440 blown intake valley pan cause?

[kiwigtx]

While YOU might not think the blow by excessive, it obviously is.....& is bad enough to collapse the intake gasket. There is nothing else that can cause the gasket to blow OUT.

Did you read my Post #15 ?

I cracked a 440 valley pan once from a massive backfire caused by plug wires 5 & 7 being reversed.

I was told there is a lot of internal air pressure built up in a 440 when they are running hard, so any additional problem could lead to the pan going - it would be the weakest link.

 

[505Coronet]

What makes you think it was an intake backfire? An evac kit will not do anything to stop what you call an intake backfire. All that kit does is help evacuate crankcase pressures which I believe you have a lot of.

I realize this, the Evac kit is to help remedy the crank case pressure not the backfire.

I believe The backfire is from a lean condition from the PVC allowing air back into the intake manifold at the port it is tied into, the AFR is set to 12.5 on the TBI injection at WOT and the 02 sensor reads the same, so i don't feel like I'm drastically over fueling and the backfire most definitely came from the intake not the exhaust the plugs look good, which would tell me its not running rich, which would point me to a lean condition under certain conditions (such as the one i experience from WOT to no throttle)

i damn sure don't know everything so if I'm headed down the wrong path here I'm all ears. The engine is not smoking and not leaking, i do agree it has back pressure, but nothing over the top.

 

[505Coronet]

Did you read my Post #15 ?

I believe this is directed at geoff, ironically your post 15 made me immediately made me go check my firing order lol.

And then after driving and rereading is what solidified my assumption for the backfire being the cause of the valley pan in my scenario.

Thanks for the input, its experiences like yours and the sharing of them that i continue to post and ask. I have dealt with some people that would rather yell until their blue in the face to argue their point rather than actually try to solve an issue through critical thinking.....not that any of those people exist on this forum.

 

[kiwigtx]

ironically your post 15 made me immediately made me go check my firing order lol.

It's an easy mistake to make - #5 & #7 are easily mixed up if you get distracted.
If it's wrong, you'll get a big back-fire.

 

[pnora]

I realize this, the Evac kit is to help remedy the crank case pressure not the backfire.

I believe The backfire is from a lean condition from the PVC allowing air back into the intake manifold at the port it is tied into, the AFR is set to 12.5 on the TBI injection at WOT and the 02 sensor reads the same, so i don't feel like I'm drastically over fueling and the backfire most definitely came from the intake not the exhaust the plugs look good, which would tell me its not running rich, which would point me to a lean condition under certain conditions (such as the one i experience from WOT to no throttle)

i damn sure don't know everything so if I'm headed down the wrong path here I'm all ears. The engine is not smoking and not leaking, i do agree it has back pressure, but nothing over the top.

Plug the PCV hose. Leave the valve covers breathe from both banks and retest it and see if it backfires in the intake. If it does you know its nothing to do with the pcv.

 

[Geoff 2]

Kiwi,
Try reading all the relevant information before commenting. OP says the engine ran fine until it got to 5k & in post #10 he says it was running 'fantastic'. Those things do not happen with 5 & 7 swapped, & plug leads to not suddenly swap cylinders while driving [ post #1 ].

 

[505Coronet]

Here's some pictures of the engine bay and PVC set up, its hard to see but i think yall can get the jist of it, please excuse the the wiring mess, still haven't gotten to cleaning up everything i had to open up to get the correct sensors/power/grounds where they needed to go.

Kiwi,
Try reading all the relevant information before commenting. OP says the engine ran fine until it got to 5k & in post #10 he says it was running 'fantastic'. Those things do not happen with 5 & 7 swapped, & plug leads to not suddenly swap cylinders while driving [ post #1 ].

This is correct, the engine run conditions are very good, i did check the plug routing anyways just to be sure as i do **** things up occasionally.

Plug the PCV hose. Leave the valve covers breathe from both banks and retest it and see if it backfires in the intake. If it does you know its nothing to do with the pcv.

That is my plan today sir, didn't get time to run the rig yesterday, my 6 month old wanted some quality time and I'm not one to turn him down!

 

[451Mopar]

Seen blown up valley pan from a defective crankcase Evac system check valve.
The Charger just has dual K&N valve cover breathers and no PCV, but it is not street driven that much.

 

[pnora]

Here's some pictures of the engine bay and PVC set up, its hard to see but i think yall can get the jist of it, please excuse the the wiring mess, still haven't gotten to cleaning up everything i had to open up to get the correct sensors/power/grounds where they needed to go.

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This is correct, the engine run conditions are very good, i did check the plug routing anyways just to be sure as i do **** things up occasionally.




That is my plan today sir, didn't get time to run the rig yesterday, my 6 month old wanted some quality time and I'm not one to turn him down!

That system is not going to work. You have both vents tied to a tee with the pcv. You need at least one vent or both to the air cleaner or a filtered atmospheric venting box. Then the PCV on a seperate valve cover grommet with a baffle.

 

[4406bbl]

^^^^ What he said is correct. Pcv on one side, breather up to the air cleaner on the other side.

 

[505Coronet]

That system is not going to work. You have both vents tied to a tee with the pcv. You need at least one vent or both to the air cleaner or a filtered atmospheric venting box. Then the PCV on a seperate valve cover grommet with a baffle.

There we go, learned something new.

As mentioned my Evac kit should be here today to run both breathers down to the headers, so i dont intend to keep the setup above.

But learn me something here:

How would the evac kit in principle be any different than the above set-up? There would be no "inlet" to the crankcase only vacuum correct?

 

[pnora]

There we go, learned something new.

As mentioned my Evac kit should be here today to run both breathers down to the headers, so i dont intend to keep the setup above.

But learn me something here:

How would the evac kit in principle be any different than the above set-up? There would be no "inlet" to the crankcase only vacuum correct?

Right now you have no venting. Good thing there is crankcase pressure or else you would suck the gaskets in. The system needs to be able to draw clean air in, draw it through the motor and suck a metered amount through the PCV and burn it. The evac kit will allow the crankcase gasses to be drawn into the exhaust. You will cap the PCV port off on the carb. You also should have check valves on the evac to keep a slight negative draw of pressure on the crankcase side.

 

[4406bbl]

The evac kit has aspirator valves not sure if they help limit the suction, or are only a one way valve, but it gets its air supply by what goes past the rings and valve guides. A proper pcv on one side and an air inet up to the air cleaner on the other side is probably better for moisture control on a daily driver, and may be all you really need.

 

[4406bbl]

It kind of looks like someone was trying to make a system to control oil at steep angles when offroad. The way I would do it is to connect both front breathers to a tee mounted as high as possible then to the air cleaner, and mount the pvc in an oil catch can as high as possible, baffle the valve cover, and run the suction to the carb. You could get real fancy and use 2 lines for the pvc one on each valve cover, and an oil return line thru the valley cover so it would almost never draw oil unless you are on the roof.