440 Source Distributor Swap Cluster

[Terry1213]

I installed a 440 source billet distributor, PN 117-1000. The difference is no vacuum advance on the 440 Source unit. I have it wired in using the Chrysler orange box ECU and it will occasionally fire off when I release the key to the Run position, but not in Start. WTH?? Now when it does fire it runs great!! Much more responsive than the Chrysler distributor. So I must have the pick up wired correctly. What's confusing is Chrysler distributor fires in Start no problem. I'm lost!! Any inputs welcome.

 

[Canadian1968]

So it will actually start but takes multiple tries ? Did you do anything else when you swapped the distributor ?

Get it running and check your base timing make sure you don't have it to far advanced .

Also double check your firing order and wire routing!

 

[GTXDAN]

What car? Are you using ballast resistor? How's it wired on car compared to old dizzy? To many possible issues to guess.

 

[Terry1213]

Multiple tries only when it's hot. The only change is the distributor. Timing is good, when it starts it runs great, firing order right on.
Pulled a plug wire and stuck in a plug. Laid it in the manifold and checked for spark in start. The 440 source dist, nothing till it springs back to run. I put the Chrysler dist back in and it fires fine in start. Definitely the distributor but what? I thought maybe the pickup was wired backwards but it does fire in run and runs great. Something is not compatible with the orange box set up in start. ???????????????

 

[Terry1213]

What car? Are you using ballast resistor? How's it wired on car compared to old dizzy? To many possible issues to guess.

69 Roadrunner 440 4 speed. Yes using a ballast. Same wiring as the original. I had to replace the connector on the new dist as they use an MSD style. Tried wiring the two dist wires both ways and I could only get it to fire in one configuration.

 

[GTXDAN]

Is it supposed to have 12v all the time. Is it getting 12v while in the switch run position and the crank position both.

 

[GTXDAN]

Here's the wiring if using the double resistor'
5 wire ECU

4 wire ECU

 

[Terry1213]

Is it supposed to have 12v all the time. Is it getting 12v while in the switch run position and the crank position both.

No. A bit more than 10V in start and 7-8 in run. From my research of an orange box ignition that's normal. The Chrysler distributor starts and runs fine with those voltages.

 

[Terry1213]

Here's the wiring if using the double resistor'

View attachment 1878106

I'm using a 4 pin and a single ballast.

 

[GTXDAN]

If it's not firing in crank, check the voltage going to the ECU during crank as it should be 12v.

 

[GTXDAN]

Could be a bad connection at the blkhd connector or the switch.

 

[Canadian1968]

No. A bit more than 10V in start and 7-8 in run. From my research of an orange box ignition that's normal. The Chrysler distributor starts and runs fine with those voltages.

The distributor itself doesn't get power . It's simply a trigger device . The ecu however should have full battery voltage while running , the coil will have approx 7- 9 v depending on your ballast resistor.

But the very fact that one distributor works fine with the same setup and the other doesn't is odd.

Not family with the 440 distributor is it the same style with a reluctor wheel and magnetic pickup ? Check the air gap between the relutor wheel and pick up. The signal maybe to weak for the ecu to read

 

[GTXDAN]

Poor wording on my part as I meant ignition, not distributor. Like CANADIAN1968 said odd that it will work with old dizzy. Are you sure the ECU is good as they can cause some weird problems sometimes.

 

[Bee1971]

If it works fine with the Chrysler Distributor

We then know everything else is working fine

And it doesn’t run or start with the 440 Source Distributor

I pulled up that part number , and like you said it uses a different male female connector

But you wired it both ways


Post #12

Did you check the gap on the pickup coil / reluctor wheel on all 8 inside the distributor

 

[MoparMur]

Years ago I had a friend that had a '73 Duster 340. At times he'd crank it and crank it and it would not start until he let the key go and it sprung back to the run position. Just at the moment he let the key go that's when it seemed to get spark. I never got a chance to figure it out for him as he sold the car shortly after. But because the car would run fine when it chose to run I always suspected an ignition switch or bulkhead wiring problem. In Terry's case the only thing I can think of is a difference in the 2 distributor pick-ups as far as resistance or something like that, because of the car running perfect with the old distributor. Also may be worth trying a new coil?

 

[Terry1213]

If it works fine with the Chrysler Distributor

We then know everything else is working fine

And it doesn’t run or start with the 440 Source Distributor

I pulled up that part number , and like you said it uses a different male female connector

But you wired it both ways


Post #12

Did you check the gap on the pickup coil / reluctor wheel on all 8 inside the distributor

I did not check the gap. I will find out what it's supposed to be set at tomorrow. It does fire and run when you release the key from start to the run position. When it starts it runs great. Very snappy response compared to the original distributor. The fact that it will fire and run great throws everything out of whack. Maybe it needs more power than the orange box can provide to fire in start. It did come with an MSD connector. So why does it run at all. ????????????

 

[Canadian1968]

I did not check the gap. I will find out what it's supposed to be set at tomorrow. It does fire and run when you release the key from start to the run position. When it starts it runs great. Very snappy response compared to the original distributor. The fact that it will fire and run great throws everything out of whack. Maybe it needs more power than the orange box can provide to fire in start. It did come with an MSD connector. So why does it run at all. ????????????

Again the distributor itself is NOT powered. It is simple sending a triggering signal to the ignition box ( whichever that might be).

So the Mopar one fire and works without problem. Basically that eliminates everything other than the distributor itself. It is the only variable that causes the problem .

I just looked up the product specs. It says it has a permanent set magnetic pick . It may or may not be able to be adjusted. I would still check the air gap and see what is. A Mopar distributor is set to .008 .

Check everything else over on the inside of the cap while u have it off make sure there are no signs of arcing .

Check connection of your wires to. Maybe use a meter and do a continuity check wiggle the wires see if it breaks the signal.

 

[HALIFAXHOPS]

You have a start and run circuit from the switch. Sounds like the start circuit (IGN1) is not working. FSM wiring will show it.

 

[Canadian1968]

You have a start and run circuit from the switch. Sounds like the start circuit (IGN1) is not working. FSM wiring will show it.

But it works witha different disdtributor nothing else changed

 

[HALIFAXHOPS]

Weird one or more wire? Also does the dist want 12V to run?