Max fuel pressure for Carter 3705 carbs?

[fmahannah]

By 4 ends I mean the intake face of the heads, not the China walls, I am assuming the intake has a gap there at the China walls
and is not sitting up on those with no gasket, if it is you found your problem.

Thanks for the clay idea, will do that when I pull the intake again. China walls were done with right stuff, did not try to use the cork.

 

[Dragon Slayer]

This has become pretty long, but I thought the smoke started after the carb problems and changing carbs. While intake leak is a likely source, the engine was fine for *** miles until the carb problem no? It is also temp based. Oil has to thin and or block/head expansion? Maybe you had the intake leak start as a second non related issue. But if built right, and had been running fine, not sure why it all of a sudden started leaking.

I would say this, if you taking heads off again, or intake off, you need to go through all the normal checks to ensure it is good. As if you were building engine and blue printing it.

 

[4406bbl]

This^^^^

 

[fmahannah]

OK sorry I keep bothering you guys .... I will just either pull it myself and tear it all the way down to the rings or pay to have it done in 3 months.
I just can't bring myself to believe that the rings went suddenly yet wet/dry compression tests passed which would leave oil rings as the suspects.

Thanks for all the advice offered.

 

[steve340]

People will help someone who is trying to learn more and is prepared to help themselves.
No-one knows everything and we have all made plenty of mistakes.
Make logical steps and keep going you will find the problem. Don't give up - when you fix it it will be a good day and very satisfying.

I do not know much about your engine but it may pay to swap the intake to eliminate the possibility of the intake bolts or the intake itself being the source of the problem.

 

[4406bbl]

OK sorry I keep bothering you guys .... I will just either pull it myself and tear it all the way down to the rings or pay to have it done in 3 months.
I just can't bring myself to believe that the rings went suddenly yet wet/dry compression tests passed which would leave oil rings as the suspects.

Thanks for all the advice offered.

It is no bother, just want to see you get it fixed. I would be absolutely sure the intake is fitting perfect and no oil is migrating there before I pulled the engine. It does seem sudden for rings.

 

[fmahannah]

I am going to pull the intake and check everything again, will let you know how it goes. I am hoping the problem is there. Thanks

 

[fmahannah]

Update, intake was removed again, no sign of oil in runners or at gasket surface. No sign of oil running down from valve guides. Intake was re-sealed again with new gasket and extra sealer around intake ports. Ran through three cycles of warming up then retorquing bolts, same exact symptoms with the blue smoke when warm. Tried different carbs, same symptoms. So it is likely it really is the rings and I will pull the motor.

Someone mentioned trying a different intake and single carb. What intake would work for max wedge heads and exhaust manifolds well enough to run a test, and would it require a valley pan?

Thanks

 

[Ceedawg]

Update, intake was removed again, no sign of oil in runners or at gasket surface. No sign of oil running down from valve guides. Intake was re-sealed again with new gasket and extra sealer around intake ports. Ran through three cycles of warming up then retorquing bolts, same exact symptoms with the blue smoke when warm. Tried different carbs, same symptoms. So it is likely it really is the rings and I will pull the motor.

Someone mentioned trying a different intake and single carb. What intake would work for max wedge heads and exhaust manifolds well enough to run a test, and would it require a valley pan?

Thanks

My 64 would smoke like that, just a 361 but it was the rings. Being young and dumb plus no money I had pulled the engine down to inspect. I stuck it back together with same rings, should of changed them. I could ‘fog’ the whole holler.

 

[Geoff 2]

I suggested the single carb intake. Whatever you can get your hands on. It is only to test for leakage. Even though the Max ports are taller, I think the gasket will seal. If not, piggy back gaskets [ composition type ].

 

[fmahannah]

Honestly, in case I decide to keep it and run it (current gas mileage really sucks), would like to find an actual max wedge port intake for a single four barrel and any valley tray or plates required.
Does Indy make such a thing? I have looked but not sure what will actually fit max wedge heads correctly.

Thanks!

 

[Ceedawg]

Honestly, in case I decide to keep it and run it (current gas mileage really sucks), would like to find an actual max wedge port intake for a single four barrel and any valley tray or plates required.
Does Indy make such a thing? I have looked but not sure what will actually fit max wedge heads correctly.

Thanks!

Yes they do but you will need a valley plate that bolts down then paper gaskets for intake.

 

[fmahannah]

Yes they do but you will need a valley plate that bolts down then paper gaskets for intake.

Can anyone offer a part number so I know I am getting the right one? Thanks!

 

[fmahannah]

Update!

I think I might have finally found the problem...

I was so focused on it being an intake leak that I did not really pay attention when I had the heads off the last time.

I pulled the passenger side exhaust manifold off in preparation for sending the heads out to a shop to be rebuilt,
and this time there happened to be enough light in the engine compartment to look down the exhaust pipe. I saw
a trail of oil from the top down. Looked at rear exaust port on that side and it had oil coming out of it, the entire valve
and port was coated with oil.

Apparently the exhaust valve guides are shot? Inside these valve covers the oil gets pretty deep at the rear before
it reaches the drainback areas which are up high to the carb side, so the rear valve quide is exposed to oil all the time. With umbrella seals that
move up and down with the valve and since the oil was entering below them, oil can just pass right down the guides?

Getting all new guides and positive seals for both exhaust and intake valves when the heads are worked on, but it will take
three weeks. I will let you guys know how it turns out.

 

[Dragon Slayer]

Congratulations for finally finding it and reporting back.

 

[fmahannah]

Thanks for all the help! Is there any way to get better drainback here? I can see why valve cover gasket fit has to be really good to stop leaks on the rear corner.

 

[Ceedawg]

Update!

I think I might have finally found the problem...

I was so focused on it being an intake leak that I did not really pay attention when I had the heads off the last time.

I pulled the passenger side exhaust manifold off in preparation for sending the heads out to a shop to be rebuilt,
and this time there happened to be enough light in the engine compartment to look down the exhaust pipe. I saw
a trail of oil from the top down. Looked at rear exaust port on that side and it had oil coming out of it, the entire valve
and port was coated with oil.

Apparently the exhaust valve guides are shot? Inside these valve covers the oil gets pretty deep at the rear before
it reaches the drainback areas which are up high to the carb side, so the rear valve quide is exposed to oil all the time. With umbrella seals that
move up and down with the valve and since the oil was entering below them, oil can just pass right down the guides?

Getting all new guides and positive seals for both exhaust and intake valves when the heads are worked on, but it will take
three weeks. I will let you guys know how it turns out.

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I see you have the 64 heads.

 

[fmahannah]

I see you have the 64 heads.

Actually they are the max wedge reproduction heads

 

[Ceedawg]

Actually they are the max wedge reproduction heads

Copied after the 64 head, some say that head was better but I liked 63 with the shafts on the spacers instead of pedestals. It’s a wonder those guides weren’t already setup for the perfect circle seals, and cut down for high lift cams. My exhaust never had seals put on just the intake. I had the helicore type bronze guide (the best imo) on both I E but they were tight and never leaked down the guide. Glad you found the culprit.

 

[steve340]

I don't think there is much you can do about the location/build-up of oil and the drain backs.
I looked at it too and I agree that it can be a problem area.