DRUM Brake Overhaul - Now, for something totally different...

[moparedtn]

There's a member here who was selling original material shoes, nos. @mobileparts I think.

Yes, I'm aware. I've just decided to go another route with my project.

 

[moparedtn]

been driving a big block 4 speed manual drum mopar for close to 40 years without a problem.

You do realize you're not alone on that, right?

 

[Cranky]

Would it be better to buy a new aftermarket one and scrap the old Mister Cranky?

My car will be a driver and looking for short cuts.... time isn't on my side.

Where did you buy your Master Cylinder Sir?...

It came off of a 69 Valiant that I bought. It was a two door sedan and thought about fixing it up but at the time, I already had too many irons in the fire so I kept the parts I wanted and sold the car. The MC was a new factory style unit and had a good hard pedal so on the Belvedere it went. I knew it was going to be different so I made sure I could find the parts needed to adapt it to the B body.

 

[Cranky]

You know, I sold auto parts in one of 5 regionally owned private parts store "chains" back in the early 80's.
Retail over the counter, account servicing of local repair shops, that sort of thing.
In other words - good old fashioned parts counter dude, who wound up running the joint in short order.
I was doing that to make money while in college at the time, but as a young leadfoot, it didn't hurt either...
...and the only "national" chain mortal enemy to local stores then was something called "Trak Auto", which had
started selling the cheaper Chineseium crap.

Our chain carried Bendix on the shelf, along with a regional rebuilding chain for stuff like brake linings, starters,
alternators, that kind of crap. Our "premium" line was Eis - they were big into a/c stuff, but I found in time their
brake stuff was superior to anyone's, too.

The local shops we delivered to all had their preferences on brands and 9 times out of 10, they'd opt for the
cheap relined stuff - but for "hardcore" customers (and me!), we insisted on the best - which was semi-metallic
replacement linings, always accompanied by at least a freshly lathed drum (or even a new one from Eis).

I do not recall ANY reports from repair shops or customers of how "semi-mets" prematurely wore drums -
AT ALL - nor do I remember experiencing the same myself with my cars.
They did have a reputation for possibly becoming noisier than the non-mets over time, of glazing over a drum
if some spirited driving was going on, but nope - never saw them wear out a drum any quicker.

Now, all that said - how many freaking miles is Fred likely to see under my stewardship?
Not enough to make any difference with what type of linings I use, that's for damn sure.
You said it yourself, my friend - the time to have fun with these cars is RIGHT NOW - and if I can
make Fred safer for the next steward in the process, I'm all in.

I remember when first seeing the EIS product name and was a bit leery of the name but over time, don't recall ever hearing about trouble from the brand and also used some of their products.

 

[Bold & Old]

A good range of thoughts here...

in 1961 I was my own 1st advocate on repairing my 51 Plymouth mufflers, tailpipes, brake parts and carburetor rebuild kits with replacing lots of fuel filters.

Most aftermarket suppliers (Western Auto) products worked well and was easy to fix car back then.

i remember the asbestos products stood up well overtime too.

You cant rely on hearsay as most do... do your own research.

I too had too learn the hard-way often.

Technology and safety in today's world of speed and power.

I am saying that is my own train of thought........

I had a third grade book called think and do... my best experience is self taught.

More ways to skin a cat with common sense.

We are not in a world of 55 MPH any more.

I do not like the Chineesum crap either.....

 

[Bold & Old]

Easy now Tiger, it ain't all that...Ranger speaks the truth in that there aren't any drums for these particular
cars CURRENTLY made in this country - as you said, that seller is selling out of a stash of OLDER, but new, ones.
By the way, that seller has done a lot of good for a lot of folks in this hobby, acknowledged - but in my
case, I've chosen to go another route with this.

The drums are heavier with more meat...... no one makes asbestos brake shoes any more should be safe to say.

 

[moparedtn]

no one makes asbestos brake shoes any more should be safe to say.

Not for over 40 years now, at least in the US.
Other countries did go a bit longer in their use of asbestos in brakes, however.

 

[Bold & Old]

Not for over 40 years now, at least in the US.
Other countries did go a bit longer in their use of asbestos in brakes, however.

Yes Sir...I know its cancer causing and when I past on the owner of my car will be in the know.

I am lucky that I don't have cancer...... they do work well and last long.

 

[Bold & Old]

Hello all on that participated this thread...

I would like to express my thoughts on this post of my short comings...

I am very sorry for being a brat and over stating my disrespectful thoughts to others.

My social skills are very rusty with this pandemic and getting older.

I am guilty of over exerting my forceful opinions on several the contributing members on this thread.

To all please forgive me........ I will be more mindful to all here on.

I will rephrase some of my postings here also.

I too am trying to be a old student here and not a know it all.

Respectfully Mike

 

[Cranky]

Hello all on that participated this thread...

I would like to express my thoughts on this post of my short comings...

I am very sorry for being a brat and over stating my disrespectful thoughts to others.

My social skills are very rusty with this pandemic and getting older.

I am guilty of exerting my forceful opinions on several the contributing members on this thread.

To all please forgive me........ I will be more mindful to all.

I will rephrase some of my postings here also.

Respectfully Mike

There's many of us on here that are at least 70 and several that are older and this 'pandemic' has gotten under the skin of many. Don't think anyone is going to hang you from a tree for being a bit forceful....

 

[Bold & Old]

There's many of us on here that are at least 70 and several that are older and this 'pandemic' has gotten under the skin of many. Don't think anyone is going to hang you from a tree for being a bit forceful....

its out of character for me.....

Thanks

 

[hangn0ut]

its out of character for me.....

Thanks

Just read this thread. Didn't notice any of that......

 

[Bold & Old]

Just read this thread. Didn't notice any of that......

Oh Lord don't want to be misunderstood as the song goes...

 

[moparedtn]

UPDATE 5/13:
All of the parts I've sourced have now arrived - that's the good part.
Unfortunately, the shoes (both front and rear) that were purportedly US-made....are in fact, not -
that's the bad part.

They're VERY aggressively metallic and I'm sure they'd be fine, but this is not something I'm so
quick to accept.
If the seller was ignorant of the fact, that's one thing - but if he knowingly led me to believe something
false, we're gonna have a big issue up in here.
The seller if offering full refund; I'm trying to figure out some manner of exchange if he has what I required
to begin with.
More to come.....

 

[mrmolding]

Subscribed! I'm 3/4 of the way redoing my drums all around on my 70 RR. I hate to say it, but I REALLY wanted to have rallye red showing through my road wheels. It will be a cruiser anyway and all I ever had in the day was drums. After getting car last year, I took off rear drums and adjuster cable was almost broken and star wheels were rusted and not moving. Date codes on rubber lines was 1993. So, I got all new lines, dist block, e brake cables from Inline tube. Had trouble getting rusted wheel cylinder bolt off front left yesterday and noticed upper ball joint looks like the rubber is completely gone. You can push it and grease blows through the rubber. So, I'm off on another tangent now but looking forward to updates here for inspiration!

 

[moparedtn]

Well, a couple days later

UPDATE 5/13:
All of the parts I've sourced have now arrived - that's the good part.
Unfortunately, the shoes (both front and rear) that were purportedly US-made....are in fact, not -
that's the bad part.

They're VERY aggressively metallic and I'm sure they'd be fine, but this is not something I'm so
quick to accept.
If the seller was ignorant of the fact, that's one thing - but if he knowingly led me to believe something
false, we're gonna have a big issue up in here.
The seller if offering full refund; I'm trying to figure out some manner of exchange if he has what I required
to begin with.
More to come.....

Update to this:
After much research on the proffered brake shoes (I now know way too much about the codes stamped into
brake linings - sheesh!) as well as actually contacting the suppliers' tech line, the shoes are indeed China-
sourced, regardless of who the American retailer is here who sells them.

I've been told by said retailer that "nobody makes brake shoes in the USA anymore, hasn't for years"....
as if that makes it better or easier to accept.
Well, at least for me - it doesn't.
I'm not quite ready to accept defeat on this just yet - even if it means my eventually buying "inferior" old
(but new in box) linings to use.

Remember the point of the exercise - I want to see if it's still possible to do a basic "brake job" on Fred's
factory-built drum brake setup using all USA-made parts.
To be continued...

 

[moparedtn]

Well, this isn't going as quickly as I had intended, but not for a lack of trying...
The decision was made to box up all the supposed domestic brake parts I fetched from
the well-known to the hobby Mopar guy and send 'em back for a full refund.
Credit to him for doing that (including shipping no less).....
but here's the thing:

In my opinion, folks shouldn't go tossing terms like "original Mopar supplier" and "Cyclebond"
in their advertising when the products they're selling have next to zero to do with either
of those qualities.
In this case, the products sold were quite Chinese-produced (albeit for a huge US company).
I'm sure they would have worked, but for the seller to first feign ignorance at the manufacturing
location and then say it was "ok" to tell me my "USA-made" spec was being met because the
parent company of the producer of the parts is based in the US just flat disappoints me.

This is all a temporary setback, of course - there ARE still US-made shoes out there on the market
(yes, they're necessarily going to be old stock/new in box) and I'll swing a deal on some soon as
the refund process is complete.
As of now, I'm back to staring at my new rear wheel cylinders, which ARE USA-made.
The process begins again...

 

[F4R/T]

Completely agree... some are not being straight with anything anymore on where it is produced. Brake parts co used to make all sorts over by me in Litchfield Il., you know where that went. Take a look at a lot of things now and see where it’s made, it will say distributed by such and such not made in China leaving you to do the leg work of figuring out where it came from. Another BS way to hid the fact its chinesum in a different wrapper. Bastards are doing it with over the counter ibuprofen to paper plates to plastic forks... Make it here or Canada or even Mexico at least you know your safer... Ridiculous as most of us will pay up for USA made... sorry guys I ranted a little bit.. I did see a load of pretty new galvanized coils go by me walking in to my building and thought how nice it is to see them..

 

[moparedtn]

More research done (and a great big thank you to Nick of Nick's Garage!) and come to find out,
there ARE still brake shoes being manufactured in the USA!

Porterfield Brakes out in California will be the supplier for my brake shoes, front and rear (336 and 446).
Their "R4-S" compound (kevlar, carbon and metallic) is their high performance street composition;
obviously, I don't want or need race formula brakes on Fred.
I'm tickled to death to find these and they go from order to out the door in a matter of a few days - fresh!
https://www.porterfield-brakes.com
It doesn't hurt that they're considerably less $$$ than the musclecarbrake.com folks, either - who I gladly
would have gone with if not for their hefty prices.

All this said, I had all manner of old (but new in box) shoes lined up on eBay for the car as well, but none
I was truly in "love" with. Nick pointing me to the Porterfield guys speaks volumes, as does the fresh/new
and aggressive as heck parts.

On to fetching the hoses, hardware, etc. now!

PS - I have discovered that practically ALL the application guides being used in the brake parts & auto parts industries now are DEAD WRONG when it comes to the late 60's/early 70's Mopar muscle models.
They all show these cars to have come with 10" drums all around, which of course is nonsense - it also makes finding replacement parts more difficult as a result, too.

 

[F4R/T]

Keep us posted Ed on those hoses also where the brake cylinders came from as I’m looking for USA only parts for my RT. I would normally buy NOS but sorry 50 year old rubber does kinda deteriorate while sitting and I’m driving mine... But it must look as close as possible to original and function that way . I feel safer with made in USA stuff too... Yep I pay up for it too...