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The Elephant In The Room: unloading the load from a B-body.

Here's the side profile mug shot showing the rear wheel alteration forward 2". Yes, the Three Card Monte worked at the show after all these years. This was back in 2000 when things were still hot and active.

img20200109_17342856_kl7lxf.jpg
 
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Wow, that is so subtle and sneakily done. I never noticed the axle reposition. Was the fender opening moved? Nothing looks even remotely altered. Beautifully done (of course).
 
Badvert65 said:
Wow, that is so subtle and sneakily done. I never noticed the axle reposition. Was the fender opening moved? Nothing looks even remotely altered. Beautifully done (of course).
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This was of course with a pair of rollers used during painting. With the actual race wheels and tires, it's unnoticeable. Wheel well at the very bottom needed very slight clearing shave to clear the 28" by 10.5 Hoosiers. Engine setback is 4" up front. The front wheels are in stock position. Pretty much almost a 2% setup like the original four cars, but more stealthy, especially in the dark.
 
Okay, so I've scrolled back through most of this thread in hopes of finding some time spent on a topic I had missed, to no avail. I believe there’s a component that has not been addressed. I’ve seen a quick exposure of how Lee has approached this component, but I still think it warrants at least a short cameo discussion…. Carpet.

Pretty sure FMJ’s approach is: What isn’t physically there weighs nothing. I get it; it definitely works. But it leaves the interior with a decidedly spartan look that fits in certain machines. Looks wrong in others. Within the context of this thread, can we discuss a factory musclecar appearance while adding a minimum of heft?

What’s the standard for a lightweight material? Pros and cons of that material? Theres got to be some tricks to save weight while maintaining a factory interior look and feel.
 
LemonWedge said:
Okay, so I've scrolled back through most of this thread in hopes of finding some time spent on a topic I had missed, to no avail. I believe there’s a component that has not been addressed. I’ve seen a quick exposure of how Lee has approached this component, but I still think it warrants at least a short cameo discussion…. Carpet.

Pretty sure FMJ’s approach is: What isn’t physically there weighs nothing. I get it; it definitely works. But it leaves the interior with a decidedly spartan look that fits in certain machines. Looks wrong in others. Within the context of this thread, can we discuss a factory musclecar appearance while adding a minimum of heft?

What’s the standard for a lightweight material? Pros and cons of that material? Theres got to be some tricks to save weight while maintaining a factory interior look and feel.
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I can say the following based on my notes. The factory had a couple of standard floor coverings back in those days. It was either a factory carpet with jute backing, rubber sole inserts and perhaps a light film/insulation covering underneath that or it was the dreaded poverty Taxi-Police issue rubber mat coverings.

The A990's came with factory carpets, but with no jute paddings, backings or other films of protection, road sound filtering and comforts. They were just the bare carpets. Fairly light, but seemed to always lift up and create waves over time.
Now mind you, the rubber mats with texture to them always laid nice and flat, Why? They weighed (Not by much, but enough)more than the factory carpets. How do I know this? because my car had these mats (two parts) and when I weighed them after removal, I was dissatisfied.
My remedy years later? The most aggressive/texture bed liner that I could spray on. The can of the stuff weighed just a tad under what the carpet weighed and a good amount under what the rubber mat weighed. Various brands will give you various numbers.

Now, is the sprayed bed liner too spartan to rival a bachelors refrigerator, Yes! but it handles the mail.
Personally, I like very much the rubber mats for a stripped down factory look. I would guess that aftermarket molded mats are lighter than the factory issue because the factory wanted some longevity to them especially under heavy usage such as in Taxi/Government vehicles and for that reason, they were thick and weighed the part. Choose your poison.
 
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Hemirunner said:
What’s the car weigh today?
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2990 Lbs more or less at last call.
All Metal, hence the name handle of Full Metal Jacket. It's nom de plume is "Mr Hyde"
I've got to weigh it again after adding and subtracting some stuff over the last few years. I could comfortably say that it is floating at the 3000- Lb mark.
It takes more than just a village to bring a car down this far with metal only. With all due respect, No fiberglass, Carbon fiber or others.
 
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LemonWedge said:
Carpet.
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Ozite.

Problem with ozite is it doesn't look anything like the original loop-style carpet. It comes in flat rolls and there's no driver's side foot pad or trim. If you don't care about the look then that's probably what you want. I believe it's easy to install and it stretches. Might even be able to get it at Home Depot.

If you feel like spending a bunch of money you can get the Perlon Felt material that's used in Porsches. It's super lightweight and way nicer than ozite but again, it's very expensive. I wasn't able to find it in bulk either.

I don't like a bare metal interior so I use factory style 80/20 loop with the jute backing. Besides the factory original apperance, it also insulates some amount of noise and heat from under the floor. I have a full 3" exhaust with Ultra Flow muffs. tucked up to the floor, it's a noticebale cacaphony. Could the 80/20 loop be lighter, yes but I'd rather not have my teeth rattle out every time I get in the car. I am willing to sacrifice some weight savings for some level of comfort. No, I'm not putting A/C in the car but I don't want feel like I'm something rattling around in a coffee can either.

FMJ has Lizard Skin on his floors. That stuff has some insulating properties, I believe it was originally used for high-end stereo installs. Maybe put that stuff down first and intstall the ozite over it, kind of the best of both worlds. Probably something I should have done myself but I didn't think about it until I had re-assembled too much of the car.
 
DVW here probably has the lightest carpeting layout in his masterpiece. I'm sure that he wasn't trying to add any unnecessary weight into his car.
I think the lightest would be an adhesive vinyl wrap that is printed to look like loop style carpet, but contours to all the irregularities, cliffs and crevices of the floor. Super trick. I might try it myself.
 
fullmetaljacket said:
What a show this past weekend. I'm lost for words with the machinery unearthed from their comfy grottos, sans mine.

I'll keep it short in that I was completely blown away when these two specimens made their way to the stage on Saturday during a seminar involving old school Chrysler racers and builders.

Exhibit # 1 shows two brake bar harnesses which are found underneath the dash. Both Aluminum and Magnesium counterparts in this case, but steel versions are the norm, so of course y'all know where I went with that. And here I thought I had everyone beat by a mile with my own version.
After that seminar, what I walked away with wasn't just amazed envy, but the notion that any myths or legends heard of in the past could quite possibly be true. One just has to patiently dig deep or be patient for the items to come to you.

Anyone ever hear of Titanium torsion bars? More on this coming.

View attachment 1953821
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Wow, those are incredible.
 
I'm kind of surprised that Ma never did an aluminum blocked RB or Hemi, especially with the '64's having aluminum heads and Magnesium intakes.

Chevrolet did it with the ZL1's in '69 and Mopar always seemed to be on the bleeding edge of engineering.
 
Dodge 330 said:
I'm kind of surprised that Ma never did an aluminum blocked RB or Hemi, especially with the '64's having aluminum heads and Magnesium intakes.

Chevrolet did it with the ZL1's in '69 and Mopar always seemed to be on the bleeding edge of engineering.
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True that.
The ZL1's were temperamental with shifting because aluminum technology obviously was not up to par like today's alloys. Chrysler could have tried to give it a run for the money, but I think they knew that aluminum Hemi's or any other RB's was unrealistic in the mass production market. The ZL1's were just that, a 1 time public relations campaign to get notoriety for their products in a race only environment. Chrysler was planning a bigger onslaught for the Hemi starting in '66 and beyond, whereas Chevrolet had to be cornered into the big block market by outlets like YENKO, MoTION, Dana l/lickey and others to bring their Rats to the surface.

I'm now finding out that what I thought was ground breaking on my end, was actually being tested or developed in secrecy by the midnight crews at The Woodward Garage and Highland Park facilities. I'm just content with being part of the pool of mad scientists that think alike.
 
fullmetaljacket said:
True that.
The ZL1's were temperamental with shifting because aluminum technology obviously was not up to par like today's alloys. Chrysler could have tried to give it a run for the money, but I think they knew that aluminum Hemi's or any other RB's was unrealistic in the mass production market. The ZL1's were just that, a 1 time public relations campaign to get notoriety for their products in a race only environment. Chrysler was planning a bigger onslaught for the Hemi starting in '66 and beyond, whereas Chevrolet had to be cornered into the big block market by outlets like YENKO, MoTION, Dana l/lickey and others to bring their Rats to the surface.

I'm now finding out that what I thought was ground breaking on my end, was actually being tested or developed in secrecy by the midnight crews at The Woodward Garage and Highland Park facilities. I'm just content with being part of the pool of mad scientists that think alike.
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My take on it is that Chrysler didn't really see the need for aluminum. The Hemi was built primarily for NASCAR, where weight reduction didn't make as much sense, since the cars had minimum weights to meet anyway, so why spend the effort on lighter parts, only to have to add ballast later.

Having the street option was just a necessity to make the engines legal to race as production engines.

As for ability to produce, they'd just finished building 50,000 cast aluminum slant six engines in 1961-62, so they had production figured out.
 
Dodge 330 said:
I'm kind of surprised that Ma never did an aluminum blocked RB or Hemi, especially with the '64's having aluminum heads and Magnesium intakes.

Chevrolet did it with the ZL1's in '69 and Mopar always seemed to be on the bleeding edge of engineering.
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The '64's had iron heads and alum. intakes, it's the '65's got the alumuminum-magnesium parts and even with the iron block, the 990's came in at 200lbs under NHRA class weight minimum of 3400#.
 
Jeff Peterson said:
The '64's had iron heads and alum. intakes, it's the '65's got the alumuminum-magnesium parts and even with the iron block, the 990's came in at 200lbs under NHRA class weight minimum of 3400#.
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This is when the beauty of barbells, water filled spares and lead packed rear bumpers come into play.
 
I knew eventually that I would dip just below the numbers of even the coveted 990's by meshing three phenomenal campaigns by the Old Chrysler corporation; the (8) total 2% FX CARS, The (12) AWB A/FX DRAGSTERS and The (1) and only "SILVER BULLET".
Now hot on the heels of the weight numbers of the kings of the diet pills, the A/FX dragsters. Supposedly they nipped the 2800 Lbs mark straight outta Amblewagon. A tough goal to set my soul, but perhaps close. In reality, I don't think I'll make the cut with only metal alloys on board. With all due respect to the use of fibers, I'm not going to under any circumstances.
The eRACE is on.
 
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