70 Clutch Linkage Issue

bad88ttop

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Looking for some feedback from the professionals on this site.
70 Charger R/T 440+6, Hemi 4 speed, Centerforce Dual Friction Clutch and Bearing

With the adjustment all the way out, I still have a bout 2" of free play in the clutch assembly. It almost seems like the adjustment rod isn't long enough, or the rod coming from the foot pedal assembly to the z-bar is incorrect.

Did they make different clutch forks or throw out bearings? With it adjusted all the way out the clutch feels pretty good but still has about 2" of slop at the top of the pedal.
I welcome everyones feedback and thanks in advance.
-Bill

IMG_6662.jpg IMG_6663.jpg IMG_6673.jpg IMG_6671.jpg IMG_6669.jpg IMG_6664.jpg IMG_6667.jpg
 
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Steven Bowers

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Well Bill, I hope you can get a few guys to help you out…..due to the fact I only have a 383 hp 4 speed in my 69 Charger mine has the short adjustment threaded bar that comes off the Z Bar linkage…stock throw out bearing and fork…..stock Hearst shifter….probably not helping you much but just my 2 cents worth…..you do have the retaining spring attached to the bell housing / fork ?…
 

Daves69

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Careful, too much adjustment can cause you to bottom out on the disc and damage parts.

Can you measure your release bearing as installed? 1.700" per Brewer's..
Brewer's Performance - Mopar A833 4-Speed Transmission and Component Specialists (brewersperformance.com)

You can check them for the fork, pivot, and rod dimensions as well.

Using a block plate and scatter shield? I spaced my fork pivot up with my 3 piece LW set up as I was not pulling the trans down. It was tight but do-able. Getting the fork back on correctly is always a challenge.

FWIW, An A-body adjust rod is longer if it can help.
 

Steven Bowers

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Looking for some feedback from the professionals on this site.
70 Charger R/T 440+6, Hemi 4 speed, Centerforce Dual Friction Clutch and Bearing

With the adjustment all the way out, I still have a bout 2" of free play in the clutch assembly. It almost seems like the adjustment rod isn't long enough, or the rod coming from the foot pedal assembly to the z-bar is incorrect.

Did they make different clutch forks or throw out bearings? With it adjusted all the way out the clutch feels pretty good but still has about 2" of slop at the top of the pedal.
I welcome everyones feedback and thanks in advance.
-Bill

View attachment 1182665 View attachment 1182666 View attachment 1182667 View attachment 1182668 View attachment 1182669 View attachment 1182670 View attachment 1182671
Well Bill, first issue I see is
the adjusting rod is beyond its limits….mine is in the middle…..they do make a longer one….I’d look into one…..but I do agree with Dave69 that you can over adjust and cause damage….all I can say for my setup is that the clutch peddle is in the up position with everything connected and the adjustment on the nuts on the threading bar is about halfway on the threads…not even close to your photo….when I depress my clutch peddle I’d say an inch my clutch disengages …I may not be helping you out much just telling you how mine is…..also your retainer clip needs clipped back in place….
 
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BSB67

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Questions:
1) Has it always been like this? If no, what has changed? If yes, has it had the Centerforce dual friction during your ownership?

2) Does Centerforce have other length throw-out bearings?
 

Steven Bowers

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Questions:
1) Has it always been like this? If no, what has changed? If yes, has it had the Centerforce dual friction during your ownership?

2) Does Centerforce have other length throw-out bearings?
Can you describe to me what a dual force clutch looks like….I’m interested in knowing for myself…my old clutch had the 3 fingers that the throw out bearing pushed against…..now the one I have now there are numerous fingers….granted it is a much better setup than the 3 fingers but I can’t slip the clutch peddle as well when my car is on an incline…it’s kind of engaged or not engaged….
 

R413

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Why is it a much better setup than the 3 fingers?

why do these clutch problems commonly have a centerforce clutch?
 

Steven Bowers

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All I can say is the 3 finger clutch verses the one I have now……it engages vastly much better and with more torque……if you have never had one….try it…you won’t go back to the old style…..I know I won’t…been running this for years….as stated the only issue I have is you can’t play the clutch as much as the 3 finger type….it applies more even pressure on clutch and throw out bearing….
 

Steven Bowers

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All I can say to you and any other comments made on this post is I initially was offering Bill…..who started this post as to what I had on my Charger….I was just offering him my 2 cents worth…..I’m not into going back and forth as to why one clutch is better than another…..it’s like why do we prefer a Blond over a Redhead or Brunette……use what works for you…..
 

Stanton

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Looks like the wrong release bearing to me. The soace between the fork pads and bearing seat is too narrow.

mcl-16053.jpg 61EvZDMv--L._AC_SL1125_.jpg
 

Steven Bowers

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Looks like the wrong release bearing to me. The soace between the fork pads and bearing seat is too narrow.

View attachment 1182723 View attachment 1182724
I must say Stanton that this bearing you’re showing looks exactly like the one in my 69 Charger….Bill, now that my eyes have truly focused at the one in yours now I must say I think Stanton has figured it out….it definitely is larger than the one you have in now…..you’ll most likely be able to use the adjustable threaded stud on the Z Bar now after upgrading to this new throw out bearing….I think you’ll find that the nut will be closer to the middle of the threads on the threaded stem and sticks out about 1/2” to 3/4” on the back side of the fork…
 
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steve340

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That release bearing looks like a Ford one - the fork clips are wrong.
I think Stanton could be right.
 

Stanton

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Why is it a much better setup than the 3 fingers?

why do these clutch problems commonly have a centerforce clutch?

The diaphram clutch takes much less pedal pressure to operate - that's why you can get rid of the over-centre spring.

I don't think Centerforce is the problem here - the issue is the wrong throwout bearing.
 

Steven Bowers

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After researching my clutch is indeed a diaphram style…..as stated it does take less pedal pressure to operate….I really enjoy this style over the 3 finger type I use to have….as Stanton stated the issue indeed must be the wrong throwout bearing….I totally agree with him….added note to all you guys that have the A833 four speeds how many of you put them in yourself…..I’m pushing 67 now and pretty much this is my last go around bench pressing this cast iron beast…..lol…..
 

moparedtn

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It is quite "normal" for the Centerforce (or any brand) diaphragm type clutch to have a pedal that doesn't
come all the way up to the stop under the dash.
After all, you DID disconnect the over-center spring under the dash as part of installing such a clutch,
right?
That's a specific requirement of installing that type of clutch in lieu of the B&B factory 3-finger style -
you must remove the over-center spring under the dash, or risk the pedal staying all the way down during
rather spirited de-clutching motions.

Well, the over-center spring not only assists you with pushing the pedal in during de-clutching, but it also
is charged with pulling the pedal all the way up to the rubber stop under the dash when you let the pedal
go.
Hence, if you remove the spring with the installation of a diaphragm style clutch, there's nothing to return
the pedal to the topmost position once released.
 

Stanton

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It is quite "normal" for the Centerforce (or any brand) diaphragm type clutch to have a pedal that doesn't
come all the way up to the stop under the dash.
After all, you DID disconnect the over-center spring under the dash as part of installing such a clutch,
right?
That's a specific requirement of installing that type of clutch in lieu of the B&B factory 3-finger style -
you must remove the over-center spring under the dash, or risk the pedal staying all the way down during
rather spirited de-clutching motions.

Well, the over-center spring not only assists you with pushing the pedal in during de-clutching, but it also
is charged with pulling the pedal all the way up to the rubber stop under the dash when you let the pedal
go.
Hence, if you remove the spring with the installation of a diaphragm style clutch, there's nothing to return
the pedal to the topmost position once released.

This isn't the issue here. Pay attention and try to stay with the program.
 

moparedtn

Ed on the Ridge
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This isn't the issue here. Pay attention and try to stay with the program.
#1, Don't be an ass.
#2, From the OP's original post:
"With it adjusted all the way out the clutch feels pretty good but still has about 2" of slop at the top of the pedal."
Linkage geometric anomalies or incorrect parts aside, even if all is well, the "slop" will still exist to some extent
with stock linkage and a diaphragm clutch.
Nature of the beast - and the subject has been discussed extensively on these very pages more than once.
 

Steven Bowers

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Our soul purpose of this post is to Help Bill resolve his clutch issue….with that said and done….”Stanton” has indeed solved the issue….Throwout Bearing is without a doubt the “Main Problem “……Bill, change to the correct bearing and your problem should be corrected…..this site is setup to “Help” our fellow car enthusiasts……and with my 2 cents worth said….I’m done with this issue…..You hit the nail on the Head…Stanton….
 

bad88ttop

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Thank you everyone. It ended up I had the incorrect throw out bearing in the vehicle. I updated to the 1970 wider style and that resolved my issue. Thank you for everyone's feedback. Stanton for the win this time around. lol Now onto my power window issue and then it's time to fire this pit up for the first time.
 
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