Gen 3 Hemi 1/4 mile times VS the stock vintage engines

[Bad B-rad]

Any one have info on Vintage vs modern engines, in the same model car, similar options, 1/4 mile and 0-60 times?

So ideally you would have the same two cars running same transmission, same rear end gear, and similar options, the only major difference being the engines.

Most times when people drop in modern engines, they upgrade the trans, suspension and brakes, and so on.
So finding one with just the engine swapped, may not be that easy.
But would be really cool to see, for example a stock 1968-70 Charger R/T 440 line up next to a similar 68-70 Charger with just the engine swapped to 5.7.
and then do it again with different models and different engines.
In this type of test we would not be concerned with MPG, or reliability just vintage iron, vs gen 3 Hemi, and just for fun.

 

[5.7 hemi]

For the trans, it’d have to be a small block 727 or 904.

 

[Bad B-rad]

For the trans, it’d have to be a small block 727 or 904.

Or even a big block 727 with adaptor plate.
But yeah stock Mopar trans only

I was just trying to keep as many things the same, as can be.
That way we would get #'s based on JUST the engine differences.
And mainly its just for fun.
We all know the gen 3 has a HP advantage, but the Big blocks have the torque advantage.
I THINK the CRATE 5.7 is rated at 383HP and 410TQ
A 69 383 is 330HP, and 420TQ

 

[Photon440]

255HP and 330 TQ would be closer to the net ratings for that '69 383 if you want a side by side comparison.

 

[Kern Dog]

Any one have info on Vintage vs modern engines, in the same model car, similar options, 1/4 mile and 0-60 times?

So ideally you would have the same two cars running same transmission, same rear end gear, and similar options, the only major difference being the engines.

Most times when people drop in modern engines, they upgrade the trans, suspension and brakes, and so on.
So finding one with just the engine swapped, may not be that easy.
But would be really cool to see, for example a stock 1968-70 Charger R/T 440 line up next to a similar 68-70 Charger with just the engine swapped to 5.7.
and then do it again with different models and different engines.
In this type of test we would not be concerned with MPG, or reliability just vintage iron, vs gen 3 Hemi, and just for fun.

FBBO member Darius has a 70 GTX with a 5.7 and the NAG 5 speed automatic. He has raced at Sacramento raceway but I don't know his ETs. Once or twice, I have considered a 3G Hemi swap but to me, they just don't have the soul of the classic engines.
Plus, I'm cheap.

 

[Bad B-rad]

I am with you KD, I love torque over HP, and I am broke!!!
IF I was going gen 3 in MY Charger, Rule#1, I would cut NOTHING, so stock trans, no Nag1.
Rule #2: 392(6.4) or stroked to the MAGICAL # 426!!!
My buddy has a Scat Charger with headers,CAI, and tune, that thing is a BEAST!!!!
I would go 6.4 in my Charger, but I haven't the $8K Mopar wants.

I am not knocking the 5.7 Hemi, I do love them, they are just not 392's
That 6.4 is just an all out animal, it is made to do one thing, kick @$$!!
Were as the 5.7 has to be able to wear several different hats. (Its a car engine/truck engine, make good power, tow stuff, get decent MPG, it has to make everyone from a 20 year old kid, to an 70 year old grandma taking her knitting group to church on Sunday happy, it has to please them all)

 

[Bad B-rad]

255HP and 330 TQ would be closer to the net ratings for that '69 383 if you want a side by side comparison.

I was just throwing out #'s off the top of my head but,
That is exactly why side by side real life testing would be great!! (and super FUN!!!)
Because #'s on paper, (even official MFG advertised numbers)are not as accurate as having two very similar model cars line up and rip down the track.
Too many variables like Photon 440 said GROSS VS NET HP, RWHP vs CRANK HP, even the make of the dyno has an effect on the number
Even if we find cars running the gen3 hemi, we must find bone stock, factory correct engines, to run them, I doubt we find many guys with #'s matching, untouched from the factory Hemi, or 440 cars that will RUN them hard for some goofballs on a forum to test. LOL!!!

 

[5.7 hemi]

When I did my 5.7 545rfe in my 64 Polara 500, I wouldn’t hesitate to race a stock built 440 with an auto or 4 speed.

Not exactly comparing apples to apples, but at 95 cu.in. deficient, I’d take that bet all day long. And I’d most likely win.

 

[Bad B-rad]

My 1966 Charger(in profile pic) with stock 67 2bbl 383 engine(that I put Mopar 4bbl intake, Holley 650cfm carb, and hooker headers on) ran [email protected]
My wife's 2016 Charger 5.7 R/T (full tank and spare in trunk)runs [email protected](I forgot the MPH)
So I don't try and race her with my 69, because I don't want to loose!!!
BUT she has 8 gears and a 3.90 rear

 

[Bad B-rad]

Hey 5.7 HEMI, your 64 Polara sounds like a sweet street combo, the 5.7 hemi with the 4 speed od!!! I bet it rips fairly good!!!
Now besides the extra weight of your trans, isn't the 454RFE bacicly a 727 with OD?

They keep changing the what the transmissions are called. I cant keep up
I was planning on using a 46RE in my step side truck behind the 5.7 hemi, mostly for the OD not durability.

 

[Kern Dog]

My 1966 Charger(in profile pic) with stock 67 2bbl 383 engine(that I put Mopar 4bbl intake, Holley 650cfm carb, and hooker headers on) ran [email protected]
My wife's 2016 Charger 5.7 R/T (full tank and spare in trunk)runs [email protected](I forgot the MPH)
So I don't try and race her with my 69, because I don't want to loose!!!
BUT she has 8 gears and a 3.90 rear

I'd bet you money that your numbers on the 2016 car are off the mark. This is the first time that I have read of a 5.7 car breaking into the 12s. How did you get the 3.90 axle? The A8 has such a deep first gear, the Hellcat got a 2.62 axle, the 5.7 Challengers got a 3.06.

 

[Bad B-rad]

I'd bet you money that your numbers on the 2016 car are off the mark. This is the first time that I have read of a 5.7 car breaking into the 12s. How did you get the 3.90 axle? The A8 has such a deep first gear, the Hellcat got a 2.62 axle, the 5.7 Challengers got a 3.06.

I have Atco time slips and video to prove it!!!!

 

[Bad B-rad]

The 3.90 is from stick shift Challenger, Ronan and I were the first to swap the rears, I totally should have gone with 3.70 because the 3.90's have me crossing the line at 6100rpm, and I am a bit past peak power.
You are right about first gear, I can launch in 2nd and still pull hard.
I will find my time slips,

 

[5.7 hemi]

The 518, 46,47,48 are basically a 727 with od, the 545rfe, totally different animal. All electronically controlled, a dual 2nd gear (depends on the load of the engine for which 2nd you get) 4&5 are both od gears. First is 3.01, get ya outta the hole on a quick damn hurry.

My Polara was a ANIMAL if ya laid your foot into it. Cruised great, 20mpg, ac! I sold it to get my first diesel truck, bought it from my grandpa. Needed it cause my father was moving and I used his truck when I needed one.

Check out my build...late model hemis into early b bodies.

 

[Kern Dog]

The 3.90 is from stick shift Challenger, Ronan and I were the first to swap the rears, I totally should have gone with 3.70 because the 3.90's have me crossing the line at 6100rpm, and I am a bit past peak power.
You are right about first gear, I can launch in 2nd and still pull hard.
I will find my time slips,

I was thinking that you were describing a stock model.

 

[Bad B-rad]

I think bone stock it ran 13.8's
I have the 3.90 rear, that's really the main mod.
My wife's car is stock 5.7 engine wise. no cam, or throttle body, or injectors, I even have stock exhaust(from a 6.4)
I have bolted on 6.4 exhaust manifold, and the SRV intake. So all parts are factory Mopar. with exception of the tune, to take advantage of the better flowing intake exhaust.
I really think the 3.90 is to much, the 3.70 would put me back in the middle of power, instead of past it.
I trying to load video.
I beat an unskilled Hellcat driver.
I ran I think it was [email protected] 106 and he smoked the tires off his cat 3 times lol.
So a hellcat is way faster then my R/T but spinning aint winning, and I have it on video.
Sometimes at night if I feeling blue, I watch it,lol

 

[Bad B-rad]

I got my wife's time slips.
her car is #777
it is at ATCO NJ, I think it was 87-94 degrees that day,
These are HER RUNS.

 

[Bad B-rad]

Because she is a woman, and she knows where she puts stuff, I posted HER slips,
I will post mine when I find them.
But as you can see, even her runs with traction control on, 3/4 tank, and spare tire, she runs consistent one tenth of a second slower then my claimed time of 12.9.
I have been told on a cool day with some tuning we should get 12.7's, but I have never ran that.
Granted 8 speed trans, but these cars weight aprox 4600 lbs.
I really like to know what a 5.7 would run in our B bodies, with the 727.

 

[Bad B-rad]

I am glad I got looking for these time slips, some of them are totally faded out!!??
Like WTF did they print them on disappearing ink!!
Just like Home DOPE-O receipts, they disappearing and hardly be read.
Glad I caught them in time to snap photos, and preserve them, although there are a few time slips, that maybe are better off disappearing!!!

 

[Hey-O]

My 5.7 is a totally different animal. It's a blast to drive and it's still a Mopar!! 1600 RPM at 70 MPH!!