Coil spring (spiral) in a 1971 Dodge

[JGOMEZV]

I was surprised today when a 1971 Dodge Dart with a K-member arrived and what I saw was a coil spring underneath. I was surprised. The owner of the vehicle told me that its ride is very smooth and the alignment is correct. He tells me that's all that was modified; it still has its original rubber bushings and the car can handle the weight. If this is possible, please let me know. I want to adapt it to a Dodge Coronet Station Wagon 1971 CustomBecause it reduces its weight distribution when gripping, it becomes negatively balanced, and the hubs are fine. But I want comfort and a smooth ride. It doesn't get stiffer, it gets softer; the spiral determines the position, and the torsion bar doesn't exert as much force. Obviously, the lower arm has to be reinforced. Here's a photo. Please tell me your opinion. I'm from Venezuela and I love the Mopar world, but the industry that designs bushings, replacement parts, etc., is awful. My lower bushings are imported Moogs.

 

[Kern Dog]

Don't do this.

The area where that coil spring is (in your picture) was not designed to take the additional load. The torsion bar cars were designed to transfer spring loads from the control arm to the torsion bar crossmember that runs across the car underneath the front seat. These cars were designed a certain way to be strong yet as light as they could be made to save weight and money. The frame rails where the shock absorbers are was designed to handle the stresses of dampening suspension movement but not to support the car.
You can reinforce the frame but a much better way to go if you want additional front stiffness is bigger torsion bars.

 

[Geoff 2]

^^^^ This. Plus, you have added unsprung weight with the coil spring, which is never good for handling.

 

[JGOMEZV]

Don't do this.

The area where that coil spring is (in your picture) was not designed to take the additional load. The torsion bar cars were designed to transfer spring loads from the control arm to the torsion bar crossmember that runs across the car underneath the front seat. These cars were designed a certain way to be strong yet as light as they could be made to save weight and money. The frame rails where the shock absorbers are was designed to handle the stresses of dampening suspension movement but not to support the car.
You can reinforce the frame but a much better way to go if you want additional front stiffness is bigger torsion bars.

The vehicle in the photo has torsion bars, the lower arm is well reinforced and gives it an incredible, even height; the car has had this modification for years. And it's doing very well in its daily use because if the modification were bad it would always be parked due to problems with the front suspension, but it lives its day-to-day life.

 

[Kern Dog]

It isn't the lower control arm that is the issue. The other end of the spring transmits force to an area that was not designed to carry the load.
My cars don't have that weird stuff done to them and they all look and function correctly.

 

[JGOMEZV]

^^^^ This. Plus, you have added unsprung weight with the coil spring, which is never good for handling.

You see the vehicle, you get in it, you drive it and believe me, the driving is wonderful

 

[JGOMEZV]

It isn't the lower control arm that is the issue. The other end of the spring transmits force to an area that was not designed to carry the load.
My cars don't have that weird stuff done to them and they all look and function correctly.

Obviously, the area where the upper end of the spring is located is reinforced to withstand the spring's force; that's what I saw when I was underneath the car.

 

[Kern Dog]

Don't ask for opinions then argue when opinions and facts are given. It will not serve you well.

 

[JGOMEZV]

Don't ask for opinions then argue when opinions and facts are given. It will not serve you well.

All opinions are welcome, I'm not arguing, but I'd like to know more and get more advice on what to do to improve the suspension of my wagon.

 

[Photon440]

You said that the driving is wonderful.. What improvements are you hoping for?

 

[Kern Dog]

Experts in the Mopar community will argue the merits of the torsion bar suspension. I'm one that trusts the original design yet understands that there is room for improvement.
What I have done has been done by many others before me. Chassis reinforcements, bigger torsion bars, sway bars, better shocks, stiffer bushings, better steering boxes, etc.
Here in the States, if someone rolled into a shop with a car that was modified like the one you posted, we'd think he was an idiot.
Don't repeat what that guy did.
To repeat, get bigger torsion bars and a good set of shocks. The stock equipment was okay when new but these cars do benefit from increases in spring rate to give a firmer ride and better handling.

 

[JGOMEZV]

You said that the driving is wonderful.. What improvements are you hoping for?

My Dodge feels very stiff just as it is stock; it's hard. I've seen other Mopars here that are soft in the front, and I don't understand.

 

[Kern Dog]

Shocks, man.
Avoid the KYB Gas-A-Just shocks.
If Bilstein shocks are available, you'd be wise to consider them. I have big torsion bars and the Bilstein shocks in this car:

The car rides fine and handles quite well. There is an American company known as Firm Feel Inc. they sell a version of the Bilstein shocks that will work.

 

[JGOMEZV]

Experts in the Mopar community will argue the merits of the torsion bar suspension. I'm one that trusts the original design yet understands that there is room for improvement.
What I have done has been done by many others before me. Chassis reinforcements, bigger torsion bars, sway bars, better shocks, stiffer bushings, better steering boxes, etc.
Here in the States, if someone rolled into a shop with a car that was modified like the one you posted, we'd think he was an idiot.
Don't repeat what that guy did.
To repeat, get bigger torsion bars and a good set of shocks. The stock equipment was okay when new but these cars do benefit from increases in spring rate to give a firmer ride and better handling.

Obviously, it's the birthplace of Mopars U.S.A. Here in Venezuela, many detest them because of their front suspension, but enthusiasts like me love the original, and there's a reason it was designed that way. The front suspension feels very stiff; the bushings are fine, they're not bad. That's what I don't understand, and I think the alignment tool is setting parameters for bias-ply tires.

 

[JGOMEZV]

Shocks, man.
Avoid the KYB Gas-A-Just shocks.
If Bilstein shocks are available, you'd be wise to consider them. I have big torsion bars and the Bilstein shocks in this car:

View attachment 1939600

The car rides fine and handles quite well. There is an American company known as Firm Feel Inc. they sell a version of the Bilstein shocks that will work.

Beautiful, I think she has Monroe shock absorbers installed, that's probably why; they're very stiff and don't provide a smooth ride.

 

[Kern Dog]

The Monroes are usually a decent shock. Not great for racing but okay for general use. They should be a smooth operating shock absorber.
It is hard to diagnose your issue from thousands of miles away, if you were in front of me I could better help.
Is the ride too stiff? Does the car rattle when you hit bumps in the road?
Wheel alignment does matter but should not affect the way the suspension operates as far as stiffness.
When you press down on the front of the car, does the car move up and down?
Mine barely does but then...I have really large torsion bars on the red car.
My other cars here have torsion bars bigger than stock but even those ride firm, the way that I like it.

 

[JGOMEZV]

The Monroes are usually a decent shock. Not great for racing but okay for general use. They should be a smooth operating shock absorber.
It is hard to diagnose your issue from thousands of miles away, if you were in front of me I could better help.
Is the ride too stiff? Does the car rattle when you hit bumps in the road?
Wheel alignment does matter but should not affect the way the suspension operates as far as stiffness.
When you press down on the front of the car, does the car move up and down?
Mine barely does but then...I have really large torsion bars on the red car.
My other cars here have torsion bars bigger than stock but even those ride firm, the way that I like it.

Going over a bump is too harsh, even a small one; however, when you try to raise and lower the suspension from the fender, it works fine, going up and down normally. But even going over a small bump makes a big difference.

 

[Geoff 2]

Car is 'stiff' because the coil springs have added to the spring rate. Probably feels like a truck. Remove the springs & enjoy the softer ride....

 

[Kern Dog]

The OP is discussing two different cars.
The one with the coil spring in it is someone else's car. the Op says he has a Station Wagon and is considering this modification.

I was surprised today when a 1971 Dodge Dart with a K-member arrived and what I saw was a coil spring underneath.

I want to adapt it to a Dodge Coronet Station Wagon 1971 CustomBecause it reduces its weight distribution when gripping, it becomes negatively balanced, and the hubs are fine. But I want comfort and a smooth ride. It doesn't get stiffer, it gets softer; the spiral determines the position, and the torsion bar doesn't exert as much force. Obviously, the lower arm has to be reinforced. Here's a photo. Please tell me your opinion. I'm from Venezuela and I love the Mopar world, but the industry that designs bushings, replacement parts, etc., is awful. My lower bushings are imported Moogs.

 

[JR_Charger]

QA1's coil spring k-member for Darts and B-bodies has a tower for the coil spring built into it. Well, at least it does in the pictures on their website - may not be actual product?