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converting from 12R to 134

I've done quite a few R134 convertions and never swapped anything....maybe a few leaky seals, be sure to charge system to 85% of the R12 capacity
Your systems wil fail the 134 will mix with ester oil and become acidic. Then you do a full replacement.
The rubber, seals and oil are all not compatible.
Need new hoses, o-rings and oil and 85% is a guide not an absolute.
 
Thanks for all the replies. Gives me a lot to ponder. I'm starting to lean more towards converting over to 134. If I should go that route, I will change the oil in the compressor. Should I pull the sump off of it to totally drain and clean it out before adding the new oil. Mind you, this is a NOS compressor. One question about the EPR valve replacement, I see the 134 replacement has electrical fittings, where do these route to? I also will be changing all the hoses to 134 compatable ones. Seems like kinda elementary questions, but, I'm just trying to get myself as fully informed as possible before committing to a plan of attack. It certainly would be easier to just stick with R12, That is my hang up. I have all the parts to do that and a buddy in the business that has R12. Just trying to figure out the best route with a thought of future and long term use, i/e repair, recharge, etc.. etc..
 
Thanks for all the replies. Gives me a lot to ponder. I'm starting to lean more towards converting over to 134. If I should go that route, I will change the oil in the compressor. Should I pull the sump off of it to totally drain and clean it out before adding the new oil. Mind you, this is a NOS compressor. One question about the EPR valve replacement, I see the 134 replacement has electrical fittings, where do these route to? I also will be changing all the hoses to 134 compatable ones. Seems like kinda elementary questions, but, I'm just trying to get myself as fully informed as possible before committing to a plan of attack. It certainly would be easier to just stick with R12, That is my hang up. I have all the parts to do that and a buddy in the business that has R12. Just trying to figure out the best route with a thought of future and long term use, i/e repair, recharge, etc.. etc..
You need to buy a new (rebuilt) compressor. You can never drain all of the oil out of an Rv2 just a little 12 oil will mess up the system.
Honestly 12 is not going anywhere soon since only classic cars will have it.
Let I said, I wish I had known that 12 was going to still be around I would have never converted. I really drive my car also even during the FL summer I have cold air it is just so much harder with 134.
 
It is not Illegal to own.
You need to have a ASE Refrigerant license. It is only illegal to manufacture in the USA. There is plenty of 12 around since demand is very low. 1234y is flamible and no real data on how it goes to a 12 system.

Oh really....according to the US Department Enviormentl Resources and the Department of Commerce, and EPA, it is illegal to use. It is not produced by any US company and must be collected and disposed of in an acceptable method. It is (Freons) supposedly detrimental to the Ozone layer by forming chlorine dioxide.
The replacement refrigerants:
USA: With seemingly no let up in refrigerant developments, eight new gases have been submitted for ASHRAE 34 classification, in addition to two refrigerants from Honeywell and Chemours receiving R-numbers.

ASHRAE Standard 34 assigns reference numbers, safety classifications and refrigerant concentration limits on all new refrigerants. The Honeywell and Chemours refrigerants have already received designations, and now await public review and final action.

The list includes Daikin’s new development gas, D1V140, and its blend component HFO1132(E), (revealed by the Cooling Post last week (Daikin develops more efficient refrigerant for electric vehicles)), three new hydrocarbon blends, what appears to be a further ultra low GWP refrigerant, and two new Koura gases based on R1132a.
Possible R1234yf alternative
Koura has revealed that one of its new refrigerants is, like the Daikin gas, targeted for use in electric vehicle HVAC systems.

While R1234yf has become the global industry standard low GWP refrigerant for vehicle air conditioning systems, its efficiency is of concern in new and future electric vehicles. Unlike conventional internal combustion engined vehicles, electric vehicles cannot use the engine waste heat for interior heating. Instead a heat pump system is used, increasing the load on the battery and severely reducing an electric vehicle’s range in cold climates.

The new Koura refrigerant blends 6% R1132a and 13% R32 with R1234yf to produce a refrigerant with a GWP of around 91. While this is higher than Daikin’s proposed new gas, it is still well within the 150 GWP maximum under the European MAC directive.

R1132a is an A2 gas commercially produced at kilotonne scale as the starting material for fluoropolymers. It has also been incorporated in R473A, Koura’s recently announced low GWP alternative to R23 in ultra low temperature applications (Koura’s R473A brings lower GWP for ultra-low temps).

The R1132a molecule also features in another new Koura refrigerant submitted for ASHRAE 34 classification. Thought to be designed for HVAC applications, this refrigerant blends 6% R1132a with 42% 32 and 52% 1234yf. This would give it a GWP of around 286.

Low temperature
Italian company Angelantoni Test Technologies has also submitted a new refrigerant, which tweaks the blend proportions of its recently announced ultra low temperature gas, R472A. The new refrigerant, R472B, decreases the proportion of CO2 and R32, increasing the amount of R134a (58% CO2, 10% R32, 32% R134a). It creates a refrigerant with a GWP of 526.

Honeywell R448 blend
Recently receiving an ASHRAE designation is Honeywell’s R448B, a tweak on the blend proportions of its now well established R404A refrigeration retrofit, R448A. The new gas is still going through public review and awaits final ASHRAE approval.
All you never knew about refrigerants, or wanted to know......but the future is coming....why not learn about it...
BOB RENTON
 
Your systems wil fail the 134 will mix with ester oil and become acidic. Then you do a full replacement.
The rubber, seals and oil are all not compatible.
Need new hoses, o-rings and oil and 85% is a guide not an absolute.
Thank you, I'll track down those vehicles and let them know of the future doom....until then they will enjoy the cold AC
 
There are a whole lotta people running around illegally possessing and using R-12 in their cars.
 
There are a whole lotta people running around illegally possessing and using R-12 in their cars.

Perhaps you can enlighten us (the readers of this thread) where / how to obtain the R-12 refrigerant and if its "virgin" and not recycled, and the approximate cost / pound. Typical bootleg costs run ~ $ 30-40 per pound of unknown origin.....inquiring minds want to know.....
BOB RENTON
 
I've never been arrested by the Freon Police when I buy R12 at swap meets. Never even ever seen a Freon Policeman. There are still alot of sealed 30 lb containers floating around. I can find R12 pretty much anytime I would need some. I will never use any thing else, than R12-in my old Mopars.
 
I've never been arrested by the Freon Police when I buy R12 at swap meets. Never even ever seen a Freon Policeman. There are still alot of sealed 30 lb containers floating around. I can find R12 pretty much anytime I would need some. I will never use any thing else, than R12-in my old Mopars.

I'm the Commissioner of the FREON POLICE, (the dichloro-difluoro-methane or R12 division) and our undercover operatives are EVERYWHERE. Sometime, somewhere when you least expect it, your vehicle may be commandeered and you will be relieved of your ILLEGAL Freon 12, leaving you stranded or in the very least hot and sweaty.......
The Commissioner
 
Flush, swap the O-rings to green, change TXV because it's a good idea. Good luck with a dryer all the ones I have ever seen have generic fittings which means adapters and more chance of leaks. I sweated mine original open (they are brazed) cut open a cheap replacement, moved the desecant and screens and brazed it back up. I only changed one rubber line because it was obviously bad. Figured if I could get the summer out of it, it would give me a starting point for the future. I'm still waiting for it to go low on 134 so I can fix a leaky Schrader valve (capped with a good brass hex cap) and update the original lines that were supposed to leak out over time.
 
There are a whole lotta people running around illegally possessing and using R-12 in their cars.
It is not illegal to posses nor is it illegal to be in the car.
It is illegal to manufacture it in the United States.
 
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