440 shut off while running

[junkpile]

440 with mopar electronic ignition conversion. Engine bay wiring harness is about 4 years old bought new with conversion already wired in. Drove car 30 miles to a show upon leaving show car just shut off, like the key was turned off. No warning no stumbling, no running issues at all, it just shut off. Took a bit but got lucky and it re fired and drove home. Could it be the coil is failing or a problem with the Orange box? I am planning on replacing the coil but don't know if i should change the box and voltage regulator as well. Both orange box and regulator are about 3 years old. Any advise of point in the right direction is appreciated.

 

[moparnation74]

Check the orange box first!

 

[Dennis H]

440 with mopar electronic ignition conversion. Engine bay wiring harness is about 4 years old bought new with conversion already wired in. Drove car 30 miles to a show upon leaving show car just shut off, like the key was turned off. No warning no stumbling, no running issues at all, it just shut off. Took a bit but got lucky and it re fired and drove home. Could it be the coil is failing or a problem with the Orange box? I am planning on replacing the coil but don't know if i should change the box and voltage regulator as well. Both orange box and regulator are about 3 years old. Any advise of point in the right direction is appreciated.

If it still has a bulkhead connector, start there. Carefully remove all banks and spray with contact cleaner. What year is it?

 

[Yatzee]

440 with mopar electronic ignition conversion. Engine bay wiring harness is about 4 years old bought new with conversion already wired in. Drove car 30 miles to a show upon leaving show car just shut off, like the key was turned off. No warning no stumbling, no running issues at all, it just shut off. Took a bit but got lucky and it re fired and drove home. Could it be the coil is failing or a problem with the Orange box? I am planning on replacing the coil but don't know if i should change the box and voltage regulator as well. Both orange box and regulator are about 3 years old. Any advise of point in the right direction is appreciated.

Did it restart and after how long? You need to have a VOM meter with you when this happens to check for voltage failure to one or more of your under hood systems. Are any of the dash warning lights on like oil pressure or charge lights. When it stops, leave the key in the run position and probe as many "ignition run" circuits as you can - coil, ignition box, alternator etc. If all are alive with voltage, look to the distributor feed, ignition box feed or any other item including relay feeds. Had a strange thing happen once with an old glass fuse type fuse box. One fuse was pulled to check it and on reinsertion, one of the metal holders for the fuse pushed back into the fuse box so the fuse ( which I thought was seated ) was not actually seated in the holder but touching enough to make contact except at a bump.

 

[SublimeSixpack]

What ever it turns out to be, if you have the orange ECU in your system I suggest you carry a spare. I've had two of those go bad. The first one just stopped working one evening then after about 5 minutes I was able to fire the engine back up and drive home. I replaced that ECU once I got home. The second one that stopped working would not allow the engine to fire back up, fortunately I did have a new spare unit in the trunk.

 

[terzmo]

440 with mopar electronic ignition conversion. Engine bay wiring harness is about 4 years old bought new with conversion already wired in. Drove car 30 miles to a show upon leaving show car just shut off, like the key was turned off. No warning no stumbling, no running issues at all, it just shut off. Took a bit but got lucky and it re fired and drove home. Could it be the coil is failing or a problem with the Orange box? I am planning on replacing the coil but don't know if i should change the box and voltage regulator as well. Both orange box and regulator are about 3 years old. Any advise of point in the right direction is appreciated.

What was the engine temp when it turned off ?? We're you sitting in traffic?...running down the road?? I was leaning to ballast resistor but eliminated that when you drove it home. How did it run on the way home? A few things like loading up at idle and stalling..flooded? ..then heat issue upon restart...

 

[Fran Blacker]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/232005380209?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT
A cheapo spare. this was posted in another thread. I'd test it to make sure it works before depending on it for a spare. They sold a **** load of them.

 

[junkpile]

The car is a 69 charger, I was sitting in traffic but the engine temp was only at 180 (it was a cool day), it only took about 5 minutes and it did restart. Ran it home over 25 miles ran fine and smooth not an issue to speak of.

I have heard of issues with the orange box's lately, is there any other for street use on a high performance 440 that will be a plug in replacement? Just currious. I did not like the way it shut off, I had my young kids with me at the time. I do carry an extra coil, voltage regulator and orange box (very old orange box) as a just in case but did not need to put them on to get it home. But I would like a better idea of why it would just shut off, I can always buy extra components to carry in the trunk would just like to narrow down the cause. thanks for the help

 

[terzmo]

Hmmmm...how can I help......I've had several "1" time situations that lead to nothing. I would just run it and see what happens...it's hard to fix something that isn't broke at the time.....if it craps out again..starts again....try to make notes of what the engine conditions were before it crapped out...best I can submit...Good luck and Enjoy that mopar

 

[69 GTX]

I did have a tach wire short one time that drove me crazy for a couple weeks before I found it. It would die with out stumble, then restart most of the time after wiggling wires.

 

[Ranger16]

I had to chase down and extricate several electrical gremlins after purchasing my '69 Road Runner 2 years ago. One was the orange box. It put me on the side of the road twice. Turns out the OEM regulator was overcharging (no volt gauge at the time) and those ECU's do not like overcharging. Replced the ECU and all was well.

Next time it was a badly oxidized positive cable from the battery to the starter relay. The connector on the relay was so bad, I'm surprised it ran at all. Scraped it clean and all was well. (The wire on the back of the alternator was no gem either I later found out.)

Then there was the loose posts on the back of the ammeter. They did not stall me out, but the tach was bouncing all over the place and the engine was missing. Had it gotten worse, I guess it could have caused a stall.

I think I'm gremlin free now, but maybe my experiences can be of some help to you. All three of these would be worth checking.

 

[Dennis H]

Bulkhead.

 

[Sixpactogo]

440 with mopar electronic ignition conversion. Engine bay wiring harness is about 4 years old bought new with conversion already wired in. Drove car 30 miles to a show upon leaving show car just shut off, like the key was turned off. No warning no stumbling, no running issues at all, it just shut off. Took a bit but got lucky and it re fired and drove home. Could it be the coil is failing or a problem with the Orange box? I am planning on replacing the coil but don't know if i should change the box and voltage regulator as well. Both orange box and regulator are about 3 years old. Any advise of point in the right direction is appreciated.

I did an upgrade to electronic ignition in my car years ago with the orange box unit. Started having intermittent issues exactly like yours. Sometimes within 20 minutes of start up sometimes longer but always just shut off like yours. First I thought it was the coil because it seemed hotter than it should so I replaced it. The problem persisted. Here is what I found. The orange box was not grounded very well and it would get hot and open up the circuit. Once cooled down it would run again. I think your problem may lie in a grounding issue. Make sure you clean off any paint around the mounting screws because that's all it took to fix my issue. If your coil or the orange box seems hot, it could very well be a grounding problem.

 

[GetX'd]

I hate to pose such a seemingly dumb question - but what is an "orange box"?

I have an MSD electronic ignition but don't need the 6al box with my version. Is that what you're referring to.....?

 

[Sixpactogo]

I hate to pose such a seemingly dumb question - but what is an "orange box"?

It is the voltage controller for the electronic ignition. The Orange box is the one provided by Mopar performance.

 

[GetX'd]

It is the voltage controller for the electronic ignition. The Orange box is the one provided by Mopar performance.

I have an MSD Ready to Run ignition - they said I didn't need a box with that version. Am I missing something? I don't have an orange box for mine - seems to run okay -440 six pack.

 

[Sixpactogo]

I have an MSD Ready to Run ignition - they said I didn't need a box with that version. Am I missing something? I don't have an orange box for mine - seems to run okay -440 six pack.

Here is a pic of the orange box we are dealing with. It is circled in white on my 70 Challenger. The car did not have electronic ignition so I upgraded to the Mopar Performance electronic distributor and the orange box they include is the controller for the mopar performance distributor. MSD has their own set up as do others.

 

[Bruzilla]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/232005380209?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT
A cheapo spare. this was posted in another thread. I'd test it to make sure it works before depending on it for a spare. They sold a **** load of them.

Thanks for the link. I just bought one.

 

[Superb Bee]

Is It a manual, lol. I had some "ignition" problems too one day leaving a wedding with a bunch of people outside watching lol

I carry spare everything in my cars that don't have msd, Orange box, resistor, coil, jumper wires, cutters, meter, all in one screwdriver, adjustable, pliers, visegrips, that little black bag has gotten me out of some jams, and I have helped a ton of guys on the road to, from, and at shows.
Was at a show last June, had to be 105 degrees out and a nice guy with a 383 RR drove into the show, and then around lunch time I heard the sound, turned over, started up and shut off with a stumble and pop. I new it, either hes out of gas or that fuel pump just gave up. After a few minutes I seen a guy walking over with a test light and I said let me go over before they poke all his wires to death. I stood there for a minute and said I think you got no fuel, do you mind? and he said go ahead, I spun the breather off, and said turn it over, she had no fuel.
He said I just filled up, I said its your fuel pump, I have one in my tool bag, you are welcome to it.
I crawled under and changed it for him, him and his wife bought me and my wife lunch and he let me drive (I had the gtx that day and made sure he knew we weren't trading joy rides, lol), he and his wife were much younger than us and I think he would have felt funny having one of us sit in the back..

Funny part of the story, I came back and someone stole my center caps you know what they say "no good deed goes unpunished".

sorry, I am old and ramble, its a sickness brought on by living past your usefulness try this, change one part, keep the old one, I would start with the orange box, carry a few spare parts and be prepared as you can. good luck, intermittent car problems are the work of the devil.

 

[junkpile]

Thanks for all the help, advise, and stories (at least I know I am not the only one with this issue). Bulkhead looks good everything is bright and clean. I think i can rule out wiring because its fairly new and all connectors look good. Ground on the orange box is good, no corsion behing it. I am purchasing a new coil tonight, I have a new voltage regulator, and I guess I have to order a new orange box, my spare in the trunk has a crack in it so I am scrapping that thing. Sixpactogo where did you get that bracket for the orange box? seems that would aid in keeping it cool because its off the firewall. I would hate to drill new holes in the firewall on mine but if this will help the old boy out, and keep away the embarsement of a dead car its worth it.

Again thanks for the help