EATING THE ELEPHANT

RemCharger said:

Nice write up. I'm in the big block camp, but thought I'd mention the different passenger fender apron for the BB.

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RemCharger please tell me more about this fender apron. I'd like to plan ahead for any surprises'. Well... as much as possible anyway. We all know how plans go.

Amata Bene said:

RemCharger please tell me more about this fender apron. I'd like to plan ahead for any surprises'. Well... as much as possible anyway. We all know how plans go.

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I'm not much of a guru in the 71 up cars, but just ran across this new members thread. Looks like his charger was a BB car
Thread 'New Guy from Idaho' New Guy from Idaho

Just checking in. @RemCharger I checked out the build you mentioned and don't think it's going to be a problem for me. I'm going old school BB. Can't imagine how much scotch I'd go through with that electrical ... upgrade? My 340 block & crank has been in machine shop prison. Fixen to bust it out next week and take it to one not to far away, about 50+- miles from here. Sux for me but a mans gotta do what a mans gotta do and I want this thing on the road for this summer. So does the wife, and we all know what that mean. Well the married ones do. Been doing some porting work on the heads. Probably going to have them reworked also and put 202's in em. I got plans for this 340 that involve an A body or possibly a Dakota, but that was spose to be later. This time and money was suppose to be spent on the 400 and associated drivetrain. It is what it is. Adapt and overcome.
So I've had this thought for a while; One of my bikes is a yellow springer that I've owned for the las 16 yrs. Would it be complete sacrilege to use this yellow instead of the Y1 lemon twist? When I get to the body and paint I'm pretty sure that's what I'll do. The car isn't stock anyway. Only the purest will complain. When the bike is parked next to it, it'll make since. Most people won't know anyway.
Anyway... just checking in. The shop has been busy and my hobby time has been limited. I'm not complaining cuz I like money and so does the car. Be back soon, hopefully with machine shop news. Until then I'll continue to chew on this elephant. Happy MOPARing y'all.

Been a minute. Here's where I'm at with elephant. Took the block and crank to a much better machine shop. Shout out to Jordan's Performance in Conway SC. The taper was too much to hone so it went to 40 over. New set of KB's, rings, pins and ARP bolts. Keeping the stock full floating rods. Line hone and decking the block for true and flat. TBD if the crank needs turned or a polish will clean it up and some new ARP main studs. Having the rotating assembly balanced and then moving on to some head work. New guides, 2.02 In, staying with 1.6 Ex, multi angle and back cut valves and seats. They are going to do a bowl cut that I will blend in. Should have waited but I already ported the heads (below). Not a thing, I lapped the valves and still have good seats and meat under them. Gonna have them check and cut the spring perches for level. I've been looking at Hughes cams and kinda leaning towards a 232/236 @ .50 not sure yet. Need to get some more numbers like my deck height 0 + or - , final comp #, what the heads flow if I can find someone close with a bench. Might have to settle for the ole' syringe and cc check. Using an original 340 four barrel cast intake from 1970 that I have done the old school mods to. Other than weight after the port match it will perform as well as a high $$ Eddy. I fear I am inching (pun intended) further away from a mild street cruiser. Need to swap out the center chunk for a posi with 3:91's, not sure about the 904. I can build it up with better shifts and a 28 stall. But a SB 727 would still be better, cuz bigger is better. Still a lot work ahead but I'm happy with how it is going. That is a big difference from when I pulled the cam to do a quick top end fix just to get it running right.

Do yourself a favour and keep the 904. I have a friend who has a 904 behind a potent 360 in an F-Body Aspen drag car.
Car runs low 10's.
The 904 can handle the power if it's done correctly.

71Beeper said:

Do yourself a favour and keep the 904. I have a friend who has a 904 behind a potent 360 in an F-Body Aspen drag car.
Car runs low 10's.
The 904 can handle the power if it's done correctly.
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I do not disagree. Haven't opened this one up yet to see what's in it. I would almost have rather pulled this 904 from a truck. It has all the light duty stamping from the assembly plant and is original to the "74" RR behind a smog bound 318. We'll see. Don't know if there would have been a difference anyway.

71Beeper said:

Do yourself a favour and keep the 904. I have a friend who has a 904 behind a potent 360 in an F-Body Aspen drag car.
Car runs low 10's.
The 904 can handle the power if it's done correctly.
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I used to know a guy in Cincy with a 68 AA cuda, hemi and he ran a 904 instead of a 727 because the car was .2 quicker. He said he would go through 2 of them for how long a 727 would last but the faster times were worth it. Don't mean to thread jack.

Couple more bites of this elephant. Heads are spose to go to the machine shop next week and I've got a new (to me) center chunk with 391"s. And for the future BB I've lined up a BB k frame with PS. Happy dance. However, I was just (just meaning last weekend) presented with the opportunity to pick up a set of magnum heads for CHEAP. Been trying to figure out what all I would need to do to make them work. I know they're roller, so I'm glad I haven't picked up (another) cam and valves and what not. I notice some of the holes be it water or oil don't look like the same as my 360 J heads. What am I going to run into trying to make these work? Any help would be appreciated. Thanks in advance.

Yeah, never mind about the magnum heads. Not going down that rabbit hole.
SQUIRL!

We have a 73 318 RR and we first upgraded to a mild 360. With the stock 2.73 gears it seemed like a pooch. So we moved the 360 to a 70 challenger..and it surprisingly ran in the mid 14's at the drag strip. Much lighter car w 3.23. For our 73 RR we also decided to go with a BB and bought adapter spool mounts. Bb is then a direct fit in place of small block. Much easier then swapping the cross member. There is more access to the spark plugs in inner fenders of a factory 73-74 bb car. But you can make your own opening. Most people would not know unless you told them. Your next RR engine, you should make a 512 out of your 400.
Does your car have a 8 3/4?

Curiousyellow71 said:

We have a 73 318 RR and we first upgraded to a mild 360. With the stock 2.73 gears it seemed like a pooch. So we moved the 360 to a 70 challenger..and it surprisinhly ran in the mid 14's at the drag strip. Much lighter car w 3.23. For our 73 RR we also decided to go with a BB and bought adapter spool mounts. Bb is then a direct fit in place of small block. Much easier then swapping the cross member. Their is more access to the spark plugs in inner fenders of a factory 73-74 bb car. But you can make your own opening. Most people would not know unless you told them. Your next RR engine, you should make a 512 out of your 400.
Does your car have a 8 3/4?

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I bought a brand new 74 Rr that I ordered. It was a 400 4 barrel with 4 speed and 3.55 gears. Power brakes. No PS. or Ac. I spun a rod bearing down shifting into 2nd gear trying to keep up to a 68 302 Z28 when he shifted. There was only 1,300 miles on it. Warranty put a new crank and rod in it.

Curiousyellow71 said:

We have a 73 318 RR and we first upgraded to a mild 360. With the stock 2.73 gears it seemed like a pooch. So we moved the 360 to a 70 challenger..and it surprisingly ran in the mid 14's at the drag strip. Much lighter car w 3.23. For our 73 RR we also decided to go with a BB and bought adapter spool mounts. Bb is then a direct fit in place of small block. Much easier then swapping the cross member. There is more access to the spark plugs in inner fenders of a factory 73-74 bb car. But you can make your own opening. Most people would not know unless you told them. Your next RR engine, you should make a 512 out of your 400.
Does your car have a 8 3/4?

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Yes, 8.75 diff. Just picked up a center with 391's. I have to drop the sub-frame to replace all the rubber so I'm going back with a well worked and upgraded BB frame. I'll be using the hard frame to body mounts but all the other rubber will be new top shelf stuff. Stroking the 400 was always the secret plan, I just don't say it out loud because my wife wants it to be a daily cruiser. Got a lot of frame work ahead. Be moving the springs in bound for some mini tubs and connecting the fore and aft sections. Just got to keep it looking stock to the common folk.

kreauto said:

I bought a brand new 74 Rr that I ordered. It was a 400 4 barrel with 4 speed and 3.55 gears. Power brakes. No PS. or Ac. I spun a rod bearing down shifting into 2nd gear trying to keep up to a 68 302 Z28 when he shifted. There was only 1,300 miles on it. Warranty put a new crank and rod in it.

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Sounds oh so familiar. I spun all the rods on my first RR. It was a 68 that I picked up when I came home. The car was only 17, so was I when I left. I did do a bunch of work to it and in a hurry. When I put the new 30 over slugs in, I didn't waste time with all that balancing crap. I needed to go fast and go now. And it did for a while. That car on a good day could hit high 11's. It ran consistent low 12's always... till it didn't. And that was in the water box. We had just had our 2nd kid (we being her) and building it again wasn't rally apriority any more. Now I got teenage grand kids and Papa gonna go fast again, on 4 wheels.

It's been a while since I did any updates about the "Elephant". So here's what has been going on. I got all the trees at the front of my property cut down, still have 10 or 12 stumps to get rid of.... Wait, I was gonna talk about the car.

Alright, so there was some confusion at the machine shop I used about how I wanted the balancing to be done. I believe it was a group effort. All the other work was spot on. So that's good. I have since found a different shop to do the balancing work with a lot mor detail, i.e. equalizing big end, little end then spin it up (fingers crossed). There were some holes drilled that may need some attention. They also offer a few more services to help with performance. The only downside and why I didn't go there first is the 170 mile drive to their shop. One big + is they speak MOPAR as a primary language.
Side note: They have a nice 440 built for street/strip that was abandoned due to a divorce or something. Anyway, he is selling it, I'll ask if I can list it here and give his info to someone interested.
Back to ol' yeller. I shelved the J heads in leu of a set of SM heads. I cleaned them up with some 80 grit. Blended the seat lands (pretty rough) and smoothed out the runners. Nothing drastic. I am having new angles on the valves and seats cut along with the intake being enlarged from 202 to 255. Fitting the heads with Hughes 1.6 roller type rockers being pushed by a Hughes 571/582 lift cam. All this atop the 40 over 340 stock (for now) stoke short block. Behind it is the 904 packed with goodies like extra discs and manual shift with 28-3000 tc. This goes out to a set of 391's in a 8 3/4 posi. Should make for some smokey nights at the drive in .

Heading up to CO here directly for a few days, should be doing the final assembly shortly after I get back. Still have a lot of suspension work to do. Just haven't been able to get a spot in the shop where I can take the time to tear her down and rebuild it. She's a big girl and takes up some real-estate. Not to mention the harsh environment of a steel fab shop. I'm able to do the motor and tranny work in a separate room closed off from all the bad air-born sh#t in the shop. It dose make me meticulous about cleaning when I do assembly.

Hence the cutting down of trees on my property. Trying to get it cleared to build my new shop. And I ain't payin someone. Not when I have tractors, chainsaws, trailers, and air in my lungs. Yeah, I know. It's an argument I'm slowly losing with my wife also. But hey fall is coming and we can get a lot more done without dying. Summers in the south . I am way behind on my time line to finish both the car and the new shop. I guess Toby is right "I ain't as good as I once was".

So, that's where I/we are with the "Elephant". Still taking it one bite at a time. I do like the progress, though it be slow. Doing stuff with some old hot-rod parts to dress up the motor. I'll put some pics up at some point. There is a lot to sort through.

Going from a 2" to a 2 1/2" valve??

Yeah. I'm using a 2 1/2" intake valve.

Amata Bene said:

. I am having new angles on the valves and seats cut along with the intake being enlarged from 202 to 255.

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Amata Bene said:

Yeah. I'm using a 2 1/2" intake valve.

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Have to admit it does sound a bit aggressive

RemCharger said:

Have to admit it does sound a bit aggressive

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Biggers Better

For all those confused - 2.020 to a 2.055 Intake valve.

Wow! Been a minute since I was on. Work, life and the car, that damn car. There is a lot of gristle in elephant meat.
When I last showed up all the machine work on the new heads and precision balancing of the rotating assembly was being completed. That came out real nice. The rotating assembly came out at less than 3 grams and the heads are beautiful with some big-a$$ valves and minor port work.
Right now everything is in cold storage, so to say. I'm not going to put it together till the car is ready to receive it.
I wanted to get the engine bay cleaned up and painted yellow, like it should have been, and do the suspension work, well... That lead to a whole new battle. I started by clearing the firewall and fenders of any and all obstacles. The (painted over) electrical harness, booster and master cylinder, hood release cable, fuel and brake lines, ign module, yada, yada, yada.
I went inside to strip the interior of the seats and carpet and pulled the heater box. The floors look great, no rust. I was really pleased with that. But, it's a good thing I never drove the car in cold weather. The heater box was attached only by the 4 studs going through the firewall. The plenum support rod was nonexistent and the unit was not even remotely sealing at any of the upper duct work. Not to mention broken in a couple places along with several cracks. Ohh-K, need to fix that. Found a couple mystery wires coming from factory connectors, hmm? Love these 50 yr old multiple owner cars. Really though, it's in pretty good and original condition so, I'll try to keep the pissing and moaning to a minimum. Heater box is fixed. Could not find any paint to match so, I went with flat black. Nobody's gonna see it anyway.
Back in the engine bay, I started striping it by hand with some naval jelly type stuff... I'm telling ya, this new regulated stuff just ain't as good as the old stuff. That sh!t would remove 5 coats of battleship gray with no problem. Just don't get it on your skin. Ask me how I know.
Anyway, after several hours with scrapers, wire brushes and a wire wheel on the die-grinder... I said F this and bought one of those wet blast system that hook to the pressure washer. Now I have removed everything from the doors forward so nothing gets blasted that shouldn't.
Need to back up a little here. I was on a while back in the paint and body forum. I was trying to sort out what I was doing wrong when painting my valve covers. Got that straight, and they came out pretty damn nice IMHO.