Cost for a transmission swap from a manual to automatic

[vso737]

Hi,

Can anyone give me a fair hourly estimate that a professional automotive shop should charge to swap out a manual 4 speed in a '69 RR and replace it with a Torquelite 727 automatic.

How many hours should an HONEST mechanic in California charge in labor hours. (is this an oxymoron..........California and HONEST mechanic...........LOL)

How about removing and reinstalling the rear end third member on a SURE GRIP rear axle on the same car ???

Thanks a bunch,

LG,
Mike

 

[Burns69RT]

First off why would you take out the 4-speed from a rr? That's definitely devaluing the car. And you will have to cut out the 4 speed trans hump. And weld in a trans tunnel patch for and auto. Idk if you want column or floor shift. Where in Cali are you located? I know a good handful of hotrod shops in Southern California that are fair and do good work. I wouldn't just take it to any mechanic. Hotrod shops are good cause they cut and weld pans in on the daily and know how to properly do it. Also there's a great rear end guy in Huntington Beach right by classic industries he's an Aussie. And a huge Camaro guy. But I'd trust him with any rear end.

 

[WP29440SE]

well , you will need a radiator for an automatic. you will have to rig a shifter. I swapped out my 3 speed manual for an auto in less than 3 hours , but I also had all the parts ready to go. I did not have to change the yoke or mess with the mount or drive shaft. you will also need a flexplate , lines , kick down ETC. I would never pay anyone to do this, its a piece of cake. I made a plate to go over the shifter hole on the hump and mounted the shifter to that. I had to made a rod to go from the shifter to the trans, but you could use a cable. make sure you match the converter/flexplate to the crank if it is externally balanced.

 

[vso737]

well , you will need a radiator for an automatic. you will have to rig a shifter. I swapped out my 3 speed manual for an auto in less than 3 hours , but I also had all the parts ready to go. I did not have to change the yoke or mess with the mount or drive shaft. you will also need a flexplate , lines , kick down ETC. I would never pay anyone to do this, its a piece of cake. I made a plate to go over the shifter hole on the hump and mounted the shifter to that. I had to made a rod to go from the shifter to the trans, but you could use a cable. make sure you match the converter/flexplate to the crank if it is externally balanced.

________________________________________--

First of all, MANY THANKS for the quick reply.

I just got burned out on transmission work having to take out my GM 4L60 on my '30 Model A hot rod two times in a week. I have a two car garage and do all the work on the floor.

The shop ended up taking it out two times as well but they have a lift and all the experience. It took this shop four tries before he got it right and the owner has had this transmission shop for over 40 years and that is all he does.

NOW, with this jewel. This is the FIRST "MOPAR" I have ever owned and the '69 RR is my favorite car of all time and I have had a few cars in the 68 years on this planet.
SOOO, I decided to have a local "HOT ROD SHOP"..............if you haven't guessed yet, the BIGGEST CROOK I have ever encountered. I just filed a complaint with "BAR" and will most likely do the same with SMALL CLAIMS COURT..........this guy is giving mechanics a bad name. His biggest mistake is picking on someone who spent his entire working career putting CROOKS behind bars. LOL

I purchased all my material from Summit Racing. I purposely even purchased the ATF that "TCI" sells to make everything as easy and smooth a swap as possible.
I purchased the TCI 727 Street Fighter; fill tube; trans cooler; B &M Quick silver floor shifter; kickdown cable; carburetor brackets.........the ONLY thing I did NOT furnish are the hard lines for the trans cooler.

The swap was completed in less than 5 hours total. The drive shaft DID NOT need any modification nor did anything else. The original yolk worked just fine. The four speed was on the floor so it made things even easier. The mechanic ONLY had trouble removing the clutch pedal from inside the car. (SO he says..............)

I would still like to get an intelligent guess of how many hours I should be charged for this swap.

Thanks a bunch,
LG,
Mike

 

[vso737]

First off why would you take out the 4-speed from a rr? That's definitely devaluing the car. And you will have to cut out the 4 speed trans hump. And weld in a trans tunnel patch for and auto. Idk if you want column or floor shift. Where in Cali are you located? I know a good handful of hot-rod shops in Southern California that are fair and do good work. I wouldn't just take it to any mechanic. Hot-rod shops are good cause they cut and weld pans in on the daily and know how to properly do it. Also there's a great rear end guy in Huntington Beach right by classic industries he's an Aussie. And a huge Camaro guy. But I'd trust him with any rear end.

SO my GIRLY wife can drive it. This car is NOT a completely restored to specs RR................"I have been there, done that" when I spent 8 ½ years restoring a 1957 Corvette completely back to "NCRS" standards. Took TOP FLIGHT first time up and swore I will NEVER do that again. The car is now living the "life of Riley" in Nice, France.

My favorite car of all time and since 1969, when it won Mortor-craft car of the year award, is the 1969 RR. I could have purchased one years ago for a 'song and a dance'. I finally bought one and I never plan on getting rid of it.

 

[WP29440SE]

________________________________________--

First of all, MANY THANKS for the quick reply.

I just got burned out on transmission work having to take out my GM 4L60 on my '30 Model A hot rod two times in a week. I have a two car garage and do all the work on the floor.

The shop ended up taking it out two times as well but they have a lift and all the experience. It took this shop four tries before he got it right and the owner has had this transmission shop for over 40 years and that is all he does.

NOW, with this jewel. This is the FIRST "MOPAR" I have ever owned and the '69 RR is my favorite car of all time and I have had a few cars in the 68 years on this planet.
SOOO, I decided to have a local "HOT ROD SHOP"..............if you haven't guessed yet, the BIGGEST CROOK I have ever encountered. I just filed a complaint with "BAR" and will most likely do the same with SMALL CLAIMS COURT..........this guy is giving mechanics a bad name. His biggest mistake is picking on someone who spent his entire working career putting CROOKS behind bars. LOL

I purchased all my material from Summit Racing. I purposely even purchased the ATF that "TCI" sells to make everything as easy and smooth a swap as possible.
I purchased the TCI 727 Street Fighter; fill tube; trans cooler; B &M Quick silver floor shifter; kickdown cable; carburetor brackets.........the ONLY thing I did NOT furnish are the hard lines for the trans cooler.

The swap was completed in less than 5 hours total. The drive shaft DID NOT need any modification nor did anything else. The original yolk worked just fine. The four speed was on the floor so it made things even easier. The mechanic ONLY had trouble removing the clutch pedal from inside the car. (SO he says..............)

I would still like to get an intelligent guess of how many hours I should be charged for this swap.

Thanks a bunch,
LG,
Mike

sorry to hear of your troubles,
I used my brake pedal as is and did not have to remove the clutch pedal, in fact I wanted it to stay right there in case I go back to a manual. I do not work on cars for a living , but I have been doing it most of my life. I just dropped a 727 out of my charger and had a new one waiting to go in. I started around 8 AM and fired it up at 3 PM and took it around the block. there really is not much to it , and I have headers to work around plus a few breaks in between. any one familiar with these old mopars should not have to spend more than an 8 hour shift to get it done.
it doesn't take all that long to mount a shifter and trans cooler.

 

[vso737]

sorry to hear of your troubles,
I used my brake pedal as is and did not have to remove the clutch pedal, in fact I wanted it to stay right there in case I go back to a manual. I do not work on cars for a living , but I have been doing it most of my life. I just dropped a 727 out of my charger and had a new one waiting to go in. I started around 8 AM and fired it up at 3 PM and took it around the block. there really is not much to it , and I have headers to work around plus a few breaks in between. any one familiar with these old mopars should not have to spend more than an 8 hour shift to get it done.
it doesn't take all that long to mount a shifter and trans cooler.

GOOD THING you decided to leave the clutch pedal in the car. My "CROOK", a professional HOT ROD owner/mechanic that does this for a LIVING.............charged me 6 hours LABOR! That would mean to me that "week end" mechanics like us would take at least 10 hours to do the job. LOL

 

[coloradodave]

Mike,
Do you know that in California, any legitimate shop doing automotive work has to give you an estimate for the work to be done, including parts, labor and tax, and have you sign it before any work commences? Then, if there are any hang-ups that will add more money on, they have to call you and get an OK, noting the time and date they talked to you, before proceeding. If they fail to give you a written estimate or get an OK for any extra work, you are within your rights to dispute the amount with the Bureau of Automotive Repair (BAR). I noticed in your post that you had contacted them. My experience with the BAR has been remarkable. They take their job seriously and come down hard on shops that don't follow the law. Their authority can shut down businesses that don't comply, so smart shop owners 'go by the book' when taking in work. I don't know how your situation came about (a little confusing to me) but I hope you get it resolved to your satisfaction.

 

[vso737]

Mike,
Do you know that in California, any legitimate shop doing automotive work has to give you an estimate for the work to be done, including parts, labor and tax, and have you sign it before any work commences? Then, if there are any hang-ups that will add more money on, they have to call you and get an OK, noting the time and date they talked to you, before proceeding. If they fail to give you a written estimate or get an OK for any extra work, you are within your rights to dispute the amount with the Bureau of Automotive Repair (BAR). I noticed in your post that you had contacted them. My experience with the BAR has been remarkable. They take their job seriously and come down hard on shops that don't follow the law. Their authority can shut down businesses that don't comply, so smart shop owners 'go by the book' when taking in work. I don't know how your situation came about (a little confusing to me) but I hope you get it resolved to your satisfaction.

YES............I should have known better. I now know exactly what you are talking about, in fact, I filed a complaint with "BAR" last Thursday, the day after getting the car home. They take 7-10 days to contact me and I have an 11 page chronological sequence of events and all the documents ready for the investigator.
This is such a flagrant abuse, that I feel this guy should actually be criminally charged as far as I'm concerned. I don't understand how he can be licensed by "BAR" and do these type of dealings.
Once this case is over, I will share the results and really get into the nitti gritty of the scam. If nothing else, to keep some other easy going old fool like me from falling for the same thing.

Thanks a bunch for your input,
LG,
Mike

 

[Danomt]

GOOD THING you decided to leave the clutch pedal in the car. My "CROOK", a professional HOT ROD owner/mechanic that does this for a LIVING.............charged me 6 hours LABOR! That would mean to me that "week end" mechanics like us would take at least 10 hours to do the job. LOL

Was the 6 hours for the entire job or to remove the clutch petal??

 

[vso737]

Was the 6 hours for the entire job or to remove the clutch petal??

The verbal agreement for the ENTIRE job was 11 hours plus incidentals such as the trans. lines. The reason for the the 11 hours, actually $1,100 estimate was because the pedal was so difficult to take out. He factored that in the 11 hours vs the 10 hours I wanted. I had a transmission shop that I recently dealt with, HONEST ONE, quote me $1,500 for the job.

He factored the 6 hours on the final day, 7th day of the 2-3 day original agreement, when I picked up the car. In a NUT SHELL, my 11 hour estimate turned out to be a 43.5 hour final bill. TO add "salt on the wound", when I complained that these 43.5 hours were a long ways from the original 11 hour quote, he stated, "Is that what I quoted you??
That statement, to me, confirmed he's a CROOK and he reeled me in from the start.

LG,
Mike

 

[Danomt]

Chilton calls for 5.5 hours to r and r an automatic trans, Maybe an hour more because of flywheel to flexplate conversion. An hour most for the the throttle linkage, an hour more for the petal removal. Maybe two three hours more for trans lines and shift linkage. So 11 hours seems about normal for labor. I would figure about a day and a half if all the right parts were there..... Its the little things on these deals that can kick your butt. cooler line brackets, the correct kickdown linkage and a carb that is set up for it.. Exhaust that crosses over under the trans (h-pipes) 11 hours is in the ball park, 43 is way out of line.. I would have to see the labor breakdown on that one.
DanO
Pro wrench for 45 years,
my own shop since 1977, still active

 

[vso737]

Mike,
Do you know that in California, any legitimate shop doing automotive work has to give you an estimate for the work to be done, including parts, labor and tax, and have you sign it before any work commences? Then, if there are any hang-ups that will add more money on, they have to call you and get an OK, noting the time and date they talked to you, before proceeding. If they fail to give you a written estimate or get an OK for any extra work, you are within your rights to dispute the amount with the Bureau of Automotive Repair (BAR). I noticed in your post that you had contacted them. My experience with the BAR has been remarkable. They take their job seriously and come down hard on shops that don't follow the law. Their authority can shut down businesses that don't comply, so smart shop owners 'go by the book' when taking in work. I don't know how your situation came about (a little confusing to me) but I hope you get it resolved to your satisfaction.

__________________________________________________________

I have a feeling MY CROOK has had "BAR" contact in the past or maybe he wants to keep a clean SHEET so he can CONTINUE to pull off these scams.

I had a feeling MY CROOK was going to pay me a visit at a car show I was at yesterday. Well, my premonition was 100% accurate, the same way I felt something was not right before I picked up the car.

The CROOK and I assume his wife behind him, approached me while I was standing next to my car like NOTHING had ever happened and he was my buddy. He said, "the '69 RR should be parked here", pointing to my Model A hot rod. His wife could tell that I was NOT in a friendly mood and walked away soon after the conversation started. I immediately told him that as far as the RR, that I had LUBE leaking all over my garage floor and the carrier nuts were all loose and still had a transmission leak which I have yet to identify the source. Of course he continues with his BS of how he stands behind his work and that I should have taken the car back to him and get it fixed, etc, etc, To which I replied, "you will NEVER see my car again" and that I contacted "BAR" and filed a formal complaint. BOY, his eyes really lid up and he was MAD. He went on to say that he was more than willing to work with me on the bill ...........I told him that he had the opportunity and all that he could come up with is, "is that what I quoted you". He then went on to say that he would have worked with me and how sorry he was that I felt that way and now, since I reported him to "BAR", I missed the chance and will see him in court.

The entire scenario should made it uncomfortable for the families showing their cars that were sitting next to me...................I doubt if any of them will be visiting his shop anytime soon after I apprised them of the entire situation.
Still waiting for the "BAR" investigator to contact me....................
Can't wait to get this matter resolved and for this CROOK to get what's coming to him..............

Hope these entries will keep someone else from having to go through something like this. Must be a reason why California instituted the "Bureau of Automotive Repair" in 1974.

I'M SET FOR LIFE. THE HOT ROD I HAVE ALWAYS WANTED TO COMPLETELY BUILD ALL BY MYSELF- AND MY "FAVORITE" CAR OF ALL TIME, THE 1969 PLYMOUTH ROADRUNNER!



THE ONLY OTHER CLASSIC CAR I WOULD EVER CONSIDER OWNING, IS THE 1958 CORVETTE LIKE THE ONE I DROVE IN HIGH SCHOOL. WOULD HAVE TO HAVE AT LEAST A 3 CAR GARAGE BEFORE THAT COULD EVER HAPPEN AND ALSO WIN THE LOTTERY. LOL


LG,
Mike

 

[vso737]

DONE DEAL. ISSUE RESOLVED.

Ended up paying for 20 hours total labor. That is a LONG ways from the 43.5.................

With an honest business, 15 hours and at the very most 18 hours should be the fair labor charge for what was done.

I felt generous and told the "BAR" investigator that I could live with a 20 hour charge.

The ONLY good thing about the entire ordeal is that this business is now under the "BAR" radar and will hopefully adhere to honest business practices from now on.

LG,
Mike

 

[66Satellite47]

Glad you got some resolution. My guess at the level of effort would have been 10 - 15 hours given that you are using an aftermarket shifter. The shifter mounting would seem like the only complicated thing. Not sure what would have been complicated about pulling the clutch pedal, but it's been a long time since I've done that swap. Your Runner looks GREAT, enjoy.

 

[slepr1]

How can crooks like that sleep at night? I've been burned a couple times and can honestly say I've never burned anyone. Its good to see some don't get away with it.

 

[vso737]

Glad you got some resolution. My guess at the level of effort would have been 10 - 15 hours given that you are using an aftermarket shifter. The shifter mounting would seem like the only complicated thing. Not sure what would have been complicated about pulling the clutch pedal, but it's been a long time since I've done that swap. Your Runner looks GREAT, enjoy.

___________________________________________________

The shifter I furnished is the "B & M" Quick Silver manual/automatic which is CABLE driven. All the 'crook' did is install it over the hole the four speed shifter used. NO linkage involved...............

Still NEVER received any explanation how he went from an 11 hour estimate to 43.5 hours.
Glad this ordeal is over. NOW I can go on with enjoying my jewel.

Yesterday was my 3 month anniversary of being the proud owner. I have taken care of the few things I wanted to do. I installed matching side mirrors; built a pod for two gauges and installed a water and oil gauge where the ashtray used to be. I replaced the horn with the RR horn and replaced the seat track springs so the bench seat quit popping out of the lock position.
I also installed a 'kill' switch and battery charging wires for my 'battery minder'.
The ONLY other thing I want to do for now is have the 'Hooker' headers ceramic coated in order to cut down the heat in the engine compartment.
LG,
Mike