2001 motor home 440

Engine, Trans & Driveline

  1. levicah

    levicah Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    71
    Likes Received:
    11
    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2018
    Location:
    Shelton, WA
    Local Time:
    7:07 PM
    Ok, this is where my ignorance will really shine!
    1rst, what would cause a vertical 32th" wide divet the length of the cylinder? was it caused by a stuck/ broken ring gap, or is it a worn sleeve gap from a previous repair? only one cyl. looks like this. Otherwise, I cant tell if there is a sleeve in there.
    2nd, top of #1 bore is 4.355, bottom is 4.335 Piston is 4.316 I believe.

    It's been 14 yrs since I mic'ed the bores. I believe these are averages taken from various sides of the bore.

    Real question is, whats a deal breaker for rebuilding a thin wall motor home 440? Should I just toss it, or can I re bore it at all? Is it worth sleeving etc?
     
  2. moparedtn

    moparedtn FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

    My Photo Garage
    Messages:
    3,594
    Likes Received:
    3994
    Joined:
    May 14, 2011
    Location:
    Northeast TN Foothills
    Local Time:
    10:07 PM
    To quote 440 Source:
    "There is no such thing as thinwall blocks. They DO NOT exist."
    http://440source.com/blockinfo.htm

    Really informative, that website. Worth a read.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • 5.7 hemi

      5.7 hemi FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

      Messages:
      10,350
      Likes Received:
      6016
      Joined:
      Dec 21, 2008
      Location:
      ca
      Local Time:
      9:07 PM
      I’ve never seen a thin wall block. You should have it magged and sonic checked before making any decisions.
       
      • Agree Agree x 1
      • Kern Dog

        Kern Dog FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

        Messages:
        8,448
        Likes Received:
        14506
        Joined:
        Apr 13, 2012
        Location:
        Granite Bay CA
        Local Time:
        7:07 PM
        I'm curious how a motorhome built in 2001 has a 440 in it.
         
        • Agree Agree x 7
        • wyrmrider

          wyrmrider Well-Known Member

          Messages:
          1,440
          Likes Received:
          574
          Joined:
          Aug 26, 2014
          Location:
          los angeles
          Local Time:
          7:07 PM
          It's about 40 years since the last 440 rolled off the line- has this motor been rebuilt- I ask because there are a lot of low mileage motorhomes out there and some with the wheels run off
          Real motorhome motors would have different plugs and cooling holes in the head and block (and gasket) next to the plugs with raised ribs in the casting to permit the holes
          Real Motorhomes had premium valves -- SIL-Xb intakes and Inconel exhausts- really pricey to replace but they are usually reusable
          check the numbers on your motor and let us know if you have the cooling holes
          how much overbore will it take to clean up the block?
          how's the timing chain and sprockets?
          sleeve works fine if you can find someone in WA to do it- where's Shelton? I have a place in Bellingham but do not know of any shops
          anyone else?
           
        • Kern Dog

          Kern Dog FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

          Messages:
          8,448
          Likes Received:
          14506
          Joined:
          Apr 13, 2012
          Location:
          Granite Bay CA
          Local Time:
          7:07 PM
          Many diesel engines are sleeved and they run REAL high compression. I would sleeve and engine if another wasn't so easy to find.
           
          • Agree Agree x 1
          • PurpleBeeper

            PurpleBeeper Well-Known Member

            Messages:
            3,564
            Likes Received:
            2377
            Joined:
            Mar 20, 2011
            Location:
            Chicago
            Local Time:
            9:07 PM
            The scratch could be caused by any piece of metal that got into the cylinder...piece of a piston ring, chunk off a valve, a small nut dropped down the carburetor, etc.

            I think the last 440's were built in 1978...maybe later for an industrial engine. Are you sure it's a 440?

            As for the block, you're choice. Sleeve the one bad hole if it does have the extra cooling passages & the correct motor home heads, otherwise, I'd probably find a different block....unless you can sleeve one hole & reuse the stock pistons...my 2 cents
             
          • Lets Roll

            Lets Roll Well-Known Member

            Messages:
            433
            Likes Received:
            329
            Joined:
            Jan 27, 2015
            Location:
            Ormond Beach
            Local Time:
            10:07 PM
            Please post some pics of the engine and the the problem.
             
            • Agree Agree x 1
            • WP29440SE

              WP29440SE Well-Known Member

              Messages:
              3,154
              Likes Received:
              1590
              Joined:
              Dec 7, 2011
              Location:
              Englewood CO
              Local Time:
              8:07 PM
              let's see this 2001 440
              is it TBI? serpentine set-up?
               
            • wyrmrider

              wyrmrider Well-Known Member

              Messages:
              1,440
              Likes Received:
              574
              Joined:
              Aug 26, 2014
              Location:
              los angeles
              Local Time:
              7:07 PM
              sleeves do not have seams- they are one piece
              LA sleeve near where I am makes good ones- Whittier- Santa Fe Springs CA
               
            • Ghostrider 67

              Ghostrider 67 FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

              My Photo Garage
              Messages:
              10,934
              Likes Received:
              17123
              Joined:
              Oct 16, 2014
              Location:
              Salisbury, Vermont
              Local Time:
              10:07 PM
            • levicah

              levicah Well-Known Member

              Messages:
              71
              Likes Received:
              11
              Joined:
              Mar 16, 2018
              Location:
              Shelton, WA
              Local Time:
              7:07 PM
              Excuse me. "pulled" from a motorhome in 2001. Residual stocks of 78' 440's found their way into 1982 motorhomes. Yes it's a 440. It has been a stripped block for 14 yrs, sprayed in oil and buried in my garage. Awaiting response, I have learned about the thin wall myth. Contrary to some indignant responses here...this wasnt common knowledge 14+ years ago. Variations in alloy strength contributed to the myth. I like the broken bit of piston ring hypothesis beekeeper, for the vertical cylinder scarring. I didnt know if sleeves were seamed, so thank you for that wyrmrider. So nobody wants to give me a max bore size for a 440 engine. So, is it .20 or .30 above the factory bore size? I just wanted to know if it was boreable at the above mentioned diameters. I didnt want to spend for diagnostics on a engine that was too far gone.
               
            • 5.7 hemi

              5.7 hemi FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

              Messages:
              10,350
              Likes Received:
              6016
              Joined:
              Dec 21, 2008
              Location:
              ca
              Local Time:
              9:07 PM
              You can go .060 if it sonic checks ok.
               
              • Agree Agree x 2
              • Thanks! Thanks! x 1
              • beanhead

                beanhead FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

                Messages:
                3,295
                Likes Received:
                4932
                Joined:
                May 18, 2014
                Location:
                Wackyfornia
                Local Time:
                7:07 PM
                I'm hot-rodding around in a .040 over '73 440, if that helps...we recently restored my uncles '68 GTX/440 and that block easily went to .040 as well. Like 5.7 posted above .060 isn't out of the question but sonic checking is really good insurance, especially if the block is already stripped down and just hangin' around. Then you will know for sure. Check prices aroud you, it's usually not too expensive. Unfortunately there just isn't a standard 'max bore size' number that can be considered safe for every engine.
                 
              • levicah

                levicah Well-Known Member

                Messages:
                71
                Likes Received:
                11
                Joined:
                Mar 16, 2018
                Location:
                Shelton, WA
                Local Time:
                7:07 PM

                Cool! that makes a lot of sense to me, Thank you, also 5.7hemi!
                 
              • HT413

                HT413 Semi Pro Bowler FBBO Gold Member

                Messages:
                5,128
                Likes Received:
                4670
                Joined:
                Jul 5, 2012
                Location:
                New Jersey
                Local Time:
                10:07 PM
                0.060 Pistons are readily available but as said, you need to sonic check. Lot of core shift in some of these blocks. Some guys have taken them 65 or 70 over but that’s really pushing it and you need custom Pistons anyway as far as I know.

                But I think more importantly, if it’s only one bore it makes no sense to take the entire block it out to 60. You are probably better off taking the block to 20 or 30 and sleeving the one hole.

                Heck the rest of the holes might only need to hone and rering
                 
                • Thanks! Thanks! x 1
                • Agree Agree x 1
                • wyrmrider

                  wyrmrider Well-Known Member

                  Messages:
                  1,440
                  Likes Received:
                  574
                  Joined:
                  Aug 26, 2014
                  Location:
                  los angeles
                  Local Time:
                  7:07 PM
                  60 over is 4.380, 60 over 400 size (.080 over 440) 4.4 and 4.375 all common sizes (for rings) but just do the minimum you have to do and check piston and ring availability before you do more than clean up that one hole
                  hard to measure how deep a gouge is but you can get close
                  to sleeve a 440 is not hard-- What HT just said sure sleeve one back to std if possible
                   
                  • Thanks! Thanks! x 1
                  • Agree Agree x 1