good.. i had read horror stories but no issues here..

P.S. i know everyone wants expensive shocks for handling.. but they also usually make the car ride like a brick and on michigan roads it is horrible to me...

 

[j-c-c-62]

I suspect you might be the outlier here. Of course, every combination is different, I'd assume there are combos that KYB might and do work satisfactory. But my suspicion here is it is not always an ideal combo, like fat/soft tires (which can be a cool look), soft bars for the combo, extra wheel offsets, all rubber bushings, heavy cars/engines, ideal roadways, etc
At our hobby level, IMO expensive shocks start to be more about bragging rights.

 

[icetech]

I suspect you might be the outlier here. Of course, every combination is different, I'd assume there are combos that KYB might and do work satisfactory. But my suspicion here is it is not always an ideal combo, like fat/soft tires (which can be a cool look), soft bars for the combo, extra wheel offsets, all rubber bushings, ideal roadways, etc

yeah, i like a softer ride but zero chance on the nice roads i do have fat tires that help a bunch.. i have Excel-g's on the rear.. got them cause the are softer than the gas-adjust, had to get the gas ones for the front though, they don't make excels for the front...

Last shocks were monroes which i always ran.. cause they just worked, 3 were bad in 100 miles.. was crazy.. but cheap is cheap...

 

[ckessel]

Baby's Got Bar's.
I like big bars and I cannot lie, them other brothers can't deny!

 

[68 Sport Satellite]

I used to run .092's and when I swapped the big block in and pulled the 360 out, I put in 1.00's. I ordered some 1.06's and am looking forward to seeing the difference.

 

[Rennkafer]

P.S. i know everyone wants expensive shocks for handling.. but they also usually make the car ride like a brick and on michigan roads it is horrible to me...

Expensive performance shocks only ride badly when paired with incorrect spring rates. Match the spring rates and shock valving and you just get a nicely controlled ride, no harshness. Well developed race cars with what (for street) would be consider astronomical spring rates don't ride badly, it's because they have properly valved shocks (properly called dampers... but that's a different discussion)

 

[Some Car Guy]

i don't know if KYB has changed but i have 4 on my car right now and they ride really good.. i had read horror stories but no issues here..

P.S. i know everyone wants expensive shocks for handling.. but they also usually make the car ride like a brick and on michigan roads it is horrible to me...

I’m using bilsteins now and they aren’t super expensive compared to some stuff. Work really well. I used to use edelbrocks and tried and tried to find a set with no luck. Discoed many moons ago. Those were some awesome shocks. I don’t do anything to need an adjustable though, so doesn’t apply to what some people here are doing. I’m just a street cruiser guy in the old mopars, I’d hop in the Maserati to cut a corner.

 

[Kern Dog]

KYB had more than one type of shock. The most commonly used ones were the Gas-A-Just ones that were painted white.
These were sold through Year One, Classic Industries, PST, Energy Suspension and surely other companies. From what I was told, they are a Digressive
design where most decent shocks are progressive. The following applies to NON adjustable shocks:
Digressive means that during suspension travel, the movement from a static state is harsh but the further the suspension travels, the softer the shock gets.
Yeah...initially firm but softening up as the wheel moves further up or down. This artificially makes stock springs and torsion bars feel firmer than they really are but if you have larger bars and stiffer springs, this makes for a harsh ride.
Progressive means that during short suspension travel, the shocks are soft but as the suspension travels further, the shocks get increasingly firmer. This allows the suspension to soak up minor road imperfections but then tighten up as the suspension moves more.

 

[j-c-c-62]

I’m using bilsteins now and they aren’t super expensive compared to some stuff. Work really well. I used to use edelbrocks and tried and tried to find a set with no luck. Discoed many moons ago. Those were some awesome shocks. I don’t do anything to need an adjustable though, so doesn’t apply to what some people here are doing. I’m just a street cruiser guy in the old mopars, I’d hop in the Maserati to cut a corner.

If it runs.

Sorry, I couldn't resist.

 

[Some Car Guy]

If it runs.

Sorry, I couldn't resist.

I spent two years walking up to people to ask about that. All said that’s internet bs. So does video bob on YouTube. Owns 40 cars, like Rolls ame such, and says the haters are idiots.

 

[j-c-c-62]

I think the Biturbo tainted the waters, and that was mostly before the internet.

 

[icetech]

KYB had more than one type of shock. The most commonly used ones were the Gas-A-Just ones that were painted white.
These were sold through Year One, Classic Industries, PST, Energy Suspension and surely other companies. From what I was told, they are a Digressive
design where most decent shocks are progressive. The following applies to NON adjustable shocks:
Digressive means that during suspension travel, the movement from a static state is harsh but the further the suspension travels, the softer the shock gets.
Yeah...initially firm but softening up as the wheel moves further up or down. This artificially makes stock springs and torsion bars feel firmer than they really are but if you have larger bars and stiffer springs, this makes for a harsh ride.
Progressive means that during short suspension travel, the shocks are soft but as the suspension travels further, the shocks get increasingly firmer. This allows the suspension to soak up minor road imperfections but then tighten up as the suspension moves more.

I wonder if they changed it, mine are the silver ones... i read how much people hated them but i really love how the car rides, not harsh at all but not floaty or out of control feeling..

 

[Kern Dog]

The silver shocks are supposed to be 50/50, not digressive, not progressive but equal damping in extension and compression.

 

[icetech]

The silver shocks are supposed to be 50/50, not digressive, not progressive but equal damping in extension and compression.

ahh nice, maybe that's why they dont annoy me i like how they ride

 

[artr8]

To anyone who is considering autocross, KernDog advised me as I was setting up my QA1 style suspension. Roaded over 1000 miles this summer participating in events. Car was always stable with a stiff ride, not rough, with double adjustable shocks. Turned down to 3 on the road (compression) then up to 10 for the track.
17” wheels with 245/45 tires. Larger tires rub my fender supports.