What broke first and caused the carnage?

Engine, Trans & Driveline

  1. 33 IMP

    33 IMP Well-Known Member

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    A driveshaft loop is positioned to keep the car from pogo-sticking if a front u-joint breaks. It can also limit damage from rear joint failure, or shaft failure from exceeding critical speed (usually on a chassis dyno). It wont contain a shaft that is determined to leave the vicinity.
     
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    • Cranky

      Cranky Henchman #1 Staff Member FBBO Gold Member

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      I would for sure check the length of the shaft. Even though it looks like your u-joint clips are missing, a shaft too long could have been a factor too and even though things are a mess, you can at least still see if it's close to being the right length. Years ago a buddy of mine swapped in a Dana 60 into his 69 Bee and didn't shorten the shaft. He said it had 1/2" clearance and told him it wasn't enough but he said it'll be fine. It wasn't. The engine wasn't stock either and had plenty of torque and well, it did mess up his transmission enough to at least let him know things weren't right before he had major damage other than the trans needing to be fixed.
       
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      • Paul_G

        Paul_G Well-Known Member

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        I will agree with the problem most likely starting at the rear U Joint. I looked at the U joints still in the shaft, they have the C-clips on them. Does not mean he did not forget a c clip on the one cap that came out. Or, he over tightened the small strap bolts and one snapped off under load.

        Drive shaft length can be checked against my other 73 400 4 speed car. The drive shaft has some dents in it. One of the U joint caps rotates in the yoke on the drive shaft. Not sure if the drive shaft can be saved/repaired, or just get another one.

        I looked at everything before I drove the car. Wish I would have pulled the drive shaft and double checked the U joints. It was fresh, but relying on some one else to have done it right, got me an expensive repair.
         
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        • Purepony

          Purepony Well-Known Member

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          Does anyone have a pic of these clips installed because I think I’m missing them too
           
        • Purepony

          Purepony Well-Known Member

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          Does anyone have a pic of these clips installed because I think I’m missing them too
           
        • Purepony

          Purepony Well-Known Member

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          Sucks man I’m sorry your going through this
           
        • 66Satellite47

          66Satellite47 FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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          It appears the clips were not in place. The rear joint got far enough out to break the strap bolt. All hell breaks loose then.
          I twisted a stock driveshaft in half going through the traps at 120 MPH. Tossed the shaft right over the windshield of the car in the other lane. My best friend.
          Destroyed the tail housing of the 727 & bent the output shaft over 1/4", broke the bellhousing area off the engine block.
          I always use a large diameter stout driveshaft with big U joints now.
           
        • Mike67

          Mike67 FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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          images.jpeg
           
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          • 68Dart470

            68Dart470 Well-Known Member

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            Recommend a SFI Flywheel, Blowshield and a driveshaft loop as others have mentioned. That is a painful amount of damage for sure. A new, custom length, driveshaft would probably be in order as well.
             
          • Cranky

            Cranky Henchman #1 Staff Member FBBO Gold Member

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            Never have been a fan of reusing a shaft that's been though a battle....especially one that looks like yours. It might can be saved but a good driveshaft shop would have to take a look at it. And I'm thinking about taking more pics of the work I do for others lol. It's pain in the butt to stop working to take pics and can get time consuming but in the long run, it can be beneficial for me too....

            See below.

            Some u-joins have this style and some used C-clips on the inner portion of the bearing cup.
             
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            • 1 Wild R/T

              1 Wild R/T FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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              Those clips aren't used on Mopars, they are used by GM & Ford...

              Mopar uses this style clip...

              Screen Shot 2021-07-20 at 9.01.59 AM.png

              They install in grooves on the U joint caps...

              Screen Shot 2021-07-20 at 9.02.42 AM.png

              And they are need on all four cars both front & rear... Often the ones on the rear that go in the rear axle flange people leave them out because GM & Ford use a little tab made onto the yoke to retain the caps...

              Screen Shot 2021-07-20 at 9.08.41 AM.png

              Mopar doesn't have that tab so if you leave the clips out the only thing holding the caps in position is the clamping force provided by the retainer straps..... It'll work, for awhile... Then it won't.. & when it fails it can be ugly....
               
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              • Mike67

                Mike67 FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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                Ya, you are right, I have converted to 1350s.
                 
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                • R/T Boy 67

                  R/T Boy 67 Well-Known Member

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                  Just for the record, chrysler used 1330 joints with the external clips and rear yoke tabs on hemi and 440 cars in 66 -67.
                   
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                  • Cranky

                    Cranky Henchman #1 Staff Member FBBO Gold Member

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                    And then you have the people that are swapping in the 9" into everything but I should have mentioned that Mopars use C-clips.
                     
                  • 1 Wild R/T

                    1 Wild R/T FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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                    I knew there was gonna be exceptions & someone would want to point it out but 99% of Mopars are built the same way & thats whats pertinent to the O/P.......
                     
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                    • INTMD8

                      INTMD8 Well-Known Member

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                      I would not use it. Much higher chance of it failing now that it's damaged.
                       
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                      • 65Fury440

                        65Fury440 Well-Known Member

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                        Holy cow!!
                        Sorry you went through that.
                         
                      • R413

                        R413 Well-Known Member

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                        These type of clips are used on 66-67 hemi.
                        They are 1330 u-joints

                        also used on L VIN code 440 HP engines: 67 440 GTX R/T and 1967 440 HP C-bodies.

                        3A257BCF-03A9-4F44-BC53-A1E63B1FE7D9.jpeg
                         
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                        • Paul_G

                          Paul_G Well-Known Member

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                          I have bee trying to locate the parts I need to put the trans back together. I ran across a guy here in Phoenix who has an iron body overdrive 4 speed. Some of them were aluminum bodys. Can that iron body OD 4 speed hold up to a stock 440?

                          He does not have a bell housing for it. Do they make a bell that will bolt the OD 4 speed to a big block? He said there is something different with the OD 4speed bells. His prices is $600, negotiable. And with the shifter and rods.
                           
                        • Ron H

                          Ron H FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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                          Not to go off the topic; but this reminds me again it might be good to install a driveshaft loop. Any recommendations on setups for a 63 Plymouth, bolt on?
                           
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