What to expect from 1970 383 HP

[RemCharger]

Doesn't matter, buy what you want, it's your $$$
it's a waste to no have the cfm/flow, no matter the look...

worried about the wrong stuff
you should want quality & a better part

but you do you, I'm done

bingo

 

[340runner]

Fuel pump pushrod

Ding ding ding, totally forgot about it, coming from small blocks has its differences

 

[1KoolBee]

Well, took it down and when I took heads off 4 of the valves were broke off from the stem, no sign of smacking piston, I just think time got to it and one of the lower bolt holes on one of the heads is cracked, so guess those aren't happening. Blocks still sitting in mmo trying to unlock it. Its going to machine shop, im probably going to take it to blueprint deck height and everything, and probably bore it 30 over cause I have no forged pistons otherwise. Hopefully block can take 30 over

Only thing is i dont understand is how im supposed to have any compression really, even the icon 687s are 28 thou lower compression height almost, and their 10.4 to 1 on a 80cc head, I dont know if that's good for an aluminum head, I've heard they need to have higher compression to perform well?

Now, as for why I want a 383 as opposed to a 440? I want to be able to rev freer and faster, without having to drop as much coin
Also, while nitrous works better with more cube, a 100 shot is gonna still at the end of the day add 100 horse

I think with a 3.91 stroke and 2 lbs less per piston/rod assembly, these will rev pretty fast/free in a 383!

 

[19bee70]

Better start saving that 10k for the rebuild.

Spot on! A year ago .I started with bare block, factory crank and rods for a 440. After boring .030, 440 Source heads, Hughes can, JE Pistons, Doug's headers, Performer RPM, and a dyno tuned Holley.....and some other items WITH machining and the build ....10k. Oh, that also included the dyno pulls.

 

[340runner]

Spot on! A year ago .I started with bare block, factory crank and rods for a 440. After boring .030, 440 Source heads, Hughes can, JE Pistons, Doug's headers, Performer RPM, and a dyno tuned Holley.....and some other items WITH machining and the build ....10k. Oh, that also included the dyno pulls.

Were the JE pistons custom, and if they were, how much did they run you and did you order any trick deals with em, or just pretty standard pistons?

Also did you use a roller or flat tappet cam?

 

[19bee70]

Were the JE pistons custom, and if they were, how much did they run you and did you order any trick deals with em, or just pretty standard pistons?

Also did you use a roller or flat tappet cam?

I don't think they were custom. $700.00 JE # 213455 and motor is a roller (Cam, lifters, Mancini rockers)
Yeh ...a real fast track to 10k but remember a bare block means bare block. No hardware or any ext parts like pan, tray, pumps,timing cover,water pump housing,....nothing. Now it's in the car and running. Dyno'd with 510hp and 540Tq.....I had to stop there with the limitations on my trans and rearend.

 

[340runner]

I don't think they were custom. $700.00 JE # 213455 and motor is a roller (Cam, lifters, Mancini rockers)
Yeh ...a real fast track to 10k but remember a bare block means bare block. No hardware or any ext parts like pan, tray, pumps,timing cover,water pump housing,....nothing. Now it's in the car and running. Dyno'd with 510hp and 540Tq.....I had to stop there with the limitations on my trans and rearend.

Hopefully going with a 68 383 rotating assembly i can get for cost of shipping so no need to balance, around 180$ and going flat tappet over roller will cut some of that price down, but yea I have a complete engine, while heads wont work most everything else should

The main reason I went big block also is id like to go with another setup for motor, I dont like how my PO setup my 340, I think its a poor combination. To change it though is god awful expensive for small block, i will happily go with 440source for almost anything I need, especially for things like a oil pan or something

If there was like a 440source for small block my opinion would be different

 

[rickseeman]

I feel 440 Source is an great asset to the BBM community.
A: Ultra informative website, a real treasure
B: Parts for BBM's only, you don't have to sift through all the LS stuff
C: They have stuff IN STOCK
My hat is off to them. They have improved my wedge knowledge.

 

[19bee70]

Hopefully going with a 68 383 rotating assembly i can get for cost of shipping so no need to balance, around 180$ and going flat tappet over roller will cut some of that price down, but yea I have a complete engine, while heads wont work most everything else should

The main reason I went big block also is id like to go with another setup for motor, I dont like how my PO setup my 340, I think its a poor combination. To change it though is god awful expensive for small block, i will happily go with 440source for almost anything I need, especially for things like a oil pan or something

If there was like a 440source for small block my opinion would be different

If you look up Chris Birdsong on YouTube, he's a firm believer in 383s but like some have said....if you start from scratch the costs could be nearly identical. The whole flat tappet lifter failure chased me to roller but flat tappet is probably half as much in cost.

 

[polyjohn]

Great thread and some great points too.
OP has got some thinking to do indeed.

Our motto is ''small block cars stay small block''
Big block cars are too expensive to use on the street nowadays...

408ci is the 'new kid on the block' these days.
They run NINES with them in street cars!

383ci is nearly as much a dinosaur as a 318ci POLY...

 

[rmchrgr]

I'm personally not a fan of 383s and don't get why anyone would chose to use one save for a numbers-matching deal. I certainly wouldn't put one in favor of any 340 nor spend a dime to rebuild one to stock specs.

Based on my own direct experience, I had a basically stock one in a '68 Coronet 4 speed ('68 10:1 flat top pistons, 335HP "Roadrunner" hydraulic cam, stock "452" heads) that I drove for several years that couldn't get out of it's own way. Wouldn't rev past 4,500, (yeah, 3.23 gears were too short). But even with full tube headers, aftermarket intake and EFI control it was still a dog. Better cam and gears would have certainly helped increase the fun factor.

That said - I've posted this clip several times but here's a 383/438 I built for a friend a few years ago. All in for around $7,500. That's 2020's real world cost for parts and machine work. No labor charges since I taught him how to build it in my garage. I probably also gave the guy at least $1,000 worth of my own parts.

The engine is based on a .060" over 383 block. OOTB Stealth heads, 440 Source 3.75" stroker kit, mild Hughes hydraulic RV cam, Performer RPM intake, Comp Magnum rockers, TTI headers. Made around 450hp/475lb ft of torque, revs to 6,000 rpm. Would have made plenty more with a more aggressive cam and intake. Nothing wild, 100% street friendly and would easily go 12s in a B body with a better cam and steeper gears.

 

[340runner]

I'm personally not a fan of 383s and don't get why anyone would chose to use one save for a numbers-matching deal. I certainly wouldn't put one in favor of any 340 nor spend a dime to rebuild one to stock specs.

Based on my own direct experience, I had a basically stock one in a '68 Coronet 4 speed ('68 10:1 flat top pistons, 335HP "Roadrunner" hydraulic cam, stock "452" heads) that I drove for several years that couldn't get out of it's own way. Wouldn't rev past 4,500, (yeah, 3.23 gears were too short). But even with full tube headers, aftermarket intake and EFI control it was still a dog. Better cam and gears would have certainly helped increase the fun factor.

That said - I've posted this clip several times but here's a 383/438 I built for a friend a few years ago. All in for around $7,500. That's 2020's real world cost for parts and machine work. No labor charges since I taught him how to build it in my garage. I probably also gave the guy at least $1,000 worth of my own parts.

The engine is based on a .060" over 383 block. OOTB Stealth heads, 440 Source 3.75" stroker kit, mild Hughes hydraulic RV cam, Performer RPM intake, Comp Magnum rockers, TTI headers. Made around 450hp/475lb ft of torque, revs to 6,000 rpm. Would have made plenty more with a more aggressive cam and intake. Nothing wild, 100% street friendly and would easily go 12s in a B body with a better cam and steeper gears.

Well, how do you think about 440s since I just got one haha

A couple of things though, unless you had domed pistons or decked block and heads a lot, you didnt have 10 to 1 you had low 9 to 1s from what I researched. Also ive heard that there's wild variations in the quality of castings, honestly it sounds like you got crappy luck of the draw with heads, ive seen stories where some people pulled off heads that had casting sand in them. Think about it, the 383s and 440s got the same or very similar cam i believe, and if a 383 was done by 4500 a 440 would have been done by 3.5k at most. Doesn't sound much better does it

 

[rmchrgr]

440 is fine though heavier. No replacement for displacement. To be clear, a stroker based on a 400 is the best option for big blocks of any flavor. Largest standard bore of all three.

FYI, 1968 383 pistons were positive deck height as proved by the image below. My '68 Coronet had the matching numbers engine in it. It was 1 of 934 Coronet '440' big block 44bls or basically a Super Bee with a hardtop.

'68 was the only year big block with positive deck height pistons. 2bbl versions were 9:1 but 4bbl versions were rated at 10:1. 906 and 452 heads are pretty much identical dimension-wise but the 452s I had were milled and with a .020" shim head gasket it was definitely 10:1.
The cam was the culprit. A solid flat tappet around 225 -230 @ .050" would have woken it up.

YRMV

 

[RemCharger]

I like the 383s. Best I've done is a 10.50 in a light A body. Conversely, the 440 in my Charger has gone 10.50s so far.

 

[340runner]

I like the 383s. Best I've done is a 10.50 in a light A body. Conversely, the 440 in my Charger has gone 10.50s so far.

So the two builds are similar, I assume aside from displacement? So a mod done to a 383 on a a body will have the similar results as the same mod to a b body but with a 440 instead, if that makes sense

 

[RemCharger]

So the two builds are similar, I assume aside from displacement? So a mod done to a 383 on a a body will have the similar results as the same mod to a b body but with a 440 instead, if that makes sense

Essentially they are the same motor. The 440 just moves the piston further down the hole, creating more tq. Hp gains are slimmer. The 440 in a porky b body is the way to go

 

[Photon440]

Depends on head flow too; with the same heads, the 383 will wind up higher before reaching the flow limit, as compared to a 440. Once the head is maxed out, that's all the power you'll get, no matter how many cubes.

 

[polyjohn]

Back to basics methinks with a 383 engine.
The Mopar '516' wedge head was designed for the 361 and 383 engines.

It ended up on the 413/426 and then the 440, after the max wedge era.
It was never enough head for a 440 and is more suited to a 383.

In 1967 the infamous 915 was produced to correct the failings of the 516.
The 1968-906 and later heads are all SMOG heads up too the 452.

How much more rpm can a 383/400 low deck take over a 440?
We revved our race 440 to 7200rpm and it stayed together for twenty years.

Are we thinking a low deck stroker can take it to 7500rpm or more?
Light LOW-deck engine in an A-Body, anything else B/C body needs a 440 stroker...

 

[PROSTOCKTOM]

I've just sold a German guy a 491" stroker kit for a 383 block and have sold a lot of German guys stroker kits for 383's.

You can build a really good running 383" engine with just a few parts. They were built long before everyone started building 400 blocks.

For sure I would build a 383 for myself long before I would be building a 408 small block. That 4.25" bore is really hard to beat for me.

I can tell you for a fact that a reasonably built 383 can be traction limited on the street. So the question becomes how much power do you really need?

Tom

 

[PROSTOCKTOM]

Want to make a profit on this 383? Don't put one dime into it. But get it running and show the buyer how good it is. There is your profit.

What does your car weigh? Too much gear is a band aid to get the car moving. It is the Stock eliminator recipe to ET, but lots of valve spring and maintence costs. Those engine don't last very long.

Go price pistons for a 383 block and 440 crank.

ICON offers several very reasonably priced off-the-shelf choices for that combination.

ICON IC690 can be had around $700 if you do a little shopping

They don't cost anymore than a small block piston.

Tom