Anybody running a GERST triangulated rear suspension?

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  1. biomedtechguy

    biomedtechguy FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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    Anybody running a GERST triangulated rear suspension?
    Comments please from those who DO run any brand triangulated rear suspension.
    Thanks!
     
  2. 66Satellite47

    66Satellite47 FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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    My experience with a "triangulated" suspension is a ladder bar/wishbone style in a pure drag racing, light car application. Worked great. The GERST system sure looks very sound. Bracket location on the housing seems to be really critical. IMHO
     
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    • biomedtechguy

      biomedtechguy FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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      Thanks 66Satellite47....
      In another thread, I got a lot of cheerleaders for the CalTracks stuff, but 2 guys who are actually running the RMS StreetLynx system communicated their high regard for it and an enthusiastic recommendation for me.
      I was "all in" on the RMS StreetLynx, but after I spoke with Carl Gerst-who I met in person at the 'Nats a couple of years ago, I think his setup may offer a little more adjustability than the RMS setup, and naturally Carl is EXTREMELY knowledgeable.
      So whenever the rear suspension system makes it to the top of "the list" and my funds are available, GERST it is!
      I am definitely doing the rear suspension before the stroker motor unless I break the motor I have now. Gotta be able to hook first, or a stroker+NO2 motor will just smoke and slide deeper down the track.
      Anybody else running a GERST triangulated rear suspension??
      Other brand??
       
    • Hemirunner

      Hemirunner Well-Known Member

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      There’s a triangulated 4-link under every mustang from 1982 on. The design is nothing new or revolutionary but adapting it to our mopars have opened up options we didn’t have before. Couple it with a really nice pair of double adjustable coil over shocks and you’ve got a great suspension.
       
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      • Budnicks

        Budnicks Sir Posts A lot FBBO Gold Member

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        @bobtile has a Gerst Front Chassis Components
        in his 9 sec. 67 Barracuda
        not sure what brand he has out back

        Gerst rear tri-4 link system {looks a lot like the Ridetech to me}
        this is the Gerst GTS Rear below
        $1845-$2295

        Suspension Gerst Rear tri-4 link QT4A9151 $1845-$2295.jpg

        Ride tech is another
        the Pro-Touring guys rave about them
        not as racy maybe, looks a lot like the same deal to me
        but easily street-able & street/strip worthy
        $1400 for a B-body without shocks
        there's other or adjt. ends optional IIRC
        Ride Tech bolt on 4-link.jpg

        ridetech 2" adj. coil overs , there's better out there too
        RideTech Coilovers 2in springs 125#-800# rating w-Adj. shocks.jpg

        or the Shockwave air-suspension, not my 1st choice
        the complete kit, it ain't cheap either $5200 for front & rear kit
        with the Shockwave air-shocks/bags are pricey,
        so are the tank & valves IMO
        the rest is reasonable priced, if you do different coil-overs

        ---------------------------------------------------------------

        Disclaimer;
        I don't & haven't run either
        {I know a few people that did the RideTech}
        only a little welding, 4 tabs on the rear axle housing {just like Gerst}
        the rest is a mostly bolt on deal
        it lowers the car like an 1" IIRC

        most all the short upper 4-link, triangulated bars
        aren't as good as a real 4-link suspension
        {read the short Chris Alston piece in the link}
        but far less cutting, welding & fabrication necessary,
        let alone real world track worthy adjustability

        the big advantage to the triangulated 4 bar/4 link
        {GM & Ford style}
        is no Panard Bar/Track bar or Watts Linkage {best for handling},
        that controls side to side movements

        -------------------------------------------------------

        Magnum Force & Chris Alston both make
        short upper bar style of 4 links too

        Chris Alston Chassisworks
        {Generic Universal type kit for a GM I'm sure}

        here's a great explanation of how each system works
        by someone that knows exactly what they are talking about
        I'd listen too & heed his warnings & advice
        http://www.cachassisworks.com/stories/techcac-003_web.pdf

        short upper bars kit,
        so you don't have as much cutting, fab or seat clearance etc.
        again not ideal, still a lot of work, cutting welding fab skills etc.

        Chris Alston Chassisworks dse 4 link.jpg

        or Ladder bars & coil-overs, panard bar/track bar or watts linkage
        X track bar shown
        Less cutting & welding involved, than a real 4 link set up
        less floor or seat problems
        quite a bit of welding still, but not very expensive
        Lots of racers still use a tried & true double adj. ladder bar
        with great success
        {spherical rod ends won't last long on the street 'usually',
        albeit I've driven many miles on them, not 50k or something like that,
        more like 10k-12k & check them very well & often, or you may regret it}

        Chris Alston Chassisworks adj. Ladder-bars.jpg

        Magnum Force Racing Pro-Link

        Magnumforce Racing Mopar A-B-E body Prolink 4 link coil over bolt in suspension.jpg

        Art Morrison Universal type, with a watts linkage
        lots of fab & welding needed
        {GM Camaro probably in photo} can be adapted easily,
        if you have the skills, they may even make a B-Body kit
        you'd have to check

        Suspension Art Morrison Camaro sub rear frame.jpg

        QuarterMax RJ Extreme
        real truly mega adjustable 4 link mount kit generic/universal
        again lots of fab skills & welding involved
        like all chassis builder do they make the adj. 4 bars themselves

        Suspension Quarter-Max RJ Extreme 4 link system.jpg

        Competition Engineering 'real' 4 link universal kit,
        like $225, lots of fab skills needed

        Competition Engineering 4-Link $270 C2017_part.jpg

        my last RR had Calvert/CalTracs
        they work well too, easy peasy install
        went 8.58 @ 156, with double adj. Rancho's latter Qa1's
        sometime the easiest isn't a bad idea
        I'm not saying don't use a 4 link either, but to each their own...
        I've debated on going to the RideTech 4 link myself, recently,
        If I went to a Strange Dana S-60, latter...

        I just recently in the past couple years even heard of Gerst Suspensions...
        @bobtile is really why
        I'm not knocking them, I just don't know them...

        IMO a 4 link is better, if it's a real true 4 link
        & you know what you're doing adjusting them
        the tri-4 link are OK but not ideal, nowhere near as adj.
        but once you get it dialed in you really don't need much adj.
        just a flat or turn here or there unless it's really bad track
        or you have a bad rear steer problem,
        or a huge difference in rollout side to side
        just no panard bar/diagonal trackbar

        -----------------------------------------------------

        a Ladder bar is an easier fit, for a real racecar setup
        if you don't have the fab skills, grinding, cutting & welding is required...

        Suspension Panhard bar.jpg
         
        Last edited: Jul 13, 2018
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        • 66Satellite47

          66Satellite47 FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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          Thanks Budnicks, a really comprehensive look at many of the variety's out there. I am reminded that it is so critical to decide what the "majority" application/use is. The drag racing stuff may not work very well at all on the street(for very long).
           
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          • dvw

            dvw FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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            What is the advantage of using the Gerst?
            Doug
             
          • conv67bdere

            conv67bdere Super Moderator Staff Member FBBO Gold Member

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            Bio . . . I've been half considering the 4-link application . . . but looking at the setup . . .

            suspension-gerst-rear-tri-4-link-qt4a9151-1845-2295-jpg.jpg

            You'll have the full weight of the car sitting on the coil over springs/shocks the whole time ? ?
            This would seem ( to me ) to be a bit of a short coming of the set-up . . . and potentially a single point of failure ? ?

            Am I over-simplifying this and over thinking it ? ? Just my thoughts - ( don't beat me up too much for asking a question . . . )

            Thanks
             
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            • 66Satellite47

              66Satellite47 FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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              BIO, that's how a coil over suspension works. The coil is the spring, is just like the leaf spring. Coil overs have the advantage of easy adjustability to make suspension changes.
               
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              • biomedtechguy

                biomedtechguy FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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                Budnicks, thanks for the thorough analysis!
                Thanks to all who replied!
                Carl GERST was very helpful in answering my questions and his setup for the rear triangulated suspension (according to him) is a little more adjustable than the RMS, and a little less costly.
                I want the best range of adjustments so I can get it dialed in right.
                Budnicks, I understand your preference for the function of a "true" parallel 4 link, but according to Carl Gerst and a few others that is really for "track only" cars, or at least the triangulated setup is better for a street/occasional strip car, especially for ride quality and handling vs the parallel 4 link. Also the watts or panhard bar uses space where the factory gas tank is, so unless someone goes to a fuel cell in a different location (trunk) that parallel 4 link takes the car further from stock.
                If the parallel 4 link was the better choice for my application, I'd do the fuel cell, but I'm being told that the triangulated 4 link is better for my application.
                Now all I need is for my bank account to catch up with my wish list.
                :)
                 
              • Bigfoots N Mopars

                Bigfoots N Mopars Well-Known Member

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                I was looking at these options. Ultimately, how I planned to use my car narrowed my decision for me. Now that I have my stroker, transmission and in the process of building the Dana 60, i have purchased the caltrac/ split monoleaf setup. My initial thinking was to be able to run Drag Week Big Block/ no power-adder/ Stock suspension class, but after reading the 2018 class rules looks like i would be out due to mini-tubs. The Car will be getting Mini-tubbed and spring re-location next week. I see the pros and cons of each but finally just jumped in and went with initial plan. Car wont see much track time. probably going to get the boot for no cage...yet
                 
              • 66Satellite47

                66Satellite47 FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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                Bigfoot, take the plunge & get the roll bar in there now. You surely will need it to run at the track. You have the power to need one. Maybe do the full cage. You will never regret mini-tubs, bigger tires help if you travel to different tracks, plus the bigger tires look cool. Cal Trac mono leaf does seem like a straight forward approach. The Gerst stuff still does look interesting.
                 
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                • 747mopar

                  747mopar Well-Known Member

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                  Haven't ran any of them but do look at different ideas often, my biggest suggestion is to look at the details. I for one wouldn't like Heim joints for regular street driving and would steer away from anything that doesn't provide a nice solid mounting crossmember for the coil overs. There's a few members on here that are running triangulated four links and have had issues with the joints coming loose and wearing out. Adjustability is great but along with it comes the possibility of things coming loose. I really like the looks of the Magnum Force one that Budnick posted.

                  I guess what I'm saying is I don't feel like most are built to withstand years of road use and look a bit flimsy.

                  Something else I've always questioned is the geometry? I'm no expert in any way but my research seams to always show that equal length upper and lower arms are ideal seeing how it maintains a consistant pinion angle but these kits always have stubby upper arms? This leads me to believe the kits are built to be "bolt in" and not so much about being built ideally? Don't know that it's available for Mopars but I intend to built a torque arms rear for mine, very, simple, strong and a better fit for the car IMO. Check out Goon's Angrybird thread, he's having one built for his that looks pretty slick.
                   
                  Last edited: Jul 16, 2018
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                  • Bigfoots N Mopars

                    Bigfoots N Mopars Well-Known Member

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                    Thanks 66Satellite47, will look at cage option when car goes under the knife. trying to stretch my budget, but want to do things right.
                     
                  • 66Satellite47

                    66Satellite47 FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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                    Bigfoot, seems like quite a few kits out there & a number of chassis guys around to do an install. Having tubes around you is very comforting. I have experience. Stuff does happen & the tubes really do make things survivable. Budget is something you gave up long ago! Think safe.
                     
                  • dvw

                    dvw FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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                    Why not just run leaf springs? For 99% of the cars here they're cheap and get the job done. For a dedicated drag car ladder bars would be the choice. But for street/strip/auto cross you have to have a pretty sophisticated car to see enough of an improvement to make a difference. Same goes for the front suspension. I'd spend my money on high end shocks and brakes, good sway bars or Cal Tracks depending on intended usage. Especially if it's a bolt on system . Just my 2 cents.
                    Doug
                     
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                    • 5.7 hemi

                      5.7 hemi FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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                      Assasin traction bars. They have a ton more adjustment than the Cal’s do.
                       
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                      • biomedtechguy

                        biomedtechguy FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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                      • 5.7 hemi

                        5.7 hemi FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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                        Thems the ones!! I have them and damn to they make the car plant!
                         
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                        • 66Satellite47

                          66Satellite47 FBBO Gold Member FBBO Gold Member

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                          It's great to have a part/combination that works well. What spring are you using? How much work did it take to find the right adjustment? From years ago, the difficulty with with 4 link stuff was finding the proper adjustment. The Assasin setup seems to have a ton of adjustability, but how to get it right. I was really lucky my chassis builder told me the ladder bar adjustment, they were perfect. Too much options could get a person far astray.
                           
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