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NO BULL; how fast was a B-body 383 HP car compared to a GTO or a Chevelle SS 396 car?

Real life stories:
New 1971 air grabber Road Runner 383 auto (300 HP low compression) with 3.23 open rear end and Polyglass G60-15 tires. Stock except for thrush mufflers. Fremont Raceway-very low 15 second ET's

Same RR "street racing" a 68-70 Mercury Cyclone 390 automatic on a country two lane road (with half the high school following us out there after class)-jumped a car length out front off the line and stayed ahead for the win (race was either to 90 MPH or 100 MPH-forget which it was).
 
You can ask my dead neighbor that one some day. I dont trust anything that requires a single track arm. In my mind it equates death wish.
 
Dibbons said:
Real life stories:
New 1971 air grabber Road Runner 383 auto (300 HP low compression) with 3.23 open rear end and Polyglass G60-15 tires. Stock except for thrush mufflers. Fremont Raceway-very low 15 second ET's

Same RR "street racing" a 68-70 Mercury Cyclone 390 automatic on a country two lane road (with half the high school following us out there after class)-jumped a car length out front off the line and stayed ahead for the win (race was either to 90 MPH or 100 MPH-forget which it was).
Click to expand...
I would have bet on the Cyclone if it had a "posi". A friend of mine had a 67? Cyclone 390 4 speed 9" "posi" w/3.90? gears, functional air scoops molded in the factory fiberglass hood. It hauled ***!
I am extremely happy with the performance of my 70 V-Code Roadrunner 440 6bbl 5-speed, and I can't wait to get to the track with the new 4.10s vs 3.54s I had and a line lock I still need to get so I can get some heat in my drag radials beyond just spinning them when I approach the line.
Like I said, power shifting and drag radials cut 6/10ths off my quarter mile time and I'm sure swapping the old 3.3 open rear axle out of the GTO and putting in the 3.89 posi Ford 9" behind that built 421 Tri-power is going to cut at least a full second off its time. Smoking a tire at 60mph is a good indication that traction upgrades are required!
 
My 383 RR went 8.90s at the local 1/8th mile track. 750 holley, headers, 3.23s auto. 1981
 
Had a couple RRs as a young guy 383/ AT cars both, pretty much stock outside of the standard holley, headers switch, both those cars really came to life in 2nd and walked down a few chevys of various drive trains. One butt kicking still comes to mind, 68 nova with a 428 poncho & 4spd stuck in it.
All I seen was tail lights all the way LOL.
 
biomedtechguy said:
I have a question and observation, and it goes to the traction issue, and leafs vs coil suspension.
Our 65 GTO has a (what I consider) "factory 4 link" that uses shocks, and a pair of coil springs in a separate location, and the GTO had air bags added inside the coil springs to adjust the rake (mainly to raise the back) by a previous owner.
Taking the air bags out of that equation, I don't see any weaknesses in what appears to me to be a 4 link-the epitome of drag racing rear suspension design. Leafs have all kinds of inherent design flaws in drag racing applications that we are aware of, and many, myself included, either enhance or change parts (CalTracks) or like I am inclined to do some day-change out the leafs for a 4 link, StreetLynx in my case is what I'm looking at.
So what am I missing in my opinion that the 65 A-body GM (and I don't know how many other GMs had this) actually has the best factory rear suspension setup for drag racing while the Mopars have leafs that belong on a hauling wagon?
Click to expand...
I have yet to read an article, whether in a Mopar racing manual or regular car magazine that didn't point out the advantages of Chrysler's leaf spring rear suspension for racing. They were designed to provide proper traction without wind-up; traction bars not required. They may have benefited station wagons too, but that's not a down side.
http://www.hotrod.com/articles/mopar-rear-leaf-springs-suspension-get-hooked-up/
 
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Back in 95 or so I had my Dads 70 charger 500, 383 Mag 727 and 323 legger all stock. Also had a 69 GTO 400 Auto and a 331 legger. The Charger would run rings around the Goat and look better doing it. Now I have my 68 R/R 440 727 and 323 sure grip and my old 67 Chevelle 4dr wagon with a 11.5 to 1 small block Tremec TKO 600 and 373 posi. The wagon might be a tad faster but wont corner as well as the torsion bar car. I need to take them to the strip one night for a grudge match against myself. 7500 rpm power shifts are fun.
 
Back in 95 or so I had my Dads 70 charger 500, 383 Mag 727 and 323 legger all stock. Also had a 69 GTO 400 Auto and a 331 legger. The Charger would run rings around the Goat and look better doing it. Now I have my 68 R/R 440 727 and 323 sure grip and my old 67 Chevelle 4dr wagon with a 11.5 to 1 small block Tremec TKO 600 and 373 posi. The wagon might be a tad faster but wont corner as well as the torsion bar car. I need to take them to the strip one night for a grudge match against myself. 7500 rpm power shifts are fun.
 
Back in 95 or so I had my Dads 70 charger 500, 383 Mag 727 and 323 legger all stock. Also had a 69 GTO 400 Auto and a 331 legger. The Charger would run rings around the Goat and look better doing it. Now I have my 68 R/R 440 727 and 323 sure grip and my old 67 Chevelle 4dr wagon with a 11.5 to 1 small block Tremec TKO 600 and 373 posi. The wagon might be a tad faster but wont corner as well as the torsion bar car. I need to take them to the strip one night for a grudge match against myself. 7500 rpm power shifts are fun.
 
You can click on the three horizontal lines and delete one. This site seems to be lagging lately.
I'll delete my reply after you do.
 
Long story short - I had my '70 Road Runner flying along at 140mph+ still accelerating away from a '66 (or '67) Chevelle SS 427 and a '69 Cobra Jet 428 Mustang - both 4-speed cars on a big straight road back in 1989. It was honest speeds, and the guys driving the other cars were on our Club Committee - President and Ex-President. My girlfriend (now wife) was sitting next to me, and watching them get smaller as was I in the rear view mirror. The best bit was that I was towing a trailer as well. Those guys never forgot that day - and they weren't holding back on the road - they were tapped right out and trying for more.
So I can honestly say MoPar's RULE. :thumbsup:
 
kiwigtx said:
Long story short - I had my '70 Road Runner flying along at 140mph+ still accelerating away from a '66 (or '67) Chevelle SS 427 and a '69 Cobra Jet 428 Mustang - both 4-speed cars on a big straight road back in 1989. It was honest speeds, and the guys driving the other cars were on our Club Committee - President and Ex-President. My girlfriend (now wife) was sitting next to me, and watching them get smaller as was I in the rear view mirror. The best bit was that I was towing a trailer as well. Those guys never forgot that day - and they weren't holding back on the road - they were tapped right out and trying for more.
So I can honestly say MoPar's RULE. :thumbsup:
Click to expand...
This was the car I had back then....
upload_2018-1-3_22-26-24.png


440, 4 speed, 3.23:1 rears and 4BBL. I miss that car...it was seriously fast on the open road.
 
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Back in the mid 80s, my buddy and i liked to street race a bit and our cars were always very close so we took them to the track at cayuga.

Mine: 70 satty
71 440 from a new yorker 335hp I think
727 with a shift kit stock tq
8-3/4 3.23 not a sg
750 AFB cs
Ran 14.6

His: 70 or 71 442 vert
Stock 455 auto
3.55 i believe
Ran 14.3 consistently
 
back in '68 my 383, 4spd, 3.55 rear, road runner would run 14.20's @ 98mph on a fairly good day and 14.40's @ 96mph on so so days in the pure stock class. automatic 3.23 geared cars ran in the lower half of the 14 second bracket on average. 325hp 396's and 390 fords would stuggle to get in the 14's, on average. there were good running Pontiacs and oldsmobiles but like most of the muscle cars running above average times it depended on tune and driver. all cars were traction limited but the 340 cars were probably above average performers in any pure stock class (exception may be ta/aar cars).
 
1971 383vs396vs400

383=4.25 x 3.375
Gross rating: 300hp @ 4800, 410tq @ 3400
Net rating: 250hp @ 4800, 325tq @ 3400
8.5:1 CR
Cam: .450/.458 lift, 268/284 dur
Heads: 90cc chamber, 2.08/1.74 valves, flow not so great

396= 4.126 x 3.75 (402ci)
Gross rating: 300hp @ 4800, 400tq @ 3500
Net rating: 260hp @ 4400, 345tq @ 4200
8.5:1 CR
Cam: .398/.430 lift, 244/284 dur
Heads: 113cc chamber, 2.06/1.72 valves, flow pretty good

400= 4.125 x 3.75
Gross rating: 300hp @ 4800, 400tq @ 3600
Net rating: 250hp @ 4400, 340tq @ 3200
8.5:1 CR
Cam: .410/.413 lift, 273/289 dur
Heads: 96cc chamber, 2.11/1.77 valves, flow middle of the road

I say with equal gearing and equal drivers in stock cars: Pontiac 1st, Mopar a near 2nd, Chevy 3rd.

With day 2 modifications, I don't think the GM cast internals are going to handle the abuse as readily as the Mopar.
 
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